Lifestyle > Train of Thought
Stephen Hawking says the universe created itself
C-BLUE:
--- Quote from: rapsodie sees the elano in you on October 20, 2010, 02:20:03 AM ---
--- Quote from: rapsodie sees the elano in you on October 19, 2010, 06:39:39 PM ---
--- Quote from: QuietTruth on October 19, 2010, 06:10:15 PM ---If He exists outside time and space, as we know it, how does he have to be created? How do we know there isn't somethang bigger than Space??
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So.....if you don't feel its necessary for this god to be created by something, then why do you think its necessary for the universe to be created by something? My point being, you feel so compelled to come up a creator, but you completely ignore the creation of the creator. It seems a waste of time because you aren't really answering the question of how things came to be.
You laugh at the idea that the universe created itself. But now you're saying that God created itself? Just replace God with Universe and you'd be saying the same thing.
--- End quote ---
QT you plan on offering a response to this?
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I've tried this with him, but he's never said god created himself. I think he's more comfortable with the idea that god's ways are above our understanding. To him, god is above space and time. He'll respond, but he's gonna need to prepare first.
--- Quote from: Fraxxx on October 20, 2010, 09:24:26 AM ---
--- Quote from: QuietTruth on October 19, 2010, 09:55:11 AM ---I was waiting for somebody to post this. Waiting.
If there wasn't a Creator why would there be death?
If there wasn't a Creator why does everythang happen to work on time?
So now after some valid thoughts...
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No way I'm gonna get sucked into this bullshit again, just this: Anybody who thinks these were valid thoughts should look for a legal guardian. Should come in handy in the long run.
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You could say that again, but he's never gonna hear you. To him, these thoughts are as rational as 2+2 equals 4. I'm actually beginning to feel sorry for him.
Anunikke:
--- Quote from: Anunikke on October 19, 2010, 04:26:32 PM ---Is any body else starting to think QT left to research the subject and not sound like an idiot talking about the wind?
--- End quote ---
NObody else
Triple OG Rapsodie:
--- Quote from: C-BLUE on October 20, 2010, 11:08:00 AM ---
--- Quote from: rapsodie sees the elano in you on October 20, 2010, 02:20:03 AM ---
--- Quote from: rapsodie sees the elano in you on October 19, 2010, 06:39:39 PM ---
--- Quote from: QuietTruth on October 19, 2010, 06:10:15 PM ---If He exists outside time and space, as we know it, how does he have to be created? How do we know there isn't somethang bigger than Space??
--- End quote ---
So.....if you don't feel its necessary for this god to be created by something, then why do you think its necessary for the universe to be created by something? My point being, you feel so compelled to come up a creator, but you completely ignore the creation of the creator. It seems a waste of time because you aren't really answering the question of how things came to be.
You laugh at the idea that the universe created itself. But now you're saying that God created itself? Just replace God with Universe and you'd be saying the same thing.
--- End quote ---
QT you plan on offering a response to this?
--- End quote ---
I've tried this with him, but he's never said god created himself. I think he's more comfortable with the idea that god's ways are above our understanding. To him, god is above space and time. He'll respond, but he's gonna need to prepare first.
--- End quote ---
That's what I think, but then he might as well just say the universe is above our understanding. Bringing in a god doesn't actually answer any questions.
Teddy Roosevelt:
--- Quote from: rapsodie sees the elano in you on October 20, 2010, 02:10:37 AM ---
--- Quote from: Teddy Roosevelt on October 19, 2010, 07:00:49 PM ---How is saying the Universe created itself any different then saying God created the Universe? They are both "something out of nothing" theories.
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The only difference is that we actually know the universe exists. Why bother involving an invisible and mystical all-powerful entity?
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Because we are not debating that the universe exists, we are debating how it was created. Hawking provides no proof for his universe created itself theory (which violates the conservation of mass principle). Therefore I can't accept it because it has the same flaw as creationism: no evidence.
Triple OG Rapsodie:
--- Quote from: Teddy Roosevelt on October 20, 2010, 12:14:03 PM ---
--- Quote from: rapsodie sees the elano in you on October 20, 2010, 02:10:37 AM ---
--- Quote from: Teddy Roosevelt on October 19, 2010, 07:00:49 PM ---How is saying the Universe created itself any different then saying God created the Universe? They are both "something out of nothing" theories.
--- End quote ---
The only difference is that we actually know the universe exists. Why bother involving an invisible and mystical all-powerful entity?
--- End quote ---
Because we are not debating that the universe exists, we are debating how it was created. Hawking provides no proof for his universe created itself theory (which violates the conservation of mass principle). Therefore I can't accept it because it has the same flaw as creationism: no evidence.
--- End quote ---
There's no proof for any of this. Since we have no evidence, all of this is speculation. However, there is clearly a difference between Hawking making up some theory and an all-powerful divine being. We know the universe exists.
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