watch the mayweather fight free

[Sir Petey]

crazy how NO ONE mentions mayweather vs paquio these days

[Sccit]

pacquiao took himself out the game by losing the way he did.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

pacquiao took himself out the game by losing the way he did.

If by "out of the game" you mean out of the running for a Mayweather fight, then yes, you are correct.

But frankly, it's not needed, and they both have enough fights left in them for it to build back up (but not quite up to what it would've been in 2010-2011) and happen.  Floyd's Showtime contract is for a few more fights, and Manny has said he still wants to fight a few more times.  So it could happen, but there are a lot of interesting fights out there for both of them.

Manny's got Rios next and will probably beat him.  I'm surprised Rios got it so quickly (and after a loss), but Manny needed an opponent ASAP and it's easy to make.  But reports are popping up of Mayweather-Guerrero having done well under a million PPV buys (which is expected since Guerrero is a nobody but it's still not good for business), and I'd bet that Pacquiao-Rios would still be an attractive PPV buy (more so than May Day was), especially since they know Manny has a lot to prove now and Rios fought his heart out in his last fight.  Even Manny's last fight was far from a snoozer on both of their parts... yes, Manny got KTFO but it was very back-and-forth before that deadly moment he dropped his guard and walked into a freight train of a punch.

But even after that, you'll likely see Manny wanting to go at the winner of Marquez-Bradley, avenging whichever one of his losses.  But Marquez wants the fucking moon to agree to a rematch, even though he swears up and down that he doesn't care to fight Manny.  But I personally think he owes it to Manny, plus you know he's still fighting just to get a fat retirement check... and it's not going to be what he's getting for fighting Bradley.  It's in his plans.

Obviously Mayweather-Canelo is 95% going to happen next, but after that, I'd rather see him fight Sergio Martinez, who should be able to come down to 154.  But I'd rather not see him fight Amir Khan.  It's going to be even more one-sided, plus I don't get why people say that Manny is out of the running because he lost some (and got knocked out), yet Amir Khan also had two back-to-back losses (ironically a SD loss and a TKO loss, kind of like Manny) but he's supposed to be a good opponent?  Amir Khan has never really been a threat.  Quick hands, not much power behind them.  And he's not really all that marketable, but I'll lose even more respect for Floyd if he bothers to go after Khan.  Even Devon Alexander needs some higher-profile wins before I'd want to see him lace up against Floyd.

[Sccit]

pacquiao took himself out the game by losing the way he did.

If by "out of the game" you mean out of the running for a Mayweather fight, then yes, you are correct.

But frankly, it's not needed, and they both have enough fights left in them for it to build back up (but not quite up to what it would've been in 2010-2011) and happen.  Floyd's Showtime contract is for a few more fights, and Manny has said he still wants to fight a few more times.  So it could happen, but there are a lot of interesting fights out there for both of them.

Manny's got Rios next and will probably beat him.  I'm surprised Rios got it so quickly (and after a loss), but Manny needed an opponent ASAP and it's easy to make.  But reports are popping up of Mayweather-Guerrero having done well under a million PPV buys (which is expected since Guerrero is a nobody but it's still not good for business), and I'd bet that Pacquiao-Rios would still be an attractive PPV buy (more so than May Day was), especially since they know Manny has a lot to prove now and Rios fought his heart out in his last fight.  Even Manny's last fight was far from a snoozer on both of their parts... yes, Manny got KTFO but it was very back-and-forth before that deadly moment he dropped his guard and walked into a freight train of a punch.

But even after that, you'll likely see Manny wanting to go at the winner of Marquez-Bradley, avenging whichever one of his losses.  But Marquez wants the fucking moon to agree to a rematch, even though he swears up and down that he doesn't care to fight Manny.  But I personally think he owes it to Manny, plus you know he's still fighting just to get a fat retirement check... and it's not going to be what he's getting for fighting Bradley.  It's in his plans.

Obviously Mayweather-Canelo is 95% going to happen next, but after that, I'd rather see him fight Sergio Martinez, who should be able to come down to 154.  But I'd rather not see him fight Amir Khan.  It's going to be even more one-sided, plus I don't get why people say that Manny is out of the running because he lost some (and got knocked out), yet Amir Khan also had two back-to-back losses (ironically a SD loss and a TKO loss, kind of like Manny) but he's supposed to be a good opponent?  Amir Khan has never really been a threat.  Quick hands, not much power behind them.  And he's not really all that marketable, but I'll lose even more respect for Floyd if he bothers to go after Khan.  Even Devon Alexander needs some higher-profile wins before I'd want to see him lace up against Floyd.

even if it happens, the interest has really died down drastically. both fighters were on a winning streak a couple year back...now that pac-man lost to some1 floyd was able to beat easily, peeps have mayweather as the heavy favorite.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

But Floyd has ALWAYS been the favorite.  If Manny fought Floyd last weekend instead, even after getting put to sleep by Marquez, at the very least it still would've done better than Mayweather-Cotto did (1.5 million), which was his second-best selling fight.  People might not be as excited for it as before, but the interest is always there.  They can say that no one gives a shit about it, but those same people will still order it.  All Manny needs is a good win to get back on the upswing for people to be really pumped up for his matches.  That's what happened with all of Mayweather's other opponents that were big draws.

Mayweather vs. Cotto - 1.5 million PPV buys.  This is after Cotto got the shit beat out of him by Manny, then he beat a nobody (Foreman), a sort of nobody (Mayorga) and then someone legitimate but with a handicap from a previously broken orbital bone that played a role in the fight being stopped (Margarito).

Mayweather vs. Ortiz - 1.25 million PPV buys.  This is after Ortiz quit against Maidana, then beat four nobodies and then ended the winning streak of a then-undefeated fighter who was expected to be the winner (Berto).

Mayweather vs. Mosley - 1.4 million PPV buys.  This is after he lost to Cotto, then he knocked out a nobody (Mayorga) and then a somebody whose head wasn't in the right place that day for obvious reasons (Margarito).

I'm not saying that they weren't legitimate wins or anything, but prior to Guerrero, Floyd's three prior fights were all very successful and against guys who were counted out not more than a few fights prior to whenever they laced up against Floyd.  And none of them had avenged their most recent losses (all of which were pretty difficult for all of them) either before going against Mayweather.  So to say that no one gives a shit anymore won't be the case.

But don't get me wrong, if Manny somehow loses to Rios, then he should definitely hang up his gloves, and Freddie Roach said that in an interview released today that he would tell Manny to retire if they don't come out victorious.

[Nutty]

Interest definately has waned, especially after the way Pacman lost.

Plus Marquez don't owe jack. Especially after the farcical that was the third fight. He deserved his win....and the KO too.

I'd like to see Pacman/Mayweather, just to shut people up...... but it's a few years too late.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

I feel Marquez DOES owe Manny another shot, especially when people will watch it and he can pick up the biggest paycheck of his career.

Regardless of who you felt won each fight, the reality is that Manny agreed to more fights when Marquez had not yet officially won.  Even the rubbermatch was weird, as it usually follows two fights where both fighters are 1-1 in terms of wins and losses against each other, though Marquez was 0-1-1.  And going into the fourth fight, he was officially 0-2-1.  Did he deserve to win the third fight?  Maybe.  But none of the three judges saw it that way, and you can at least argue that maybe Manny really did win, as the punch stats back that up.  To quote Roger Mayweather after the split decision was announced at De La Hoya-Mayweather, "Check the mothafuckin' punch stats."

Also, after the first three fights, Marquez has always pretty much been an asshole.  I can get his frustrations, but all he ever did was swear up and down that he won and insisted that he was robbed by blind judges.  He first followed Manny to the Philippines (where he was treated nicely upon his arrival), then he was wearing that yellow "PACQUIAO YOUR [sic] NEXT" shirt and then just walked off after the third fight once he wasn't announced as the winner.  It's basically a huge diss not only to your opponent but also to the judges.  At least Manny has always been a gentleman.  Between them, the worst thing he ever did was say, "Yeah, I think I won that fight."  Nothing cockier than that.  And even when he got completely robbed against Bradley (which was WAY worse than the judging of ANY boxing match), all he said was that he thought he won but that he respected the judges decisions.  No marching off the ring, no stupid T-shirts with grammatical errors.

Marquez might as well cash in while the time is right.  It's like Mayweather -- people will still watch Pac-May, but due to the waning interest, it's likely not going to be the 3-4 milliion PPV buy people expected it to be, which means that their cut isn't going to be what it could've been, approaching $100 million each.  IF Pac loses to Rios, then he will probably retire then, and Marquez holding out for a bigger paycheck (remember that he was asking for $20 million, then rejected the $13 million offer to fight Bradley for a fraction of that) will have been in vain and then he gives up pretty much making what he's made over every fight he's done in one match.  BUT he'd still at least have the satisfaction of winning the last fight by a KO... but why turn down an offer more than double what you got before (and also your career-high payday) to fight a guy who you just knocked out?

It would be interesting if Bradley ends up beating Marquez though, even though I don't see that happening.

[Nutty]

Fair point. But its hard to see Marquez wanting to go a 5th go with Pacman, he got his win.

We'll have to wait and see.....

Didnt know the DLH/Mayweather was a split decision.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

Fair point. But its hard to see Marquez wanting to go a 5th go with Pacman, he got his win.

We'll have to wait and see.....

It's obvious that Marquez is just playing hard to get and wants to cash in, otherwise he'd never have even spoken about demanding a HUGE purse (which was originally $15 million but grew to $20 million before officially declaring Bradley as his next opponent).  Why else would he continue to fight after such a significant win over someone like Manny, especially against someone like Bradley for literally a fraction of what he was offered for a fifth fight with Manny?  But it does make sense in some respects, as most rematches that aren't required by contract aren't going to be immediate anyway, especially since the loser should win again to be back on the upswing.

But again, it would be funny if this backfires on Marquez in the form of Bradley winning.  Remember, that years and years ago, Marquez turned down a rematch with Manny for a pretty good guarantee (at least to him at that point in his career) for a fraction of the money, then he ended up losing.  And then in that case, we can see Paquiao-Bradley II, and Bradley can argue for getting a $10 million check.  That would be something, because if that goes down and then Manny does beat Bradley, he can say that he beat the guy who beat him last time, but he's up on the official scorecards (2-1-1) against Marquez.  But that's WAY the fuck down the road.

Didnt know the DLH/Mayweather was a split decision.

Yeah, it was the only non-UD/KO/TKO of Floyd's career.

[Sccit]

Fair point. But its hard to see Marquez wanting to go a 5th go with Pacman, he got his win.

We'll have to wait and see.....

Didnt know the DLH/Mayweather was a split decision.

that would be gay...pacman gave him 3 rematches, and marquez cant even give him 1? we better get a 5th if pacman wants it.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

^ Exactly.  For Marquez, someone who came from pretty humble beginnings and is ~40, I'd have expected him to be a little more honorable than that.  It's fucked up if, after three fights and zero wins, you win the fourth one but then declare it to be over?  That's bullshit.  He can talk all that drama about how he feels he won all four fights, but if he really felt that way, then why did he want rematches so bad?

[Javii]

Put yourself in Marquez position. How can you not be bitter? He's won the most rounds, legitimately. And fans and experts on split on the decision. Since the first two fights,  Pacquiao ended up being the 2nd most paid boxer in the sport. In his mind, it could have been him. Let him ask for the most amount of money, he has deserved it.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

Put yourself in Marquez position. How can you not be bitter? He's won the most rounds, legitimately. And fans and experts on split on the decision. Since the first two fights,  Pacquiao ended up being the 2nd most paid boxer in the sport. In his mind, it could have been him. Let him ask for the most amount of money, he has deserved it.

He can ask for whatever he wants, but he can't seriously expect to get that kind of bread.  Drawing power is still important -- even after Pacquiao knocked out Morales in their rematch, the rubbermatch still paid Morales more money than Pacquiao since Pacquiao hadn't yet become the huge draw that he became a couple of years later.  And while I totally understand why Marquez would be bitter, the guy had never handled himself like a man after any of their fights untiil he got the outcome he wanted.

Yes, since their first two fights, yes, Pacquiao became the second highest paid boxer in the sport.  But he was also generating tons of PPV views and revenue as well, and none of it was really the direct result of being declared the winner of Pacquiao-Marquez II.  So it's not like people were just paying him money -- he became a superstar, but also because he was marketable.  Marquez is held back by the language barrier (though his English has improved a lot), and frankly there isn't much of interest to watch about Marquez outside of the ring.  If 60 Minutes did a report on Marquez, what would be about?  Probably nothing interesting beyond the usual stuff that 90% of American boxers went through (low-class upbringing, etc.).

But it's not as if Marquez was being held back either.  He DID get a Mayweather fight, which most boxers could only dream of, especially at a time when no one really cared to see Mayweather fight Marquez either since it wasn't really on people's top 10 dream match-ups.  Additionally, he stayed at the slightly lighter weight categories for a while, and they were divisions where there weren't many big names that would generate a lot of interest and/or revenue.  When he was still with Golden Boy, he could've moved up to 140 and fought any of those names (Khan, Hatton, Bradley, Alexander, Maidana, Judah, Malignaggi, Ortiz, Petersen) or even 147 like Manny did right after lightweight and then fight any of those names (Mosley, Guerrero, Quintana, Cintron, Berto, Forbes, De La Hoya), all of whom would have been interesting fights -- and none of those even included any Top Rank guys (or at least they weren't yet signed to Top Rank at that time) since they didn't play nice with Golden Boy (who Marquez was signed to at the time)... and that would've included Cotto, Margarito, Clottey, Mike Jones, etc. as well.

Had Marquez moved up in weight earlier or stayed at 147 after his Mayweather fight, he would've had a lot of opportunities to earn big paychecks.  Maybe not what Manny was getting at that same point, but definitely in the millions, which isn't bad for a guy who really isn't all that marketable or interesting.

[Javii]

I understand all you said, but I'm simply saying that Marquez is holding out so he can get the most amount of money he can possibly get. If not, he's very comfortable making twice the amount he made on Pac Marquez IV. Why? Because there's still a fight with Pacquiao to made after...if he wins. Both Bradley and Marquez are in the same position, Pacquiao is looking to avenge at least one his losses. Might as well make a bit more money fighting each other with the potential match up with Pacquiao is out there....plus it gets your name out there more eventually leading to more money. By the time Pacquiao will face either Bradley or Marquez, they'll most likely make at least 7-10 million.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

No, you're right.  I'm just saying that the $20 million demand is unreasonable.  Even the original $15 million demand was pretty high, though I suppose it was somewhat doable, albeit at the HIGH end of what he's worth.  But Marquez's demands have always created eye rolls from everyone not on his team.  He got a $5 million guarantee for Pac-Marquez III, with a rematch clause that would guarantee him $10 million in the event that they won and went for a fourth match.  And when he did not win on any judge's scorecards, what were his demands afterward?  For those who remember, he still wanted a $10 million guarantee (which is what he'd have gotten if he won, but he didn't), he wanted Pacquiao to reject the MD win and have it officially changed to a NC result while having the fight in Mexico.  That's a little outlandish for someone who didn't win, for wanting the same stuff that he'd have gotten if he actually did win and then some.

Don't get me wrong.  There was no rematch clause, so Marquez shouldn't be limited to only what he'd have gotten before, since he's not obligated to do it.  Immediately after the fourth fight ended, I was thinking that Marquez would be entitled to $12 million or so, which is reasonable, considering it'll be his highest payday and a good chunk higher than what he was guaranteed if he had won in the past.  But $20 million?  He's not worth that much, in the sense that he himself doesn't have that kind of drawing power to rake in the revenue to pay that kind of a fee, plus it's not like their fourth fight one-upped the previous fight's numbers.  That will show in the PPV numbers of Marquez-Bradley, which likely won't clear 500k buys.  Hell, it may not even do 400k.  Bradley's a good fighter, but he's not interesting at all.  Meanwhile, Pacquiao-Rios will do at least 800k, despite both of them coming off of clear losses.

Assuming that Pacquiao gets past Rios (which he'd better, otherwise he needs to retire since Rios is the least of his worries), whoever wins between Marquez and Bradley will likely face Pacquiao, and whoever that person is definitely deserves $10+ million.  I'd say if it's Bradley, he should get a $12 million guarantee.  If it's Marquez, he should get a $15 million guarantee.