Lifestyle > Sports & Entertainment
Canelo vs. Angulo
Nutty:
Has Mayweather announced his next fight? As for ducking Bradley, you really think so?
whoisthis:
--- Quote from: Nutty on February 02, 2014, 03:56:17 PM ---Has Mayweather announced his next fight? As for ducking Bradley, you really think so?
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Mayweather is "letting fans" decide whether he fights Khan or Maidana. I don't know if it's necessarily ducking Bradley, but you do not see a ton of fighters clamoring to fight the guy. He struggled to find a fight after the 1st Pacquiao fight. His style has a lot to do with it. Kinda like Rigondeaux.
DeeezNuuuts83:
--- Quote from: whoisthis on February 02, 2014, 01:08:10 PM ---Yeah, I agree. Golden Boy is trying to cut off the head of Top Rank, but I really think a lot of that is a function of who's running Top Rank. I honestly feel that if there was a younger person running Top Rank, it'd be easier for all sides to work together. All fighters to an extent are their own boss, especially when they're as big as Floyd. As far as Bradley goes, he realizes that he's too good defensively to get a shot at Floyd. Floyd and his people only take fights against young inexperienced fighters or fighters with absolutely no power/no defense. Bradley has the Defense and sticks to his game plan, something that Floyd hates. THAT, to me, is why Bradley has no issue sticking with TR. The whole idea of running Boxing like MMA wouldn't work with these fighters. It'd have to be put in place and ran with young fighters. But, what you'll see is more "stars" and belts will mean something.
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While Arum runs Top Rank, Todd Duboef does help out too... and his responsibilities do vary (as he's stepped in when Arum wasn't available) and apparently has a much better relationship with people outside of Top Rank. But at the same time, the HEAD guy only does so much. Oscar has been in rehab and Golden Boy is still sailing along, even though Schaefer is a PR nightmare, with all of the trash he talks. He doesn't know how to ignore stuff or let stuff go, he always needs to throw one last jab in.
But at the end of the day, it's the promotional companies that are paying the boxers who claim that they are their own boss, and not the boxers putting up the money to have the event set up. What would be great would be if Golden Boy could man up for once with Floyd and say, "Fight this guy who we and the boxing world wants you to fight, then you get your $50 million guarantee, but if you fight who YOU want to fight but very few people care to see you fight him, then you get a $25 million guarantee... take it or leave it." Seriously, what is Floyd going to do? All he knows is Top Rank (who he won't go back to) and Golden Boy. He's not realistically going to just put together some random team of people who are going to have the promotional capabilities of those giants. Lou DiBella probably doesn't have the capital to do it. He won't want to go back to 50 Cent when they already split from each other. It would be a good wake up call to him, with how much he has toyed with the boxing world. Even Floyd fans have suffered for it at times, as they (like every other fan) have wanted to see him fight Manny while cringing at some of the garbage we've been given instead in the meantime, regardless of how successful it was... yet his guarantees have only gone up.
--- Quote from: whoisthis on February 02, 2014, 01:08:10 PM ---Broner is actually a big draw, surprisingly. He put up great numbers all year and that was on Showtime. Canelo obviously will still sell PPV's because he'll have the entire Mexican community behind him. They might not put up numbers like Manny, but lately his numbers haven't been great. Broner and Canelo are still really young. They have the opportunity of growing and becoming even bigger draws. Manny is still number 2, but he's not really improving numbers wise. By the way, did you see what Arum said about undercards? This is why this dude needs to go.
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Canelo is much more famous now than he used to be, but he's not really supported by the entire Mexican community to the point where they will all buy his fights... don't let the 2.2 million PPV buys of Mayweather-Alvarez fool you. I'd say Marquez has a more loyal following, within the Mexican community. Expect Canelo's next PPV fight to do 300,000 at best, especially since it's not like he made any statements against Floyd or won any new fans by losing and not really being able to tag him.
Manny's numbers will improve, though the dip in his PPV sales was expected, though 475,000 buys was a little disappointing regardless. But it was ONE disappointing event, one that happened to be following two losses while being against another guy coming off of a loss and taking place overseas in China. Off the top of my head:
De La Hoya-Pacquiao: 1.25M
Pacquiao-Hatton: 850k
Pacquiao-Cotto: 1.25M
Pacquiao-Clottey: 700k
Pacquiao-Margarito: 1.15M
Pacquiao-Mosley: 1.3M
Pacquiao-Marquez III: 1.45M
Pacquiao-Bradley: 900k
Pacquiao-Marquez IV: 1.15M
Pacquiao-Rios: 475k
Big dip, for sure. But the circumstances going into the fight justify it, but there wasn't really a significant pattern of decreasing interest that can't be explained. And coming off of the momentum of winning again and returning to Vegas, it should bring back some interest. Not to legitimize the win over Rios (who we didn't really expect to come close to winning unless he got off a lucky punch), but he was always someone who struggled making weight in the lower categories, so people figured he'd be right at home at 147. He even said that he could focus more on actually training, since a lot of his previous training camps involved him having to cut a lot of weight.
--- Quote from: Nutty on February 02, 2014, 03:56:17 PM ---Has Mayweather announced his next fight? As for ducking Bradley, you really think so?
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I don't think Mayweather is ducking Bradley, but Bradley re-signing with Top Rank makes it just as difficult as a Manny fight. While Floyd is likely more confident about beating Bradley than Manny, to be consistent, he'll have to use the same excuse about his opponents having no ties to Arum as one of his requirements. Floyd won't need to fear Bradley's punches (which really aren't that hard), but maybe Floyd knows Bradley might be a little harder to tag than most of his opponents who are generally more offensive-minded and try to go in for the money shot.
--- Quote from: whoisthis on February 03, 2014, 09:07:11 AM ---Mayweather is "letting fans" decide whether he fights Khan or Maidana. I don't know if it's necessarily ducking Bradley, but you do not see a ton of fighters clamoring to fight the guy. He struggled to find a fight after the 1st Pacquiao fight. His style has a lot to do with it. Kinda like Rigondeaux.
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But how is that happening? Unless things changed and Broner is giving up on the rematch clause with Maidana, then Maidana isn't going to be available for May. While Floyd has a shit ton of money either way, I think he'll definitely want to cover that $10 million loss from betting on the Broncos. He can deny that he made the bet all he wants, but when the denial only comes out AFTER the Broncos lost though the initial reports of the alleged bet came out a week ago... it's a little suspect, especially when the one report coming out denying it was from somebody who is his massage therapist, who apparently is well aware of what bets Floyd makes.
whoisthis:
I hate Schaefer. He's a douche, just like Arum. But, I think he has far less influence over any fights and such in comparison to Arum.
I'd love for GB to give Floyd an ultimatum like that, they'd never do it. Promoters are too afraid of losing out on a pay day. At the end of it all, Floyd will go where ever he has to for the money. He bad mouths Oscar every chance he gets, but he's lining his pockets nicely. Floyd can put any feelings to the side for the money. There are no other promoters with the money or clout to promote Floyd properly. Not even 50.
We'll see what numbers Canelo does with this next fight. He's not quite at Marquez's status, but he's also 15 or so years younger. He'll be there sooner than later. Manny is getting older and his competition isn't getting better. Better promotion and a better story line will give this fight with Bradley more buys, but where does he go from here? Marquez V? Ruslan?
Maidana fighting Floyd is Golden Boy (and more importantly Haymon) telling everyone else: Floyd gets first pick, you get what he leaves behind. And I agree 100%. Floyd did bet that money. He just didn't want to look like a loser. Had he not bet, why didn't he say something sooner?
DeeezNuuuts83:
--- Quote from: whoisthis on February 03, 2014, 12:56:47 PM ---I hate Schaefer. He's a douche, just like Arum. But, I think he has far less influence over any fights and such in comparison to Arum.
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Well yeah... Arum is actually a promoter who has been promoting for decades, including a lot of the greatest fights in boxing history. Schaefer's background is in banking and finances, and he got involved in promotion with Oscar around ten years ago or so. Schaefer has definitely helped Oscar build Golden Boy into a huge company, particularly if you focus on the money generated -- can't deny that. But very few of their fights had an epic feel to them, when the fight was over, in the sense of knowing that it's a fight that would be talked about for years.
--- Quote from: whoisthis on February 03, 2014, 12:56:47 PM ---I'd love for GB to give Floyd an ultimatum like that, they'd never do it. Promoters are too afraid of losing out on a pay day. At the end of it all, Floyd will go where ever he has to for the money. He bad mouths Oscar every chance he gets, but he's lining his pockets nicely. Floyd can put any feelings to the side for the money. There are no other promoters with the money or clout to promote Floyd properly. Not even 50.
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They would never do it... but they could. Again, the only other company large enough and with the proper experience to work with Floyd would be Top Rank, but he'll never do that. I would say that 50 might have the money and clout to do it... but the problem with 50 is that he doesn't have enough fighters signed to him exclusively to put together an event (since it would require some undercard matches) unless he did a joint effort with someone else (hence negating using SMS Promotions in the first place instead of Golden Boy or Top Rank), plus he only recently got his promoters license in Nevada (as at first he only had it in New York).
--- Quote from: whoisthis on February 03, 2014, 12:56:47 PM ---We'll see what numbers Canelo does with this next fight. He's not quite at Marquez's status, but he's also 15 or so years younger. He'll be there sooner than later. Manny is getting older and his competition isn't getting better. Better promotion and a better story line will give this fight with Bradley more buys, but where does he go from here? Marquez V? Ruslan?
--- End quote ---
We can forecast what might happen to him in the future, but it doesn't necessarily serve as an indication of how successful his next fight will be. And while Canelo was a good opponent for Floyd, he doesn't have that warrior spirit or the flair that sells that fighter (rather than the fighter pairing). People watched Oscar because he was the Golden Boy. People watch Floyd because they want to see him either completely outclass his opponent or lose for the first time, since he's a big talker. People watch Manny because they know the other person is going to get his face bruised up. Canelo doesn't have that factor yet, and it comes from doing something that pulls a crowd beyond your own community.
Considering how the Pacquiao-Bradley I did 900k buys when Bradley was still relatively unknown, it's very possible that the next fight should break a million, considering how Manny dominated Rios in his last fight (so there's the "he's back" view), plus Bradley has built up his credibility as a fighter by beating Provodnikov in a war (one that really helped him regain some respect with it being a potential fight-of-the-year since a lot of people were hating on him after he got the split decision win over Manny) and also beating Marquez. And then there's the storyline about the first fight's outcome.
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