UK Folx.. Bowling for Columbine on ch4 tonight

[Don Seer]

night of tv for me.. still getting my energy back after last night  

(12 quid.. all you can drink!.. dangerous!)


anyways... have heard a lot about this.. i'm pretty anti US gun law.. from the advertising looks like something good....



Bowling for Columbine  (Documentary) Close this Window
     
Time: 21:00 to 23:25 (2 hours and 25 minutes long).
When: Saturday 6th December on Channel 4
Click to find all other showings of this programme
Michael Moore's Oscar-winning documentary film examining the American attitude towards guns and violence. Using the Columbine High School massacre as a starting point, Moore discusses America's relationship with firearms with such diverse figures as NRA chairman Charlton Heston, controversial musician Marilyn Manson and James Nichols, brother of Oklahoma City bombing accomplice Terry.
Director: Michael Moore
 

[Lincoln]

It's a fuckin great movie.

[Real American]

www.revoketheoscar.com

Michael Moore has been exposed here in the US for lying in the documentary and faking alot of the scenes. But that doesn't stop Europeans from eating it up, they love anything that is anti-American whether it is true or not.

[Don Seer]

its not about being anti-american.. i see 2 main messages

1) the media in america is responsible for whipping up and over-sensationalising things, casting blacks as criminals and generally making ya'll paranoid

2) the gun thing.. people in cities dont need guns for gods sake.. combine with whipped up media.. you got people paranoid about crime and their neighbors

[Don Seer]

and i have one idea..

the media should stop reporting all this stuff.. full stop

for one it stops the seed for the idea of guns for self defence being planted in people, plus it stops the racial criminal prejudice stuff being set..theres probably lots more reasons too

[M Dogg™]

this is the same media that also tries to make up stuff on what michael moore put in the movie. there really wasn't much that i saw that was anti-american though. hell, he even has his nra card... lol. being anti-american isn't critizing america, being anti-american is not doing something to try to improve the nation.

[ILL-Logic-AL]

I watched the movie and enjoyed it.

Don't usually like Michael Moore (annoying left wing cunt) but agreed with him on some issues in the film.

Fuck knows what he was trying to do likening "Soccer riots" to the Columbine disaster though.

He has some interesting ideas and politics, even though I don't agree with them.

[Joachim]

I thought it was aight, the cartoon about the pilgrims in the middle of it was mad funny, however accurate the film is or not, he still has a valid point.

[white Boy]

great movie,

[Don Seer]

I thought it was aight, the cartoon about the pilgrims in the middle of it was mad funny, however accurate the film is or not, he still has a valid point.

yeah it was real good

[OpTiCaL]

I thought it was aight, the cartoon about the pilgrims in the middle of it was mad funny, however accurate the film is or not, he still has a valid point.

yeah it was real good

[Woodrow]

MICHAEL MOORE IS A FRAUD - THE ULTIMATE LIST
(LAST UPDATED 11-28-03)

Complete Debunkings of BFC
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
David Hardy, Former Lawyer for the Interior Department:
- http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html

Dave Kopel, “National Review” magazine:
- http://www.nationalreview.com/kopel/kopel040403.asp

Richard Bushnell, Reporter, Editorialist, and owner of "Richwatch.com":
- http://www.bowlingfortruth.com (provides scene-by-scene expose’)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


In-Depth Debunkings
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ben Fritz, “Orange County Register”: (Requires Free-Membership)
- http://www2.ocregister.com/ocrweb/ocr/article.do?id=20211§ion=COMMENTARY&
year=2003&month=1& (change "§" to "&-s-e-c-t", minus the dashes)

Ben Fritz, "Spinsanity" organization (Watchdog Group for Political Rhetoric):
- http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20021119.html

Anthony Zoubek, “The Daily Vidette:
- http://www.dailyvidette.com/news/406627.html
- http://www.dailyvidette.com/news/413482.html
- http://www.dailyvidette.com/news/417763.html

Kay S. Hymowitz, “City Journal”:
- http://www.city-journal.org/html/13_3_michael_moore.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Scene-Specific Debunkings
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What the Littleton LHM-plant REALLY does:
Michael W. Phillips, Jr.:
- http://www.geocities.com/evil_spoon/articles/bowlingforlockheed.htm

What Heston REALLY said in his "Hoya" interview:
Tim Sullivan, “The Hoya”:
- http://www.thehoya.com/news/033100/news3.htm

What the "48 Hours" line REALLY said:
Archive of “48 Hours” page (via http://www.archive.org):
-http://web.archive.org/web/20001003020449/http://www.nrahq.org/administration/publications/tag/article2.shtml
Heston's ACTUAL speech:
David Hardy, Former Lawyer for the Interior-Department:
- http://www.hardylaw.net/Bowlingtranscript.html(side-by-side comparison)
Worldnetdaily.com:
- http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=16127

What the "Willie Horton" ad(s) REALLY looked like:
American Museum of Moving Image:
- http://www.ammi.org/cgi-bin/video/years.cgi?1988,15,ss,, ("Revolving-Door Prison" ad)
- http://www.ammi.org/cgi-bin/video/years.cgi?1988,17,ss,, ("Willie Horton" ad)

The ACTUAL statistics:
FBI, "Nationmaster", "GunCite", and Bureau of Justice:
- http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/01cius.htm
- http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_mur_wit_fir
- http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_mur_wit_fir_cap
- http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcgvinco.html
- http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/ascii/hvfsdaft.txt

Heston is NOT a racist:
Henry Levy, "Jewish Post of New York": (Heston wins CORE's "MLK Jr." award)
- http://www.jewishpost.com/jp0703/jpbr0703a.htm
"Montgomery Citizens":
- http://www.mcsm.org/hestonMLK.html
"HestFest": (some of Heston's Civil-Rights achievements):
- http://marhew.tripod.com/hestfest/id3.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Brief/Partial Debunkings
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andrew Sullivan, “Andrewsullivan.com” and “Sunday Times of London”:
- http://www.andrewsullivan.com/main_article.php?artnum=20021208

John Fund, “The Wall Street Journal”:
- http://www.opinionjournal.com/forms/printThis.html?id=110003233

Mike Pesca, "On the Media":
- http://www.wnyc.org/onthemedia/transcripts/transcripts_120602_more.html

Garance Franke-Ruta, "The American Prospect" (A Democratic Magazine):
- http://www.prospect.org/webfeatures/2002/11/franke-ruta-g-11-22.html

Tim Blair, “The Australian” (newspaper):
- http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/printpage/0,5942,5763232,00.html (criticizes both Moore AND Moore’s detractors)

Andy Patrizio, “IGN.com”:
- http://dvd.ign.com/articles/430/430335p1.html?fromint=1

Joseph Farah, "Worldnetdaily.com":
- http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=32217
- http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=34367

Debbie Schlussel, Tech Central Station:
- http://www.techcentralstation.com/1051/defensewrapper.jsp?PID=1051-350&CID=1051-032503B

Matt Labash, “The Weekly Standard” magazine:
- http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/001/831ojymx.asp

Roger Ebert:
- http://www.suntimes.com/output/answ-man/sho-sunday-ebert23.html (responds to Moore)
- http://www.itsthecatsass.com/newboard/messages/37982.htm (answers Q's about BFC)

Brendan Nyhan, "Spinsanity":
- http://www.spinsanity.org/post.html?2003_08_31_archive.html#1062477905999081

Matthew Randazzo, IV, “Whateverdude.com”:
- http://www.whatever-dude.com/posts/327.shtml

Chuck Muth, "OpinionEditorials.com":
- http://www.opinioneditorials.com/guestcontributors/muth_20030425.html

Edward Johnson-Ott, "All-Reviews.com" (movie-review site):
- http://www.all-reviews.com/videos-5/bowling-for-columbine-5.htm (gives the movie a POSITIVE review)

Peter Wicks, "The Observer":
- http://www.nd.edu/~observer/04032003/Viewpoint/0.html

Daniel Lyons, “Forbes” magazine:
- http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2002/1209/059.html?_requestid=2372&_requestid=6287
- http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2002/1209/059.html?_requestid=2372 (Requires $3 purchase)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Debunkings by Pro-Gun Sites
(Keep in mind, pro-gun bias does not invalidate cold-hard facts.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
James O. E. Norell, “NRA” (National Rifle Association) website:
- http://www.nrahq.org/publications/tag/feature6.asp

Larry Pratt, “gunowners.org”:
- http://gunowners.org/opmooretb.htm

Nicki Fellenzer, "Armed Females of America":
- http://www.armedfemalesofamerica.com/takingaim/idolworship.htm
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Debunkings of BFC-Defenses
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Wacko Attacko" by Michael Moore:
- http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/wackoattacko/index.php
Debunkings (by David Hardy, Richard Bushnell, and Myself):
- http://www.hardylaw.net/replytomoore.html
- http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/bowlingforcolumbine/wackoattacko.htm
- http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0310793/board/thread/3494271?d=3501949#3501949

"A Defense of Michael Moore" by Erik Moller
- http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2003/8/12/171427/607
Debunking (by Myself):
- http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0601619/board/nest/3465045

"The Truth About 'Truth About Bowling for Columbine'" by Tim Dudley
- http://www.bigsugar.wrestling-fan.com/truthaboutbowling.html
Debunking (by Myself):
- http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0310793/board/nest/4338868

The often heard "If He's Lying, why hasn't he been sued?" argument:
(Note: He IS being sued.)
Debunking (by Myself):
- http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0310793/board/thread/3555084?d=3638617#3638617
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Other BFC-Related Bits
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Moore invites victims' families to "preview screening", then charges admission:
Ann M. Ketcher, letter to "Rocky Mountain News":
- http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/opinion/article/0,1299,DRMN_38_2356875,00.html

Moore deceives Academy on purely technical grounds:
Joseph Farah, "Worldnetdaily.com":
- http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=34367
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Debunkings of Moore's non-BFC works/statements
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Dude, Where's My Country?"
Bryan Keefer, "Spinsanity" Organization (Watchdog Group for Political Rhetoric):
- http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20031016.html
- http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20031016b.html
Richard Bushnell, Reporter, Editorialist, and owner of "Richwatch.com":
- http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/dude.htm
David Hardy, Former Lawyer for the Interior Department:
- http://www.mooreexposed.com/dwmc.html (page under construction

"Stupid White Men"
Ben Fritz, "Spinsanity" Organization:
- http://www.spinsanity.org/columns/20020403.html
Ben Fritz, "Salon" Magazine and "Salon.com": (Requires Paid-Membership)
- http://www.salon.com/politics/col/spinsanity/2002/04/03/moore/index_np.html
David Hardy, Former Lawyer for the Interior Department:
- http://www.mooreexposed.com/swm.html

Fahrenheit 9/11
David Hardy, Former Lawyer for the Interior Department:
- http://www.mooreexposed.com/f911.html (page in preparation)

"Downsize This!"
"Update Ghost", Epinions.com:
- http://www.epinions.com/content_118225800836

The "USA Patriot Act"; What it REALLY does vs. What Moore SAYS it does:
Jonah Goldberg, "National Review Online":
- http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/moore/online/patriotact.htm

Debunking Moore's "Post-9/11 FBI-Flight" Tale
Barbara and David P. Mikkelson, “Snopes.com” (Urban-Legends reference page):
- http://www.snopes.com/rumors/flight.htm

Debunking one of Moore's letters to Bush
Brian Carnell, "Leftwatch.com":
- http://www.leftwatch.com/articles/2003/000004.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Other Stuff
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anti-Moore Sites:
Various columnists and contributors:
- http://www.moorewatch.com (contains OVER 300 articles)
- http://www.mooreexposed.com
- http://www.moorelies.com

Moore (famous for filming people without consent) files a complaint against a man for filming MOORE without consent:
John Tierney, "The New York Times":
- http://www.nytimes.com/library/national/regional/061700ny-col-tierney.html
Opinion Telegraph (profile, no author):
- http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2003/03/30/do3009.xml

"Michael Moore Enjoying Corporate High-Life"
Carl Limbacher and "Newsmax.com" staff:
- http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2003/10/31/173730.shtml

"Michael & Me"; Moore refuses to be interviewed about his alleged lying:
Joseph Farah, Worldnetdaily.com:
- http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=34397

"Is Film-Maker Michael Moore a Bigot?"
Larry Elder, Author of "Showdown" and "The Ten Things You Can't Say in America":
- http://www.townhall.com/columnists/larryelder/le20030116.shtml

The origins of "The List" in "Stupid White Men":
Ben Fritz, "Spinsanity" organization (Watchdog Group for Political Rhetoric):
- http://www.spinsanity.org/post.html?2002_04_07_archive.html#75241524

Debunking various statements made by Moore:
Bryan Keefer, “Spinsanity”:
- http://www.spinsanity.org/post.html?2002_06_23_archive.html#85204379

Some hypocritical statements made by Moore:
"Celebrity Hypocrites":
- http://www.celebrityhypocrites.com/mmoore.html

Politics and Hypocrisy in Hollywood:
Jan Golab, “Front Page Magazine”:
- http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=6617

Moore attempts to hide a statement he made:
Paul Boutin, "Wired" magazine and "Wired.com":
- http://www.wired.com/news/culture/0,1284,56524,00.html

Interviews in which Moore evades criticism and double-talks:
Lou Dobbs, CNN’s “Moneyline with Lou Dobbs”:
- http://www.cnn.com/transcripts/0204/12/mlld.00.html
Buchanon and Press:
- http://stacks.msnbc.com/news/955443.asp?cp1=1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



From http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0310793/board/nest/2988799

[Don Breezio]

^^^

micheal moore is a genius...its all you fuckin super-americans who think he's a fraud..."oh the man is telling all of america's problems lets attack him and try to make people believe that america has no problems"   fuckin wack ass motherfuckers...there was absolutely no anti-american shit in there...there was anti-bullshit stuff...thats what the whole movie was...exposing the media for their bullshit. and it was a damn good movie.

[Woodrow]

Lol

Ignore it if you want to, but he's just pulling the wool over your eyes. I just posted a HUGE amount of links debunking his movie from many different sources. America's not perfect, but I don't need some guy who weighs 400 pounds telling me about self control.

Have fun being a sheep.

[[Stoned]Jesus H. Christ[Wheat]]

see after he had that oscar speech or whatever then the media started making fun of his weight and shit, that was just sad that they stooped that low, I mean so many americans are over weight and shit it's just retarted