Lifestyle > Train of Thought
What are your Views on Communists?
infinite59:
^^ Also I'd like to add...
In the Islamic system of economics the poor has rights over the wealthy.
Many Americans like to say about the poor; "I don't owe them anything. I worked hard for my money, I don't owe them anything." This is not the Islamic system.
It's not just a "good" or "nice" thing in Islam to give charity. In the Islamic economic system you have to pay the poor due or you will face harsh penelties. You DO owe them something. Also, charging interest is forbidden in Islam; and you are not aloud to pile up or hoard wealth.
ITW [the irish boy]:
This topic has gone a bit off track but at least people are talking rationally about it. Here's my take, please give it a read it took a while to type...
I believe communism is not a bad idea, but a flawed one, and one which will never work on its own.
I believe capitalism is not a bad idea, a flawed one which again can't work on its own.
I believe that each of these systems has an awful lot to offer and they should be the basis for a successful society. Imagine we had a blank canvas from which to construct a societal system. This is how I feel it would work the best...
Aspects of communism must be adopted. I think we all would like to feel that if we put in a hard days work, are good people, then we wont nevertheless end up in poverty due to uncontrollable circumstances. This is why I think we should have structures in place to provide free quality health care to those who need it, grant aid for those born into disadvantage, social welfare for single parents, unemployed (especially long term unemployed) and dont forget the OAP, who in many cases work for 50 years and are left surviving on meagre pensions. One common misconception is the rich work harder than the poor, and I dont think that is true, the rich simply have more opportunities and the skills to take advantage of them. The less well off shouldnt suffer for this.
All that is well and good. But you cant keep everyone locked down, they must be able to advance themselves, including financially. Entrepreneurs and business's should be encouraged to grow and generate wealth for themselves and the country, as long as they are not harming others. People should be free to make themselves rich, but not by exploiting others, after all it is the working class who do all the hard work and without them the economy would have no basis. Capitalism is needed to drive the economy, and not least to provide the revenue for the government to look after the sick, old and poor.
Corporate Responsibily should be a condition of the capitalism. Exploiting a countries population and resources for profits is wrong, and so the basis for the society should be People before Profits.
To end I don't think communism is any more "misguided" than capitalism, they both are to an extent. A combination of both is needed to obtain a fair and equitable society.
ITW
Trauma-san:
--- Quote from: Krayzie-Eyez Killah on February 03, 2004, 09:35:12 AM ---Communism won't work because it places the "Group" needs above the individuals needs. That's inherently wrong and a VERY misguided view about how people work.
--- End quote ---
Not to mention it's unnatural. It supresses the human drive, every human has a spirit in them that makes them strive for bigger and better things, and when properly channelled makes people extremely successful. It's not greedy to want to be the best at everything in every possible way. Humans just naturally want to be more than what they are. Taking away their individulism with communism or socialism is an unnatural thing, and the human spirit soon tires of it and longs for more :)
Trauma-san:
--- Quote from: Ibrahim Islam on February 03, 2004, 03:24:27 PM ---
--- Quote from: Lincoln on February 02, 2004, 01:00:22 PM ---Some are good, some are bad. If Communism ran occordingly to the actual theory it would be the greatest thing in the world but unfortunately people are too greedy.
--- End quote ---
Yeah. And people who consider capatilism a success aren't looking at it from other people's perspective. If you are poor, or your business has just been closed down because Wal-Mart moved in next to you... or if your country has just been invaded by another country who wants to privatize your natural resources; then capatalism isn't so great. I think everyone should have a food and shelter. Capatalism can't gaurantee that. Capatalism forces expensive items to be nessecities that weren't ever nessecities before; because the technology is controlling us... Rather than us controlling the technology.
--- End quote ---
Love. If you've just been dumped, you have a bad view of love. By your logic, Love is bad. You're married, you're in love, it's the same thing. Capitalism is bad to those who have been burnt by it, but it's the greatest thing in the world to those that have gained success through it. Love's the same way. It comes down to, is it worth the gamble? Humans by nature strive for betterment, so hell yes it's worth the gamble. Life is worth the gamble. You might have a good life, you might not. By your logic we should all kill ourselves right now, right, instead of chanceing the consequences?
Of course that's not what you believe, you only believe it about capitalism, because someone has told you to believe it about capitalism. That belief is in contrast with your natural feelings as a human being.
ITW [the irish boy]:
^^^^^^
You could make the exact same argument about communism. If you have had a bad experience of it you will naturally think it is bad. If you have had a good experience of it you think it's great. Is it worth a chance? Of course, that everyone can be equal is a great thing.
Like you said about capitalism, it's all about how you were brought up to believe in it. If you were brought up hearing "fucking commies" or "damn capitalists" your going to hold onto some of that view.
I dont think either is more natural than the other. Communism is more idealist for everyone whereas capitalism is more idealist for the lucky few. All depends on what side of the fence your on. Like I said above, a successful society needs elements of both, Wouldnt you agree trauma?
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