DUBCC - Tha Connection > Outbound Connection
NAS ARGUMENT CHALLENGED.
M Dogg™:
God not this again.
Be a minority, feel what it's like, then come back at this. You can't possibly do that, so you can't feel what Nas is saying. I love the song, I love the CD, and I'm one that has dated white women and went to an all white college. In fact, that even makes me feel it more. You guys may not like it, but it's a point of view that exist, and rappers like Public Enemy (Flava Flav should have been in that song too, wtf is he doing?) 2Pac, Ice Cube and many other hip-hop legends spoke on for many years. It's political conscience rap, something Nas does, and everyother rapper like him has songs like it, so don't trip. Why not put all the other songs on blast, why not put hip-hop on blast, why not talk about Ice Cube for doing White Cave Bitch, Public Enemy for calling white people devils and slave owners, and every other political/conscience rapper, and these are the guys people call positive rappers.
When will this conversation end?
Shallow:
--- Quote from: Lost Angel on January 12, 2005, 08:37:12 PM ---God not this again.
Be a minority, feel what it's like, then come back at this. You can't possibly do that, so you can't feel what Nas is saying. I love the song, I love the CD, and I'm one that has dated white women and went to an all white college. In fact, that even makes me feel it more. You guys may not like it, but it's a point of view that exist, and rappers like Public Enemy (Flava Flav should have been in that song too, wtf is he doing?) 2Pac, Ice Cube and many other hip-hop legends spoke on for many years. It's political conscience rap, something Nas does, and everyother rapper like him has songs like it, so don't trip. Why not put all the other songs on blast, why not put hip-hop on blast, why not talk about Ice Cube for doing White Cave Bitch, Public Enemy for calling white people devils and slave owners, and every other political/conscience rapper, and these are the guys people call positive rappers.
When will this conversation end?
--- End quote ---
If this were '91 I would be blasting Cube. If this were '95 I would be blasting Pac. If this were '99 I would be blasting Dead Prez. This is 2004 (now 2005) and Nas is the one saying. Besides I didn't start the thread, I just responded. I grew up as a white guy in a black area. Does that count as a minority? Even if it doesn't, I've visited Turkey as a Greek, that is certainly a minority. I know what it feels like to be put down for being of a different race. However that has no merit in this conversation. It's not Nas's racism as much as it is his insulting and name calling that bothers. It's his judging. He feels he's so spiritually enlightened but he doesn't show it. Tupac claimed to be a thug, and Chuck D claimed to be a pro black advocate. Nas claims to be Jesus. If Nas said "I feel all black guys should act like me", I'd chuckle but I won't post paragraphs on it.
M Dogg™:
--- Quote from: Shallow on January 12, 2005, 09:16:39 PM ---
--- Quote from: Lost Angel on January 12, 2005, 08:37:12 PM ---God not this again.
Be a minority, feel what it's like, then come back at this. You can't possibly do that, so you can't feel what Nas is saying. I love the song, I love the CD, and I'm one that has dated white women and went to an all white college. In fact, that even makes me feel it more. You guys may not like it, but it's a point of view that exist, and rappers like Public Enemy (Flava Flav should have been in that song too, wtf is he doing?) 2Pac, Ice Cube and many other hip-hop legends spoke on for many years. It's political conscience rap, something Nas does, and everyother rapper like him has songs like it, so don't trip. Why not put all the other songs on blast, why not put hip-hop on blast, why not talk about Ice Cube for doing White Cave Bitch, Public Enemy for calling white people devils and slave owners, and every other political/conscience rapper, and these are the guys people call positive rappers.
When will this conversation end?
--- End quote ---
If this were '91 I would be blasting Cube. If this were '95 I would be blasting Pac. If this were '99 I would be blasting Dead Prez. This is 2004 (now 2005) and Nas is the one saying. Besides I didn't start the thread, I just responded. I grew up as a white guy in a black area. Does that count as a minority? Even if it doesn't, I've visited Turkey as a Greek, that is certainly a minority. I know what it feels like to be put down for being of a different race. However that has no merit in this conversation. It's not Nas's racism as much as it is his insulting and name calling that bothers. It's his judging. He feels he's so spiritually enlightened but he doesn't show it. Tupac claimed to be a thug, and Chuck D claimed to be a pro black advocate. Nas claims to be Jesus. If Nas said "I feel all black guys should act like me", I'd chuckle but I won't post paragraphs on it.
--- End quote ---
and in 1988 you'd be blasting Chuck D... lol. Dude, slow your role. It's hip-hop, it's from a black point of view. There is suppose to be a Latino point of view in it, but we are silent. (Puerto Ricans were very key in the start of hip-hop) Anyway, you have your view, cool, but honestly, this is the United States, this is one of many many countries built off slaves back on stolen land. And it just so happens that no matter what, this country views certain people different, and Nas is responding to it the way he feels. Trust me, I've been there. Nas was very nice, he mainly focused on Kobe for being a false black hero, and then talked about rappers afterwards. The shot outs at the end were the only reference to the other people. I mean, a whole verse to Kobe. I'm a Laker fan, I have a Kobe jersey, but I can honestly say, if Shaq, Karl Malone, Nas (who did a song with Kobe called Thug Poet), Phil Jackson and other people are talking about this kid, isn't it time he check himself. You are getting heating for a Kobe dedication. LOL.
I actually want you to talk about everyone else. Talk about 1991-1993 Ice Cube (White Cave Bitch), 1988-now Public Enemy (everything), 1991 - 1994 2Pac (the Quicy Jones article and such), 1999-now Dead Prez (everything), 2001-2005 Nas (from calling the Twin Towers Karma to this latest song). Just get all your anger out for these people, get it all out and make yourself heard. 'Cause dammit, I'm tired of reading it all in seperate post. I want it all out in one post so I can read it all at once. Hell I wouldn't respond, I just want to hear you out.
Shallow:
1) Didn't the introspective Folk movement of Bob Dylan have anything to do with influencing hip hop? How about hardrock? I swear I've heard Hendrix and Page solos that resemble scratching.
2) You won't ever read me getting my anger out because I don't have any. I don't "care" that Nas is doing this. I just know hypocrisy and contradiction when I see it, and I point it out. You may read my words and assume I have an angry tone, but if you were to hear me you'd know I'm not angry at all. I probabably shouldn't have used the word blast when I mentioned I'd respond to Chuck D etc. I don't blame you for assuming I have an angry tone. I can see why'd you'd think that.
3) If you feel that America is filled with false black role models that's fine. I feel it's filled with false white role models as well, (If by false you mean untrue). What makes Bill Cosby any different than Ward Cleaver? What makes Michael Jackson any different than Elvis? What makes Denzel any different than Mel Gibson (before his 600 million dollar pay day)? What makes Jay Z any different than Eminem? What makes Nas any different than Springsteen? All of these people came from lesser backgrounds and acheived unattainable status for 90%+ of the population. Many of them came from bad backgrounds that are still bad despite their fame. When Michael Jordan became a multi millionaire, Jim Brown called him a house nigger. A poster boy for blacks to look at and say "wow we can do that", but the ghettos weren't getting any better with his rise, so he was fake according to Brown. Did abandoned steel towns get revived when Larry Bird made his millions and was put on a pedestal? Did trailer parks diminish when Eminem became super rich? I don't see how black heroes are any less real than white ones.
4) Now this is an angry response (the others were not, and te angeris not aimed at you); I ABOSOLUTELY HATE KOBE. I NEVER LIKED HIM AND ALWAYS THOUGHT HE WAS OVERRATED. THE SHIT HE SAID ABOUT SHAQ AND ACCUSING HIM OF HAVING AFFAIRS WAS APPAULING, YET EXPECTED. My loyalty is not to Kobe, however I wouldn't call him less of a black man. Just a pathetic human being wth no guidance or judgement.
M Dogg™:
--- Quote from: Shallow on January 12, 2005, 10:00:39 PM ---1) Didn't the introspective Folk movement of Bob Dylan have anything to do with influencing hip hop? How about hardrock? I swear I've heard Hendrix and Page solos that resemble scratching.
--- End quote ---
I understand the rest of your post... but on this one... huh? ???
Hip-Hop is not so much based off scratching as it is looping. Basically in parties in New York, they'd play the popular records, but most were slow, and so they'd take the part that was fast, and loop it so you can dance to the beat. Over time, emcees would rhyme over the looped part. Everything feel into place from there. At least that's my understanding from people from NY that are huge Hip-Hop heads. I've read stuff like that too, but I was not there in the 70's, maybe you are right.
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