West Coast Connection Forum
Lifestyle => Sports & Entertainment => Topic started by: Chamillitary Click on October 09, 2012, 04:00:24 PM
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http://espn.go.com/nba/truehoop/miamiheat/story/_/id/8481973/phil-jackson-lebron-james-miami-heat-tools-equal-michael-jordan-legacy
STILL NO MENTION OF KOBE.
Even the man who coached both know that Kobe just had Shaq do all the work.
*Waits for "Phil hated Kobe" excuse*
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we all know lebron james has the TOOLS...he simply doesnt have the skills nor the drive to equal Jordan, Kobe, Magic, etc. Kwame Brown had the POTENTIAL to be a superstar...key word in this article is POTENTIAL.
Jordan, as long as he has more titles than Kobe, will remain the measuring stick. When Kobe gets 6-7 rings, he will take over as the measuring stick. Duno how Kobe came to ur mind from reading this article, as it didnt relate to him in any way LOL
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lol @ the insecure "LOL" at the end. Obviously he jumped over Kobe. Phil basically said "As long as MJ has the rings on LBJ, we won't ever be able to compare them". But still impying talent wise they're highly comparable.
I can't see a situation where you'd compare someone to the best...unless they were the second best. It's as simple as it gets. Like if Anthony Davis has a great season, you wouldn't just compare him to Tim Duncan. First you'd have to compare him to other great big men, assure yourself he's better than them, then compare him to the GOAT. Phil bypassed Kobe.
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lol @ the insecure "LOL" at the end. Obviously he jumped over Kobe. Phil basically said "As long as MJ has the rings on LBJ, we won't ever be able to compare them". But still impying talent wise they're highly comparable.
I can't see a situation where you'd compare someone to the best...unless they were the second best. It's as simple as it gets. Like if Anthony Davis has a great season, you wouldn't just compare him to Tim Duncan. First you'd have to compare him to other great big men, assure yourself he's better than them, then compare him to the GOAT. Phil bypassed Kobe.
Look at ya paranoid ass jumpin to conclusions again.. LOL is for ur undeniable love of lebron and constant need 2 compare him to Kobe. LeBron is considered the best right now, he just came offa winnin a title. This is not groundbreaking.. He still has a ways to go before he's comparable to Jordan OR Kobe.. It's all very simple, really. Jordan will be the measuring stick for greatness until Kobe retires with a couple more rings. Does it mean LeBron is as good or anywhere close? No.. It just means he has the POTENTIAL, which is perfectly fine.
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*Waits for "Phil hated Kobe" excuse*
phil hated kobe
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lol @ the insecure "LOL" at the end. Obviously he jumped over Kobe. Phil basically said "As long as MJ has the rings on LBJ, we won't ever be able to compare them". But still impying talent wise they're highly comparable.
I can't see a situation where you'd compare someone to the best...unless they were the second best. It's as simple as it gets. Like if Anthony Davis has a great season, you wouldn't just compare him to Tim Duncan. First you'd have to compare him to other great big men, assure yourself he's better than them, then compare him to the GOAT. Phil bypassed Kobe.
Look at ya paranoid ass jumpin to conclusions again.. LOL is for ur undeniable love of lebron and constant need 2 compare him to Kobe. LeBron is considered the best right now, he just came offa winnin a title. This is not groundbreaking.. He still has a ways to go before he's comparable to Jordan OR Kobe.. It's all very simple, really. Jordan will be the measuring stick for greatness until Kobe retires with a couple more rings. Does it mean LeBron is as good or anywhere close? No.. It just means he has the POTENTIAL, which is perfectly fine.
I wasn't talking about me comparing him to Kobe. I'm just saying the man who coached both of them made no reference to Kobe. Like I said, wouldn't it make sense to make sure he's better than Kobe before you compare him to the game's greatest player?
You're scrambling, brah.
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lol @ the insecure "LOL" at the end. Obviously he jumped over Kobe. Phil basically said "As long as MJ has the rings on LBJ, we won't ever be able to compare them". But still impying talent wise they're highly comparable.
I can't see a situation where you'd compare someone to the best...unless they were the second best. It's as simple as it gets. Like if Anthony Davis has a great season, you wouldn't just compare him to Tim Duncan. First you'd have to compare him to other great big men, assure yourself he's better than them, then compare him to the GOAT. Phil bypassed Kobe.
Look at ya paranoid ass jumpin to conclusions again.. LOL is for ur undeniable love of lebron and constant need 2 compare him to Kobe. LeBron is considered the best right now, he just came offa winnin a title. This is not groundbreaking.. He still has a ways to go before he's comparable to Jordan OR Kobe.. It's all very simple, really. Jordan will be the measuring stick for greatness until Kobe retires with a couple more rings. Does it mean LeBron is as good or anywhere close? No.. It just means he has the POTENTIAL, which is perfectly fine.
I wasn't talking about me comparing him to Kobe. I'm just saying the man who coached both of them made no reference to Kobe. Like I said, wouldn't it make sense to make sure he's better than Kobe before you compare him to the game's greatest player?
You're scrambling, brah.
no, because right now, theres questions as to whether or not he's good enough to be the GOAT. it happens to all the top players in the league. Penny Hardaway, Grant Hill, Vince Carter, T-Mac, etc. have all been said to have "potential" to be greater than Jordan. it's just the way it works.
You're too young to get it.
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No you're just too stupid to understand.
In the last three days first Barkley, now Phil have compared him to MJ & not even made reference to Kobe.
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No you're just too stupid to understand.
In the last three days first Barkley, now Phil have compared him to MJ & not even made reference to Kobe.
looks like youre the one too stupid and paranoid to understand....ur drawing lines that arent there, as always. it's called DELUSIONS. like i said, the greats always get compared to past GOAT's, not current active players. nobody compared Penny Hardaway to Dominique Wilkins first, they went straight for Jordan, because he's the measuring stick...even Kobe is still tryna measure up with Jordan. it would make absolutely no sense to compare LeBron to Kobe RIGHT NOW, when Jordan is STILL the world-wide measuring stick for basketball greatness, and the article is about whether Lebron has the potential to be the GOAT, not about whether he's better than said player. common sense, buddy. u aint gotta always make shit into more than what it is. take shit for what it is and watch ur life drastically improve.
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lol @ your advice being "take shit for what it is" when you fabricate 90% of your life.
But anyway, you're missing the point. Not surprising. Got your Laker goggles on.
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lol @ your advice being "take shit for what it is" when you fabricate 90% of your life.
But anyway, you're missing the point. Not surprising. Got your Laker goggles on.
u lose every argument by attemptin 2 make it a personal matter as a means to overcompensate for weakness. u suck. man up and hop off, young'n
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lololol. Coming from you...priceless.
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lololol. Coming from you...priceless.
the price is right, bitch
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lololol. Coming from you...priceless.
the price is right, bitch
price is right is coming to Orono in a week, my boy got tickets
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Im the postseason, the only thing that really matters, MJ was 9 for 18 on game winning/tying shots within the final 24 seconds (in other words, 1 possession games) Kobe is 28% on 7/25 shooting and Lebron is 41% on 5/12 shooting.
Neither Bron or Kobe are, or will be close. Both are amazing fucking players though, two of the best ever.
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Im the postseason, the only thing that really matters, MJ was 9 for 18 on game winning/tying shots within the final 24 seconds (in other words, 1 possession games) Kobe is 28% on 7/25 shooting and Lebron is 41% on 5/12 shooting.
Neither Bron or Kobe are, or will be close. Both are amazing fucking players though, two of the best ever.
kobe has more game winners than jordan
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Im the postseason, the only thing that really matters, MJ was 9 for 18 on game winning/tying shots within the final 24 seconds (in other words, 1 possession games) Kobe is 28% on 7/25 shooting and Lebron is 41% on 5/12 shooting.
Neither Bron or Kobe are, or will be close. Both are amazing fucking players though, two of the best ever.
kobe has more game winners than jordan
because MJ actually passed the ball
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Im the postseason, the only thing that really matters, MJ was 9 for 18 on game winning/tying shots within the final 24 seconds (in other words, 1 possession games) Kobe is 28% on 7/25 shooting and Lebron is 41% on 5/12 shooting.
Neither Bron or Kobe are, or will be close. Both are amazing fucking players though, two of the best ever.
kobe has more game winners than jordan
because MJ actually passed the ball
Kobe has led the Lakers in assists since he got 2 LA
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he's not LEbron when it comes to passing the ball that's for sure
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he's not LEbron when it comes to passing the ball that's for sure
yes....we all know lebron is much more comfortable passing than shooting
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he's not LEbron when it comes to passing the ball that's for sure
yes....we all know lebron is much more comfortable passing than shooting
he still the best player in the game
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he's not LEbron when it comes to passing the ball that's for sure
yes....we all know lebron is much more comfortable passing than shooting
he still the best player in the game
well see
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NIK, Kobe has been shot pretty badly in the playoffs in recent years in clutch situations. As I pointed out, MJ hit a far higher percentage of clutch shots in the playoffs than Kobe has. Even lebron is higher, likely because he goes to the hoop.
Your reaponse that Kobe hit more game winners missed the point. I was talkig playoffs, when shit matters Feel free to correct what i wrote in my original post if I waswrong.
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NIK, Kobe has been shot pretty badly in the playoffs in recent years in clutch situations. As I pointed out, MJ hit a far higher percentage of clutch shots in the playoffs than Kobe has. Even lebron is higher, likely because he goes to the hoop.
Your reaponse that Kobe hit more game winners missed the point. I was talkig playoffs, when shit matters Feel free to correct what i wrote in my original post if I waswrong.
I dunno about percentages, but I do know that Kobe has had to endure playing with far worse teams than Jordan has.. U can factor that into the equation or not. That's up to u.
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LOL. Stop it. The Bulls without MJ would be MURKED by the Lakers without Kobe...but with Shaq.
Stop acting like the combination of Bynum, Pau, Odom, Fisher & Artest was so poor. You used to tout each in their own respect of being incredible before you realized how it made any "Kobe >>>>> legend" argument invalid lol.
In the fact, the only reason Kobe even has five rings is because he was forunate enough to play with such good teams. Because all saw the .500, seventh seed, first round knock out when he was alone...unlike other players who managed to make the NBA Finals with Daniel Gibson riding shotgun.
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Bynum/Pau/Odom was great for a few years but that last year with Odom on them was pathetic
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Kobe still cashed in for his two most important rings because it was Shaq-less with that squad.
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another damning thing about Kobe:
MJ: 6 finals, 6 finals MVP's
Kobe: 7 finals, 2 finals MVP's
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LOL. Stop it. The Bulls without MJ would be MURKED by the Lakers without Kobe...but with Shaq.
Stop acting like the combination of Bynum, Pau, Odom, Fisher & Artest was so poor. You used to tout each in their own respect of being incredible before you realized how it made any "Kobe >>>>> legend" argument invalid lol.
In the fact, the only reason Kobe even has five rings is because he was forunate enough to play with such good teams. Because all saw the .500, seventh seed, first round knock out when he was alone...unlike other players who managed to make the NBA Finals with Daniel Gibson riding shotgun.
this is retarded...Kobe has won with less. Pau Gasol was Kobe's second fiddle for 2 championships. Pau is good, but he is not the greatest 2nd fiddle when u compare him to all the 2nd fiddles in championship history. in fact, Pippen, who was Jordan's 2nd fiddle, was actually considered the 2nd best player in the league for some of those championship runs by Chicago. To act like Jordan didnt have the ideal complimentary cast is pretty laughable and just goes to show how young u really are. then to say Kobe's complimentary cast was better? lmao. 1st of all, Bynum was injured for that first run, and coming off an injury in the 2nd. Odom is good, but he's a 6th man, not some GOAT HOF player. now, that leaves us with Pau, who we all know can be good, but has also folded just as much as he's come through....and Fisher as the starting point guard. come on, biebs, we know ur young...but ur claims go beyond age.
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NIK you once said Gasol was the best big man in the NBA, just over a year ago
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NIK you once said Gasol was the best big man in the NBA, just over a year ago
definitely didnt say that just over a year ago.. that woulda been after he fucked up in the Dallas series.
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When they first had Odom, Bynum, Artest & Pau he touted it as arguably the greatest roster ever, not realizing how it would affect his future push for Kobe as GOAT, so he backed down. Pau went from the "best big man", to tissue paper & Bynum went from "the next Wilt" to "one of the better big men in the game" & Odom went from "greatest sixth man" to "just some other nigga".
lol @ comparing Pau to Pippen & acting like "well, that proves that". But that's about all the extra that he had. Pau was playing like Dennis Rodman in that last Finals series, grabbing boards out his ass.
Then a double "lol" to just ignoring the 3-peat team that Kobe was the REAL second fiddle to, where he got the majority of his rings anyway. I'd rather listen to you draw your theories of Jordan playing in a "watered-down" league than listen to you try to compare rosters where Jordan was undeniably the absolute priority to winning.
But then again, you try to say Jordan had no competition ignoring the fact that during the Lakers last three Finals runs, outside of Boston, the league was dead. OKC was garbage, the Spurs were injury ridden, Dirk was labeled the biggest choke in the league, the Suns played no defense & weren't built for the playoffs, Dwight was beating up on everyone but the Cavs & Boston, LeBron was playing with Booby Gibson, Wade had nobody, Rose wasn't even in the league yet. Meanwhile by far the most stacked roster in the NBA ran the table for three years. Surprise, surprise. ::)
This year outside of the Heat & the Thunder is even more of a joke. This roster surpasses anything any "GOAT" has ever played with. Nash, Pau & Dwight? That's a big four.
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When they first had Odom, Bynum, Artest & Pau he touted it as arguably the greatest roster ever
lies....show me where i said this.
lol @ comparing Pau to Pippen & acting like "well, that proves that". But that's about all the extra that he had. Pau was playing like Dennis Rodman in that last Finals series, grabbing boards out his ass.
lol...pau was grabbing boards out his ass? is that why kobe had a game high in rebounds in that epic game-7 showdown? fact of the matter is, theres no doubt pau has delivered. but he's also failed as well. so he is not a player who comes through every time ala pippen, but he still has his beastly moments. if u dont get that, then slap yaself 1 time.
Then a double "lol" to just ignoring the 3-peat team that Kobe was the REAL second fiddle to, where he got the majority of his rings anyway. I'd rather listen to you draw your theories of Jordan playing in a "watered-down" league than listen to you try to compare rosters where Jordan was undeniably the absolute priority to winning.
But then again, you try to say Jordan had no competition ignoring the fact that during the Lakers last three Finals runs, outside of Boston, the league was dead. OKC was garbage, the Spurs were injury ridden, Dirk was labeled the biggest choke in the league, the Suns played no defense & weren't built for the playoffs, Dwight was beating up on everyone but the Cavs & Boston, LeBron was playing with Booby Gibson, Wade had nobody, Rose wasn't even in the league yet. Meanwhile by far the most stacked roster in the NBA ran the table for three years. Surprise, surprise. ::)
This year outside of the Heat & the Thunder is even more of a joke. This roster surpasses anything any "GOAT" has ever played with. Nash, Pau & Dwight? That's a big four.
no ignoring, Kobe played with Shaq for the first half of his career, which hurt his individual accolades as much as it helped him grow as a player. Shaq was the focal point for those 3 titles, but Kobe was just as important. if u look up the averages, they were always neck and neck. but no denying, it was shaq's team, considering kobe was the young dude in town. regardless, kobe was still the best all-around player in the league by age 21, which is remarkable. as for todays Laker roster, lets not act like all these players are in their prime. Nash is good, but it aint like we getting MVP Nash, Pau has already been declining, and Dwight was a fair trade-off for Bynum. It's not some big conspiracy, like Wade+Bosh+LeBron getting together and vowing to sign to the same team. Nash signing to the Lakers is more comparable to Gary Payton going to Miami for the Final title chance. Is the current Laker roster great? yes. Is it the greatest roster of all time? if these players were all in their prime, I'd say it'd be competing for it. but as of today, Kobe is still head-and-shoulders the leader of the team, whereas LeBron and Wade were in a constant struggle when they first got together, with everyone trying to see who's team it was. Wade ended up subsiding (mainly due to injuries), and LeBron took the crown. But dont compare the way the Heat got their firepower to how the Lakers front office did it.
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The only time Pau "didn't bring it" was the year after the last title.
But all three Finals apperances were NOT happening without him.
& lol, Gary Payton was second in the league in assists when he joined the Lakers? Nash was second in assists & played with Grant Hill & Marcin Gortat lol. Dwight is hands down the best big man in the league, & Pau is still better than 95% of the big men in basketball. Antwan even has game in him. Artest can still play. Then you factor in the fact that Kobe is still one of the best in the game & how are you going to act like it's not a fucking joke? They have a top five PG, the best shooting guard besides Wade & the best big man, along side a top ten big man. Artest & Jamison would be focal points to other teams.
& how does it matter how it's handled in the front office? The teams still stand as they are. If anything it was handled better by the Heat because they didn't have to deal with Nash at first saying he'd never year purple and gold & then have Dwight act like he was a lock to go to Brooklyn. It was well put together. But still...it's irrelevant how both came to be; the teams are still stacked.
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But getting back to rosters & shit & Kobe & LeBron, that's what it really comes down to. See, Dwight & Nash might have some absurd chemistry. Plus in Orlando, Dwight was kicking out to Hedo. Now he's kicking back out to Kobe. You have to collapse on him. It's actually the same as having Shaq. It boils down to Kobe having it stupidly easier to get what he wants with the attention on Dwight. It just devalues him so much...like when Shaq was running the show. The inside game makes the outside game & you'll clearly see it.
With the Heat, Bosh is the "big man", but he's clearly inferior to LeBron. He was out for an entire series & it didn't matter lol. Wade is his Pippen, but after that it falls off into nothing but a bunch of shooters. Battier is on par with Artest, I guess. But at the end of the day, you see the importance of LeBron creating just about every play for his team & then in LA you have Kobe just capitalizing on his surrounding. I mean, if Nash managed to play .500 ball in the West with LITERALLY nobody, imagine what he could do with just Dwight & Pau. Easily could see them winning 50+ games without Kobe. With Kobe, we're talking 65+...assuming health.
Not saying that isn't smart. Not saying he shouldn't do that. It'll help win games. Just takes away that Jordan-esque aura from him.
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The only time Pau "didn't bring it" was the year after the last title.
But all three Finals apperances were NOT happening without him.
& lol, Gary Payton was second in the league in assists when he joined the Lakers? Nash was second in assists & played with Grant Hill & Marcin Gortat lol. Dwight is hands down the best big man in the league, & Pau is still better than 95% of the big men in basketball. Antwan even has game in him. Artest can still play. Then you factor in the fact that Kobe is still one of the best in the game & how are you going to act like it's not a fucking joke? They have a top five PG, the best shooting guard besides Wade & the best big man, along side a top ten big man. Artest & Jamison would be focal points to other teams.
& how does it matter how it's handled in the front office? The teams still stand as they are. If anything it was handled better by the Heat because they didn't have to deal with Nash at first saying he'd never year purple and gold & then have Dwight act like he was a lock to go to Brooklyn. It was well put together. But still...it's irrelevant how both came to be; the teams are still stacked.
Pau didn't bring it the last two seasons, and even his first season with the Lakers, he collapsed I'm the Finals vs. Boston, earning him the title "Gasoft"......unlike Pippen who brought it EVERY year. That's is the difference. As for the one season with Payton and Malone, that year was a disaster. Malone was injured that season, it was the rape trial. Just a disastrous season overall. Now, we have a good roster. Is it showtime Lakers or 3peat Lakers good? I doubt it.. But only time will tell. Fact of the matter is, this is Kobe's team. Make no mistake. When LeBron arrived in south beach, there was automatically a debate as to who's team it was.
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Guna take this time to remind everyone that the Pippen-led Bulls made the Eastern Conference Semi-Finals
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The only time Pau "didn't bring it" was the year after the last title.
But all three Finals apperances were NOT happening without him.
& lol, Gary Payton was second in the league in assists when he joined the Lakers? Nash was second in assists & played with Grant Hill & Marcin Gortat lol. Dwight is hands down the best big man in the league, & Pau is still better than 95% of the big men in basketball. Antwan even has game in him. Artest can still play. Then you factor in the fact that Kobe is still one of the best in the game & how are you going to act like it's not a fucking joke? They have a top five PG, the best shooting guard besides Wade & the best big man, along side a top ten big man. Artest & Jamison would be focal points to other teams.
& how does it matter how it's handled in the front office? The teams still stand as they are. If anything it was handled better by the Heat because they didn't have to deal with Nash at first saying he'd never year purple and gold & then have Dwight act like he was a lock to go to Brooklyn. It was well put together. But still...it's irrelevant how both came to be; the teams are still stacked.
When LeBron arrived in south beach, there was automatically a debate as to who's team it was.
Only due to Wade being there his entire career. It took about two weeks into the season to clearly see who was running the show lol.
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Regardless, my point wasn't that it isn't Kobe's team. Obviously is his team, his city, even if he isn't the best player on it. My point is that Howard is virtually the second coming of Shaq. Don't get me wrong, the media will play it out like it was Kobe's work. So don't fear that my personal knowledge of the truth will be how it gets written down in history if the Lakers win. Nothing will publicly be taken from Kobe despite his roster. He'll have "his" six. But barring Kobe averaging 30-something points a game, Howard will EASILY be the deciding factor as to whether or not the Lakers win.
Wade or Bosh goes down game six of the season & out for the season, the Heat will still make the Finals. Howard's back acts up again & he's out for some time, the Lakers become fairly mediocre.
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The only time Pau "didn't bring it" was the year after the last title.
But all three Finals apperances were NOT happening without him.
& lol, Gary Payton was second in the league in assists when he joined the Lakers? Nash was second in assists & played with Grant Hill & Marcin Gortat lol. Dwight is hands down the best big man in the league, & Pau is still better than 95% of the big men in basketball. Antwan even has game in him. Artest can still play. Then you factor in the fact that Kobe is still one of the best in the game & how are you going to act like it's not a fucking joke? They have a top five PG, the best shooting guard besides Wade & the best big man, along side a top ten big man. Artest & Jamison would be focal points to other teams.
& how does it matter how it's handled in the front office? The teams still stand as they are. If anything it was handled better by the Heat because they didn't have to deal with Nash at first saying he'd never year purple and gold & then have Dwight act like he was a lock to go to Brooklyn. It was well put together. But still...it's irrelevant how both came to be; the teams are still stacked.
When LeBron arrived in south beach, there was automatically a debate as to who's team it was.
Only due to Wade being there his entire career. It took about two weeks into the season to clearly see who was running the show lol.
Not true.. Lebrons first year in Miami they were pretty even. There were times when wade was even lookin like the leader. If wade was in his prime and not injury ridden, it would still be debated.
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Regardless, my point wasn't that it isn't Kobe's team. Obviously is his team, his city, even if he isn't the best player on it. My point is that Howard is virtually the second coming of Shaq. Don't get me wrong, the media will play it out like it was Kobe's work. So don't fear that my personal knowledge of the truth will be how it gets written down in history if the Lakers win. Nothing will publicly be taken from Kobe despite his roster. He'll have "his" six. But barring Kobe averaging 30-something points a game, Howard will EASILY be the deciding factor as to whether or not the Lakers win.
Wade or Bosh goes down game six of the season & out for the season, the Heat will still make the Finals. Howard's back acts up again & he's out for some time, the Lakers become fairly mediocre.
LOL! Dwight Howard is much more comparable to Chris Bosh than he is to Shaq. spare urself the embarrassment and quit while u still can.
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I'm not comparing him to Shaq. I'm comparing him to his dominant play to other big men in the league to Shaq's compared to when he was in his prime. Outside of Bynum, whose injured, he's by far, unequivocally the best big man in the league. Almost to the point it isn't comparable. The drop off from Dwight to next in line is a complete joke. Which I'm comparing to Shaq when he was unguardable.
You like to say he never developed post moves, this & that, but at the end of the day, it's still more than enough to be an absurd force in the middle. Best defensive big man, best rebounding big man & drops 20 a night. He went to the Finals surrounded by a bunch of shooters, now he has a top five point guard, Kobe & a top five 7 footer with him. It makes him even more effective. But in becoming more effective inside, it only devalues Kobe in the sense now he has an absurd amount of help, almost identical to what Shaq provided him which is something unlike Jordan or LeBron have ever seen.
Bosh doesn't do that for LeBron. Bosh occasionally will have a nice 30 point night. But generally is just sitting at that elbow waiting for LeBron to find him & taking jumpshots. He's not drawing defenders away from LeBron. & Wade doesn't do that for LeBron because they play the same style. It's not like Howard for Kobe whose going to draw the entire defense inside. Wade just stands on the other side of the court & watches unless Spoe runs a set that's ran through him.
You can honestly say this team is better than the 3peat team in the respect that Dwight isn't as good as Shaq, but compared to the rest of the league's bigs, he's equally as dominate. The grading curve for big men has significantly dropped in the last decade. Dwight's overall big man game is as good in today's league as Shaq's was a decade ago. Nash is far better than Derek Fisher & Pau is better & more effective than Horry. Kobe hasn't lost that much of a step. ESPN still has him ranked #6 overall, which should be higher because Rose doesn't belong there. Then the combo of Artest & Jamison is better than Rick Fox.
The 3peat team had a top 3 SG & the best center. This years team has a top 5 PG, still a top 3 SG, a top 5 PF in Gasol & the best center in basketball. You got like four of the top twenty players in the league, all at different starting positions. This is the most help Kobe's ever had.
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I'm not comparing him to Shaq. I'm comparing him to his dominant play to other big men in the league to Shaq's compared to when he was in his prime. Outside of Bynum, whose injured, he's by far, unequivocally the best big man in the league. Almost to the point it isn't comparable. The drop off from Dwight to next in line is a complete joke. Which I'm comparing to Shaq when he was unguardable.
You like to say he never developed post moves, this & that, but at the end of the day, it's still more than enough to be an absurd force in the middle. Best defensive big man, best rebounding big man & drops 20 a night. He went to the Finals surrounded by a bunch of shooters, now he has a top five point guard, Kobe & a top five 7 footer with him. It makes him even more effective. But in becoming more effective inside, it only devalues Kobe in the sense now he has an absurd amount of help, almost identical to what Shaq provided him which is something unlike Jordan or LeBron have ever seen.
Bosh doesn't do that for LeBron. Bosh occasionally will have a nice 30 point night. But generally is just sitting at that elbow waiting for LeBron to find him & taking jumpshots. He's not drawing defenders away from LeBron. & Wade doesn't do that for LeBron because they play the same style. It's not like Howard for Kobe whose going to draw the entire defense inside. Wade just stands on the other side of the court & watches unless Spoe runs a set that's ran through him.
You can honestly say this team is better than the 3peat team in the respect that Dwight isn't as good as Shaq, but compared to the rest of the league's bigs, he's equally as dominate. The grading curve for big men has significantly dropped in the last decade. Dwight's overall big man game is as good in today's league as Shaq's was a decade ago. Nash is far better than Derek Fisher & Pau is better & more effective than Horry. Kobe hasn't lost that much of a step. ESPN still has him ranked #6 overall, which should be higher because Rose doesn't belong there. Then the combo of Artest & Jamison is better than Rick Fox.
The 3peat team had a top 3 SG & the best center. This years team has a top 5 PG, still a top 3 SG, a top 5 PF in Gasol & the best center in basketball. You got like four of the top twenty players in the league, all at different starting positions. This is the most help Kobe's ever had.
lmao... Did u just say Kobe has more help than LeBron has ever had? What's wrong with u, man? Like I said, LeBron was seen as a second fiddle for a lot of his first year with Miami. Wade was already a proven champion without LeBron.. What has anyone on the lakers proven without Kobe? Nothing... U cannot compare . And Pippens STILL much better than anyone on the Lakers not named Kobe. Ur arguments are terrible and usually make no sense. The last straw was u saying the current Laker team is better than the 3peat Laker team. Too much..
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Pau was also a huge pussy in 07-08 against KG
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LOL, NIK you're an idiot. You're looking at it like well "Pippen > Nash. Pippen > Dwight (which isn't true). Pippen > Pau".
But it's Nash, Dwight & Pau >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pippen. How you going to try to hide behind the fact it's three bonafide, year in, year out allstars by saying that individually matched up Pippen was better? That's like if the Lakers also had Kevin Love, James Harden & Kyrie Irving on this roster too & you were like "Well....Pippen was obviously better than all of those players....so MJ had more help". What kind of fuckass logic is that?
& yeah, just look at it & it's so simple. LeBron & Kobe are the leaders, right? So there you go. Now Pau & Bosh we'll call equal & they cancel out. I'll even call Dwight & Wade even DESPITE the fact it's MUCH better to have a DOMINATE big man...the most dominate big man by far in basketball than another wing player who plays the same style as LeBron & generally stands around when the set isn't designed for him. Then you you just have a PG who averaged 14 assists a game passing the ball to Marcin Gortat. Now has Dwight to feed the ball too. Obviously has more help.
Like I said, Nash, Dwight & Pau with Artest & Jamison would easily win 55 games.
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Pippen > Dwight (which isn't true).
lol...ur a joke, son. no one here can take u serious. it's like the 14 year old who just started listening to hip-hop and says "lil wayne > rakim"....ur the basketball version of that.
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Figures you'd focus on the one thing you might be able to defend.
Anyway, Scottie was never a top five player in his league. Dwight is & there's no one close to him besides Bynum.
Considering the last decade the Finals was one by Shaq, Duncan, Robinson, Shaq in Miami, KG & Dirk, I'd say having the best big men in the league is more important than a all-star wing player.
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nobody with a brain was taking Pippen over Hakeem, Ewing, Barkley, Malone or Robinson 8)
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Figures you'd focus on the one thing you might be able to defend.
Anyway, Scottie was never a top five player in his league. Dwight is & there's no one close to him besides Bynum.
Considering the last decade the Finals was one by Shaq, Duncan, Robinson, Shaq in Miami, KG & Dirk, I'd say having the best big men in the league is more important than a all-star wing player.
right, but in the 80's-90's it was Magic, Jordan, Bird, Isaiah, etc was winnin all the titles. PERIMETER PLAYERS. As for Pippen never being a top 5 player LOL...he was in the same class as Barkley, Ewing, Hakeem, Drexler, etc. and he's had better seasons than all of 'em. you werent alive yet, but i clearly remember many claiming him as the 2nd best player in the league for some of those years, especially in the mid-90s.
fact of the matter is, the Pippen led Bulls team that went to the ECF were better than this Laker team with no Kobe. you also have to take everything into account, not just player-by-player comparison. who had the better team as a unit? better chemistry? better role players who knew how to play their part to perfection? better coaching staff? playbook? lets not act like Pau and Nash are in their prime, either. so yea, it's pretty safe to say that the Pippen led Bulls would take out a Dwight led Lakers. and a Wade-led Heat (who actually won the title in '06) would also take out a Dwight-led Lakers......now, if Nash and Pau were still in their prime, I'd probably give the edge to the Lakers...but u are completely overrating Kobe's supporting cast, not realizing that pretty much MOST championship unit of the last couple decades have been just as great or greater.....and i know why ur doing it. it's because u know Lakers are taking it this year, and u will need excuses as to why LeBron lost once Kobe gets that 6th. it's ok, buddy. i see u. just dont start believing ur lies.
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I was actually 2 years old...and you were 8. But I forget at 8 years old you develop high intellect for deep analysis lmao. But you're wrong. Shaq, Karl, Robinson, Hakeem, Barkley & Ewing were all better. Even better is that it just goes to prove my point because they're all big men lmao. EVEN BETTER is that everyone I named had to go up against each other making them respectfully "less" dominate when they went against each other. Dwight's comparison to literally nobody makes him even more dominate to the league today.
Anyway, why is that so safe to say? Pau is still a top five big man & Dwight is #1...by far. Rodman wasn't guarding him. Nash is better than Kerr..by far. Averaged 14 assists with Grant Hill last season. The only thing I'll give you is the chemistry...only because we haven't seen them yet.
But on paper, this Lakers team without Kobe would easily beat the Bulls team without MJ.
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nobody with a brain was taking Pippen over Hakeem, Ewing, Barkley, Malone or Robinson 8)
i forgot Stockton too
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I was actually 2 years old...and you were 8. But I forget at 8 years old you develop high intellect for deep analysis lmao. But you're wrong. Shaq, Karl, Robinson, Hakeem, Barkley & Ewing were all better. Even better is that it just goes to prove my point because they're all big men lmao. EVEN BETTER is that everyone I named had to go up against each other making them respectfully "less" dominate when they went against each other. Dwight's comparison to literally nobody makes him even more dominate to the league today.
Anyway, why is that so safe to say? Pau is still a top five big man & Dwight is #1...by far. Rodman wasn't guarding him. Nash is better than Kerr..by far. Averaged 14 assists with Grant Hill last season. The only thing I'll give you is the chemistry...only because we haven't seen them yet.
But on paper, this Lakers team without Kobe would easily beat the Bulls team without MJ.
I don't know why u gota lie and exaggerate to prove ur points, I was 11 when Bulls won their last title and I was a devoted basketball fan, collectin cards at that age. But that's besides the point. U stay overrating Dwight and Nash. When did Nash ever average 14 assists? He already had his minutes drastically reduced last season due to aging. Dwight is good, but saying he's dominant and by far the best big is a joke. He's actually not even a traditional center. Comparable to al horford, lamarcus aldridge, brook lopez, chris bosh, kevin love etc. all who are better on offense.. and I've already went on record to say I prefer Bynum. I hope he changes my mind, but he's not head-and-shoulders above other premier bigs like ur acting. Calm down. Fact of the matter is, Bulls without Jordan were one of the best teams in the league. Lakers without Kobe would not be... Not yet.
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I meant 11. Which was second in the league lmao. You're buggin'.
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lol the man won one ring, in which 2 other top 10 players had to help him achieve it. dont get me wrong, showtime was great, but they did it the correct way, through picks and such.
not "hey lets get together everyone and make a super team" might as well had a team of jordan, johnson, and hakeem, and mayb a mchale. shits ridiculous, and yes im going to say this every damn time.
because its just ridiculous. it depletes the level of competition.
lebron is no where near kobe or micheal. but phil always like to stir up the media
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lol the man won one ring, in which 2 other top 10 players had to help him achieve it. dont get me wrong, showtime was great, but they did it the correct way, through picks and such.
not "hey lets get together everyone and make a super team" might as well had a team of jordan, johnson, and hakeem, and mayb a mchale. shits ridiculous, and yes im going to say this every damn time.
because its just ridiculous. it depletes the level of competition.
lebron is no where near kobe or micheal. but phil always like to stir up the media
someone is jealous of Bron
lets not act like Lebron teamed up with KG and Rondo. if he did he'd have 2 rings by now...
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lol the man won one ring, in which 2 other top 10 players had to help him achieve it. dont get me wrong, showtime was great, but they did it the correct way, through picks and such.
not "hey lets get together everyone and make a super team" might as well had a team of jordan, johnson, and hakeem, and mayb a mchale. shits ridiculous, and yes im going to say this every damn time.
because its just ridiculous. it depletes the level of competition.
lebron is no where near kobe or micheal. but phil always like to stir up the media
someone is jealous of Bron
lets not act like Lebron teamed up with KG and Rondo. if he did he'd have 2 rings by now...
lol r u saying im jealous? i dont play professional basketball.
lebronze won one, and by 2014 if he doesn't consistently win, i wouldnt be surprised if he bails out, considering he bailed on cleveland. lol theres even been rumors of lebron going to the lakers after his contract is up, not that ill praise him and worship him if he does. i dont like him, but if he comes yea im not gonna root against him.
lol kg and rondo, there would be chemistry issues, because i dont know what the hell rondo can do playing off the ball, since he cant shoot, he cant cut, but how often is a 6ft PG going to cut and successfully execute? same with lebronze, but off the ball it wouldnt be so bad him just cutting and running the floor, but shooting is also the question. im not say it totally cant make it work, but itll take a lot more adjustment than waht they had in miami.
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LOL, what does it matter how you "do it"? If you have an absurd amount of talent, you're still being helped. Whether you steal Pau Gasol, Steve Nash & Dwight Howard or drafted them, you still have the talent helping you.
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lol the man won one ring, in which 2 other top 10 players had to help him achieve it. dont get me wrong, showtime was great, but they did it the correct way, through picks and such.
not "hey lets get together everyone and make a super team" might as well had a team of jordan, johnson, and hakeem, and mayb a mchale. shits ridiculous, and yes im going to say this every damn time.
because its just ridiculous. it depletes the level of competition.
lebron is no where near kobe or micheal. but phil always like to stir up the media
someone is jealous of Bron
lets not act like Lebron teamed up with KG and Rondo. if he did he'd have 2 rings by now...
lol r u saying im jealous? i dont play professional basketball.
lebronze won one,
you can drop the stupid "Lebronze" nickname...since the USA won the bronze he's won two gold medals, 3 MVP's and an NBA finals (with the Finals MVP)
so calling him Lebronze makes you look foolish now. like calling Peyton Manning "Payton" because at the time he got his big deal he made more than anyone by a mile.
call him Lebrick or LeBum or whtaever but Lebronze is retarded.
now back to that 2010 finals the Lakers only won that because my man Perk got hurt in game 6, correct me if i'm wrong....and mentral case Artest got that lucky shot. god damn that series was a joke.
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lol, if, if, if....if bynum was 100% healthy, we woulda had a threepeat, at the very least. the if game never works in sports.
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lol, if, if, if....if bynum was 100% healthy, we woulda had a threepeat
now that is a flat out lie
it'd be Celtics winning 3 of 3 if the if game works an that's for sure :D