What did you guys think of the Dre-produced "Nightmares" ?

[jeromechickenbone]

What is your definition of a hater?  And i'll admit I have a bias against wack music.  Is that what you're referring to? 

Hater = Anyone who has a certain negative bias against an artist.  You may not absolutely hate 50, but you are inclined to be more critical of him than of rappers who do the same shit he does (but aren't as successful at it).

Like the fact that 50's music may not be "Illmatic" or "Doggystyle" quality, but anyone with common sense (i.e. the music journalists who review his albums) knows that he still does thug-pop shit better than 90% of the rappers out there.  Which is how he got to be on top in the first place.

See thats the thing - I don't think he's that good at the thug-pop shit anymore.  I think he had the right balance on GRODT, but I think he went overboard with The Massacre.  I think he reduced himself to focusing solely on overly-simplistic, catchy ass hooks and melodies rather than dropping verses that i'd try an memorize like I do with the thousands of other songs that I own.  At least on the GRODT singles he still maintained a semblance of lyricism & wit.  50 knew that when it was time for Massacre to drop, he could half ass it and it would still go 5x platinum, simply off the strength of his name.  Well, in my opinion he half assed it too much and now its catching up to him.  Getting 50 on a song no longer means it will be #1 like it did a year and a half ago.  He def needs to go back and start putting a little substance back into his music because at this stage it's very disposable.

[Eihtball]

See thats the thing - I don't think he's that good at the thug-pop shit anymore.  I think he had the right balance on GRODT, but I think he went overboard with The Massacre.  I think he reduced himself to focusing solely on overly-simplistic, catchy ass hooks and melodies rather than dropping verses that i'd try an memorize like I do with the thousands of other songs that I own.  At least on the GRODT singles he still maintained a semblance of lyricism & wit.  50 knew that when it was time for Massacre to drop, he could half ass it and it would still go 5x platinum, simply off the strength of his name.  Well, in my opinion he half assed it too much and now its catching up to him.  Getting 50 on a song no longer means it will be #1 like it did a year and a half ago.  He def needs to go back and start putting a little substance back into his music because at this stage it's very disposable.

"The Massacre" was a medicore album.  I did not buy it.  And he did get a little lazy.  I won't deny any of that.

But the fact is, 50 at his laziest is still far from "wack", and he still does enough good work that I can usually keep listening to his stuff - the "GRODT" soundtrack had some good songs and shows he hasn't lost it COMPLETELY.  His problem now is oversaturation - people are getting sick of him being on TV and radio so much.  Maybe he deserves it, maybe not, but he doesn't deserve to be called wack and get hated on as much as he is.

[Hatesrats™]

Nice...
Love the feel, Kinda like a space vibe, 

Hook up the Snoop version?

[jeromechickenbone]

Not saying you were addressing me, but I've been called a 50 "hater" numerous times by you.  In my case, that's a bigtime misnomer - a hater would constitute someone who ignorantly hates something with no basis.  So you can continue to throw that word around at me, but it has no basis.    My opinion is based squarely on my own opinions about his post-GRODT music.  I think it's wack, sans a couple tracks - that doesn't make me a hater.  I def thought Candy Shop and Just A Lil Bit were extremely corny songs.  After hearing that bullshit, I had ZERO intention of purchasing the Massacre.  I thought OCR was really dope, but def not enough to make me drop $15 on the CD.  So what's the problem with holding an artist accountable for the singles they release?  Not liking songs doesn't constitute being a hater.

That's your definition of a hater.  Not that I'm saying you are a hater, but you do have a certain type of bias, and I think you know it as well as I do.

LMFAO! Singles absolutely influence me.  They def aren't the sole factor, but they do play a part.  How old are you anyway?  I'm guessing your a youngin because you've been conditioned to think it's the norm to release over the top bullshit pop singles and not hold the artist accountable.

Believe it or not, there was a time when hip hop artists refused to compromise and pander to the degree that they do nowadays.  I know, with today's music state it's really hard to believe.  It's really sad to see so called "hip hop" fans accept this.  Always saying shit like "well, he only released this song to get the ladies" or "yeah, this formula is really played out, but it will get him lots of spins on Clear Channel radio so it's all gravy".  What the fuck are you, a cracker ass music exec or a true music fan?  Plus, I'm always hearing you labeling different songs you hear:  Club Banger, Street Anthem, Song for the Ladies...do you know where these phrases come from?  They come from dipshit record execs who know dick about music and know everything about marketing schemes to exploit the ignorant masses (aka YOU). 

Jrome, how old are YOU?  You've never struck me as being all that old or wise yourself...certainly, the way you talk, you weren't a child of the Golden Age like I was.

What do you mean, there was a time when hip-hop heads used to criticize artists for releasing songs "for the ladies"?  When LL Cool J put out "I Need Love", cats were still respecting him cause he battled with Kool Moe Dee and Ice-T and showed he was a vicious battle rapper.  And when Biggie put out "Big Poppa", wasn't anybody calling him a "sellout".  Songs for the clubs, for the ladies, whatever...that shit has ALWAYS been a part of hip-hop.  And why wouldn't they make songs like that?  You think rappers only started doing it because Mr. Jewish Label Exec said so, and not cause they really just like fucking hotties (like everyone else who's hetero)?  If you can market yourself to women, then why the fuck not?  Get more money, get more pussy...sounds good to me.

I've always thought the whole concern with "real" vs. "fake" emerged was when Vanilla Ice came out - and then it was mostly just the white suburban kids getting upset because they realized they had supported an artist who didn't have the "streets'" seal of approval.  99% of the time when a rapper gets criticized for being "fake" or "soft" or whatever, it's because the white kids are trying to fit in and they think that criticizing mainstream artists lets them do just that.  50 Cent is just the latest rapper to get hit by this trend - as soon as the newest, uber-gangsta rapper comes along who criticizes him (Game), the white kids are quick to jump on the latest gangsta nigga's dick because if he's perceived as street-credible, they think they've got street cred themselves.

So please, don't talk about an era which you obviously never experienced yourself.

Damn, did you modify this post?  I didn't see the all the other stuff outside of what I originally quoted and posted.  Maybe I just overlooked it...

But just so you know i'm not ducking it, i'll reply.  Yes, there have been songs about / for the ladies since way back in the day.  My point was that MC's back then didn't sell their soul to do it.  Take Big Daddy Kane - he could do the illest shit like "Set It Off" and could turn around and do shit like "The Day You're Mine",  "Smooth Operator", or "Children R the Future".  That was all part of his arsenal.  But regardless of the subject matter, he was still one of the illest MC's ever.  He didn't sacrifice his art when he made these songs - and that made them even better.   If you don't see the difference between that and "Just A Lil Bit" by 50 then there's no point in furthering this conversation.

LL, Slick Rick, Heavy D, Tribe, Pete Rock & CL, even fuckin Candyman.  They all made songs for the ladies but still stayed true to the art. 

And you keep mentioning street cred, which I agree with you on.  But in none of my threads do I mention a rapper's street cred.  If I use the word "credibility" when discussing an artist, i'm referring to artistic credibility.  Not whether they get respect in their hood. 

[Eihtball]

Damn, did you modify this post?  I didn't see the all the other stuff outside of what I originally quoted and posted.  Maybe I just overlooked it...

Yes, I modified my post while you were quoting the original version.

But just so you know i'm not ducking it, i'll reply.  Yes, there have been songs about / for the ladies since way back in the day.  My point was that MC's back then didn't sell their soul to do it.  Take Big Daddy Kane - he could do the illest shit like "Set It Off" and could turn around and do shit like "The Day You're Mine",  "Smooth Operator", or "Children R the Future".  That was all part of his arsenal.  But regardless of the subject matter, he was still one of the illest MC's ever.  He didn't sacrifice his art when he made these songs - and that made them even better.   If you don't see the difference between that and "Just A Lil Bit" by 50 then there's no point in furthering this conversation.

LL, Slick Rick, Heavy D, Tribe, Pete Rock & CL, even fuckin Candyman.  They all made songs for the ladies but still stayed true to the art. 

But see, this is the problem...what constitutes "selling one's soul"?  This is still based on an assumption that no self-respecting hip-hop artist would be doing the tracks you hear on the radio unless somebody else made them do it.  In the case of 50 Cent, how did he sell his soul?  Are you saying that he never did club tracks/love songs before he became popular?  You know as well as I do that the first single off "Power of the Dollar" was supposed to be "Thug Love" with Beyonce before the album got shelved.  Placing 50 Cent in the same category as Big Diddy Kane or Slick Rick is equally absurd simply because 50 ain't the same type of rapper as them.  The point is, 50 has found his niche doing the kind of music he does, and you may not feel it (and I don't always feel it either), but if he finds something he's good at, why does he have to get hated on for it?

But to me, it's no more unreasonable for 50 to do "Candy Shop" than for Biggie to do "Big Poppa" (and you are not likely to catch me listening to either of those songs - I usually skip "Big Poppa" when I listen to "Ready to Die").  Biggie did smooth player shit, 50 does smooth player shit today.  It ain't my kinda music, but they did it well and they made themselves dough doing it.  Good for them.

[Trauma-san]

Nice...
Love the feel, Kinda like a space vibe, 

Hook up the Snoop version?

Yeah! The Snoop track "nightmares" is the shit

[Meho]

Jrome if you are judging the albums by their singles thats just plain stupid.

So that means youre also not interested in the Big Bang because of the wack ass I Love My Bitch single, which is basically Candy Shop part 2 ?

LMFAO! Singles absolutely influence me.  They def aren't the sole factor, but they do play a part.  How old are you anyway?  I'm guessing your a youngin because you've been conditioned to think it's the norm to release over the top bullshit pop singles and not hold the artist accountable.

Believe it or not, there was a time when hip hop artists refused to compromise and pander to the degree that they do nowadays.  I know, with today's music state it's really hard to believe.  It's really sad to see so called "hip hop" fans accept this.  Always saying shit like "well, he only released this song to get the ladies" or "yeah, this formula is really played out, but it will get him lots of spins on Clear Channel radio so it's all gravy".  What the fuck are you, a cracker ass music exec or a true music fan?  Plus, I'm always hearing you labeling different songs you hear:  Club Banger, Street Anthem, Song for the Ladies...do you know where these phrases come from?  They come from dipshit record execs who know dick about music and know everything about marketing schemes to exploit the ignorant masses (aka YOU). 

As far as Busta's album, I haven't purchased it.  Doesn't mean i'm not interested in it, it just means that i haven't financially supported it.  But I've only ever purchased 1 Busta album anyway.  I still think he's an incredibly talented dude, but I haven't thoroughly bumped his shit since Leaders of the New School.  Plus, it's more like "Busta Rhymes and Friends present THE BIG BANG".  It has soooo many guests that it really dilutes it for me.  Not saying that there aren't dope appearances - I'm a Q-Tip fan (actually i've never really liked anything he did as far as his solo career), Nas, ODB, Stevie Wonder, etc.  But it's not really a trend that I'm gonna financially support.  I don't mind occasional cameos or posse cuts, but a lot of rappers today fill up 2/3 of their albums with shitloads of random guests and as many different producers as there are songs.  It's PLAYED OUT and doesn't incline me to purchase it.

I'm astonished that there are some people on here that were so apalled about my statement saying that 50 might have something to do with Dre's beats not ending up on Mobb Deep's album. Again, it's not like I pulled that outta my ass - Hav said in SCRATCH MAGAZINE they were given 2 beats by DRE, neither of which made it's way onto Blood Money: One ended up on the re-issue of Massacre, the other ended up on a G-Unit mixtape. Maybe 50 had nothing to do with that, maybe he did. I have no idea, but it is one of many reasonable deductions one can derive - which is what makes it a THEORY.

That can't be true because I'm sure 50 said himself that the Outta Control Remiix was given to him before The Massacre was released, he wasn't feeling it but listened to it again at a later date and changed his mind.

It may be completely inaccurate, but my statement is based on Hav's own words.  So be mad at him.

Well, thats the state the music is in nowadays. Do I like it ? No. But it aint gonna change for a while. So as long as you wont accept it, youre gonna be bitter about everything like you are now.

WOW.  What kind of idiot happily supports ideals that he doesn't agree with?  Actually, save the ounce of credibility you have left and don't reply.

Ok mother. Well keep being that depressed litlle kid you are, always complaining about everything. Dont forget to smile once a month 


BTW im 19. I may not know about the music as much as you do, but Ive seen you get owned by  2 Mothafucking Xtra 4 Cali so many times, that I might as well ask you how old are you ?

[Brazemac]

I'm not feelin this beat at all. probably one of the worse dre beats so far

[Hectic]

beat was boo boo, the hook ok, versus ok... overall a 5.  Dre must of been hung over when he laced that beat...




                                     IM STILL BUMPING MY MUSIC
                                       www.myspace.com/hectic 

[The King]

I Love My Bitch single, which is basically Candy Shop part 2 ?

No way, candy shop had a better beat and was lisenable, yall like it, but I love my bitch is aweful in every way.

[WestCoasta]

Always saying shit like "well, he only released this song to get the ladies" or "yeah, this formula is really played out, but it will get him lots of spins on Clear Channel radio so it's all gravy".  What the fuck are you, a cracker ass music exec or a true music fan?  Plus, I'm always hearing you labeling different songs you hear:  Club Banger, Street Anthem, Song for the Ladies...do you know where these phrases come from?  They come from dipshit record execs who know dick about music and know everything about marketing schemes to exploit the ignorant masses 

fuckin Jrome, we think alike



LOL @ the Black Panther dude, "50 Cent at his laziest is far from wack"

are you fuckin kidding me, ever heard "Just a Lil Bit" ........

guy probably wrote it in 5 minutes and laughed at the morons who were gonna eat it up

[Eihtball]

LOL @ the Black Panther dude, "50 Cent at his laziest is far from wack"

are you fuckin kidding me, ever heard "Just a Lil Bit" ........

guy probably wrote it in 5 minutes and laughed at the morons who were gonna eat it up

Who's a Black Panther?  Of course you're gonna agree with Jrome just because you still think I really hate crack...err, white people.

I don't like "Just A Lil Bit", but "The Massacre" still had plenty of tracks that were good for what they were.

[WestCoasta]

hahah, ya I agree with Jrome cause he's white    what a dumbass


ok, so "The Massacre" had some okay tracks, but 50 at his laziest isn't tight, now don't say dumb shit anymore

[Diabolical]

I thought it was meh.

[Eihtball]

hahah, ya I agree with Jrome cause he's white    what a dumbass


ok, so "The Massacre" had some okay tracks, but 50 at his laziest isn't tight, now don't say dumb shit anymore

I didn't say cause he was white, I said cause you think I actually hate white people.  I remember all those comments you left me.

And yeah, "The Massacre" is still better than most mainstream albums.  Stop putting words into my mouth.