Kobe...

[.:DaYg0sTyLz:.]

the only players who can compare to MJ in terms of career stats are Wilt and Lebron.  and even Lebron is about 4 PPG away from Jordan in his prime (who was about a 32 PPG guy)

the only players who can compare in the terms of winning are Bill Russell and Robert Horry lol.

lol at stats, what about in terms of skills, clutch, taking over games, being the finisher, and being the best.

its either going to be kobe or mj



none of those old school guys  come close to kobe or MJ in terms of being the best player. but MJ didnt even play against a d-wade, lebron james, chris paul, the NBA has much more talent right now than they ever did.


lebron doesnt come close, this guys overrated i wouldnt be suprised if he joins the t-mac/grant hill club by the end of the career.

I wouldnt use the level of competition as an argument FOR Kobe. It would actually hurt considering the league has turned SO much more into an offensive league geared towards allowing players to score at will or get to the line. Jordan was playing against bruising defenses where it was ok to simply knock people on their ass. Kobe would seriously curl up in a little ball and cry if he had to see Oakley, Mason or even Starks every year in the playoffs lol. Artest woudl be the soft player on those old Knicks teams.

The problem is, Kobe stans like to use stats to argue...but then when the stats go the other way they try to pretend as if stats dont matter.

You cant measure "skill" when you are talking about best EVER, because skill levels of players ALWAYS improves from generation to generation. If you took Wilt for example....Dwight Howard is more SKILLED then he ever was. And Dwight isnt that skilled by todays standards. But you would NEVER say that Howard is as great as Wilt. Different age of Basketball. You can only compare a players skill...for THEIR time. And Jordan was head and shoulders above the rest of the league. There were NEVER any questions as to whether he was the best basketball player in the world. Kobe is constantly in the midst of a debate as to whether he is the best player in the NBA right now. If you were watchin basketball during Jordans era, no one ever said that anyone else was the best. As a matter of face, Jordan was already considered the greatest all time before his career was over. Thats why Kobe can never be on his level.

This is a lie, straight up...Jordan wasn't considered the best until he won a title, in the 90s.

LOL At what point in Kobe's career was he ever considered the hands down greatest player in the game? LOL. He is ALWAYS part of a debate. My point is that Jordan wasnt part of a debate except for early in his career. And if you dont know that Jordan was considered the greatest of all time BEFORE he was done...then you simply dont know your basketball. Point blank, Kobe just can not compete with that. He is much closer to Magic than he is to Jordan in that Magic was typically part of a debate as well. You can hate it all you want, but Kobe will never been seen or respected on Jordans level. He could win the title this year...and the next 2 and would still not be considered as great as Jordan. MJs GOAT status was cemented 2/3's of the way through his career lol.

Here are just a few reasons Kobe wont catch him

Jordan- 6 Titles,  6 Finals MVP Awards, 5 NBA MVP Awards, 10 Scoring titles, 3 Steals titles, Rookie of the Year, NBA All Rookie First team, ESPN's Greatest Athlete of the 20th century
Bryant- 4 Titles*, 1 Finals MVP Award,  1 NBA MVP Award, 2 Scoring titles, NBA All Rookie Second team

I left out accolades where they are either equal (ie, NBA All Star MVP)...or where Kobe still has a shot at catching him (ie. All Star Appearances, or ALL NBA First team)

As for the accomplishments that Kobe could catch up to Jordan on...you also have to remember that Jordan played 15 seasons and took 2 breaks. Its safe to assume that in between the three peats...Jordan would have been an All NBA First team player, more than likely the scoring champ, definitely a starter in the All Star game...etc...etc.  Kobe has played 14 seasons already, so when its all said and done he will have had more years in the league...with far less accomplishments. Definintely a no brainer here lol

[sprite]

man it's the same shit around here on DubCC, people need to take like a 1-2 day layoff sometimes

all I see is like 5 people all about Lakers and 5 people who counter whatever they say because they can't stand 'em

on both sides you guys should be tired of arguing dumb points back and forth

it's like an addiction or something that you didn't shake when you were in elementary school

Laker fans and anti-Lakers on here are pathetic... trust me this is how it looks outside the bubble

[.:DaYg0sTyLz:.]

man it's the same shit around here on DubCC, people need to take like a 1-2 day layoff sometimes

all I see is like 5 people all about Lakers and 5 people who counter whatever they say because they can't stand 'em

on both sides you guys should be tired of arguing dumb points back and forth

it's like an addiction or something that you didn't shake when you were in elementary school

Laker fans and anti-Lakers on here are pathetic... trust me this is how it looks outside the bubble

Im not really anti Lakers. Its just some of the stupidity gets annoying. There are Laker fans on here who are fairly reasonable and able to distinguish themselves as fans...rather than cheerleaders. And with them, I can have objective conversations about the Lakers, or any other team.

Btw...Sprite fuckin sucks. 

[Sccit]

the only players who can compare to MJ in terms of career stats are Wilt and Lebron.  and even Lebron is about 4 PPG away from Jordan in his prime (who was about a 32 PPG guy)

the only players who can compare in the terms of winning are Bill Russell and Robert Horry lol.

lol at stats, what about in terms of skills, clutch, taking over games, being the finisher, and being the best.

its either going to be kobe or mj



none of those old school guys  come close to kobe or MJ in terms of being the best player. but MJ didnt even play against a d-wade, lebron james, chris paul, the NBA has much more talent right now than they ever did.


lebron doesnt come close, this guys overrated i wouldnt be suprised if he joins the t-mac/grant hill club by the end of the career.

I wouldnt use the level of competition as an argument FOR Kobe. It would actually hurt considering the league has turned SO much more into an offensive league geared towards allowing players to score at will or get to the line. Jordan was playing against bruising defenses where it was ok to simply knock people on their ass. Kobe would seriously curl up in a little ball and cry if he had to see Oakley, Mason or even Starks every year in the playoffs lol. Artest woudl be the soft player on those old Knicks teams.

The problem is, Kobe stans like to use stats to argue...but then when the stats go the other way they try to pretend as if stats dont matter.

You cant measure "skill" when you are talking about best EVER, because skill levels of players ALWAYS improves from generation to generation. If you took Wilt for example....Dwight Howard is more SKILLED then he ever was. And Dwight isnt that skilled by todays standards. But you would NEVER say that Howard is as great as Wilt. Different age of Basketball. You can only compare a players skill...for THEIR time. And Jordan was head and shoulders above the rest of the league. There were NEVER any questions as to whether he was the best basketball player in the world. Kobe is constantly in the midst of a debate as to whether he is the best player in the NBA right now. If you were watchin basketball during Jordans era, no one ever said that anyone else was the best. As a matter of face, Jordan was already considered the greatest all time before his career was over. Thats why Kobe can never be on his level.

This is a lie, straight up...Jordan wasn't considered the best until he won a title, in the 90s.

LOL At what point in Kobe's career was he ever considered the hands down greatest player in the game? LOL. He is ALWAYS part of a debate. My point is that Jordan wasnt part of a debate except for early in his career. And if you dont know that Jordan was considered the greatest of all time BEFORE he was done...then you simply dont know your basketball. Point blank, Kobe just can not compete with that. He is much closer to Magic than he is to Jordan in that Magic was typically part of a debate as well. You can hate it all you want, but Kobe will never been seen or respected on Jordans level. He could win the title this year...and the next 2 and would still not be considered as great as Jordan. MJs GOAT status was cemented 2/3's of the way through his career lol.

Here are just a few reasons Kobe wont catch him

Jordan- 6 Titles,  6 Finals MVP Awards, 5 NBA MVP Awards, 10 Scoring titles, 3 Steals titles, Rookie of the Year, NBA All Rookie First team, ESPN's Greatest Athlete of the 20th century
Bryant- 4 Titles*, 1 Finals MVP Award,  1 NBA MVP Award, 2 Scoring titles, NBA All Rookie Second team

I left out accolades where they are either equal (ie, NBA All Star MVP)...or where Kobe still has a shot at catching him (ie. All Star Appearances, or ALL NBA First team)

As for the accomplishments that Kobe could catch up to Jordan on...you also have to remember that Jordan played 15 seasons and took 2 breaks. Its safe to assume that in between the three peats...Jordan would have been an All NBA First team player, more than likely the scoring champ, definitely a starter in the All Star game...etc...etc.  Kobe has played 14 seasons already, so when its all said and done he will have had more years in the league...with far less accomplishments. Definintely a no brainer here lol

Whether Kobe's been considered hands down the best, or not, he's been just that, and it's evident to those who know that game...it's clear that there was no one of LeBron's marketing stature during Jordan's era...Jordan got ALL the attention, hype, and marketing ever since the day Magic stepped down. Jordan WAS the NBA. Nowadays, you have the D-Wades, the LeBron's, players who are getting just as much, if not, more attention and exposure than Kobe, while not really being on Kobe's level in terms of skills and accomplishments. The marketing aspect of it has really skewed peoples opinion. Kobe will never be the face of the NBA, the way that Jordan was. Doesn't mean he cannot surpass him in terms of skill and accomplishments...PeACe

[teecee]

the only players who can compare to MJ in terms of career stats are Wilt and Lebron.  and even Lebron is about 4 PPG away from Jordan in his prime (who was about a 32 PPG guy)

the only players who can compare in the terms of winning are Bill Russell and Robert Horry lol.

lol at stats, what about in terms of skills, clutch, taking over games, being the finisher, and being the best.

its either going to be kobe or mj



none of those old school guys  come close to kobe or MJ in terms of being the best player. but MJ didnt even play against a d-wade, lebron james, chris paul, the NBA has much more talent right now than they ever did.


lebron doesnt come close, this guys overrated i wouldnt be suprised if he joins the t-mac/grant hill club by the end of the career.

I wouldnt use the level of competition as an argument FOR Kobe. It would actually hurt considering the league has turned SO much more into an offensive league geared towards allowing players to score at will or get to the line. Jordan was playing against bruising defenses where it was ok to simply knock people on their ass. Kobe would seriously curl up in a little ball and cry if he had to see Oakley, Mason or even Starks every year in the playoffs lol. Artest woudl be the soft player on those old Knicks teams.

The problem is, Kobe stans like to use stats to argue...but then when the stats go the other way they try to pretend as if stats dont matter.

You cant measure "skill" when you are talking about best EVER, because skill levels of players ALWAYS improves from generation to generation. If you took Wilt for example....Dwight Howard is more SKILLED then he ever was. And Dwight isnt that skilled by todays standards. But you would NEVER say that Howard is as great as Wilt. Different age of Basketball. You can only compare a players skill...for THEIR time. And Jordan was head and shoulders above the rest of the league. There were NEVER any questions as to whether he was the best basketball player in the world. Kobe is constantly in the midst of a debate as to whether he is the best player in the NBA right now. If you were watchin basketball during Jordans era, no one ever said that anyone else was the best. As a matter of face, Jordan was already considered the greatest all time before his career was over. Thats why Kobe can never be on his level.

This is a lie, straight up...Jordan wasn't considered the best until he won a title, in the 90s.

LOL At what point in Kobe's career was he ever considered the hands down greatest player in the game? LOL. He is ALWAYS part of a debate. My point is that Jordan wasnt part of a debate except for early in his career. And if you dont know that Jordan was considered the greatest of all time BEFORE he was done...then you simply dont know your basketball. Point blank, Kobe just can not compete with that. He is much closer to Magic than he is to Jordan in that Magic was typically part of a debate as well. You can hate it all you want, but Kobe will never been seen or respected on Jordans level. He could win the title this year...and the next 2 and would still not be considered as great as Jordan. MJs GOAT status was cemented 2/3's of the way through his career lol.

Here are just a few reasons Kobe wont catch him

Jordan- 6 Titles,  6 Finals MVP Awards, 5 NBA MVP Awards, 10 Scoring titles, 3 Steals titles, Rookie of the Year, NBA All Rookie First team, ESPN's Greatest Athlete of the 20th century
Bryant- 4 Titles*, 1 Finals MVP Award,  1 NBA MVP Award, 2 Scoring titles, NBA All Rookie Second team

I left out accolades where they are either equal (ie, NBA All Star MVP)...or where Kobe still has a shot at catching him (ie. All Star Appearances, or ALL NBA First team)

As for the accomplishments that Kobe could catch up to Jordan on...you also have to remember that Jordan played 15 seasons and took 2 breaks. Its safe to assume that in between the three peats...Jordan would have been an All NBA First team player, more than likely the scoring champ, definitely a starter in the All Star game...etc...etc.  Kobe has played 14 seasons already, so when its all said and done he will have had more years in the league...with far less accomplishments. Definintely a no brainer here lol

Whether Kobe's been considered hands down the best, or not, he's been just that, and it's evident to those who know that game...it's clear that there was no one of LeBron's marketing stature during Jordan's era...Jordan got ALL the attention, hype, and marketing ever since the day Magic stepped down. Jordan WAS the NBA. Nowadays, you have the D-Wades, the LeBron's, players who are getting just as much, if not, more attention and exposure than Kobe, while not really being on Kobe's level in terms of skills and accomplishments. The marketing aspect of it has really skewed peoples opinion. Kobe will never be the face of the NBA, the way that Jordan was. Doesn't mean he cannot surpass him in terms of skill and accomplishments...PeACe

I agree with you on the marketing tip, BUT...how exactly, will Kobe PASS MJ in terms of accomplishments?   Forget the marketing BS, and lets talk straight on the court.  What exactly would it take?


I'd be the first to admit,, Kobe, when he is on, is a better scorer than  Mj, but MJ was more consistent and effected the game in more ways (steals, blocks, scored MORE, more assistsm rebounds, better shooting percentage, etc).

So, what does Kobe have to do, in your eyes NIK, to pass MJ in terms of accomplishments?   We both know Kobe will end up playing about 6 more seasons than Mj...so I guess Kobe will get the games played over him

[LooN3y]

seriously man everyone has their own opinions.


i can never consider magic, west, bird, russell, robertson, MJ, hakeem, etc etc the greatest because i was never there for their games, reg season, post, i never felt the games that were on the line that they won. simply because i was way too you to watch the games. i do remember some but not to the point where i can see plays happening and what not.


i can really careless about stats, and personal accomplishments, the thing that gets to me is winning and the will to win and how far the players gonna go to win it.

[.:DaYg0sTyLz:.]

the only players who can compare to MJ in terms of career stats are Wilt and Lebron.  and even Lebron is about 4 PPG away from Jordan in his prime (who was about a 32 PPG guy)

the only players who can compare in the terms of winning are Bill Russell and Robert Horry lol.

lol at stats, what about in terms of skills, clutch, taking over games, being the finisher, and being the best.

its either going to be kobe or mj



none of those old school guys  come close to kobe or MJ in terms of being the best player. but MJ didnt even play against a d-wade, lebron james, chris paul, the NBA has much more talent right now than they ever did.


lebron doesnt come close, this guys overrated i wouldnt be suprised if he joins the t-mac/grant hill club by the end of the career.

I wouldnt use the level of competition as an argument FOR Kobe. It would actually hurt considering the league has turned SO much more into an offensive league geared towards allowing players to score at will or get to the line. Jordan was playing against bruising defenses where it was ok to simply knock people on their ass. Kobe would seriously curl up in a little ball and cry if he had to see Oakley, Mason or even Starks every year in the playoffs lol. Artest woudl be the soft player on those old Knicks teams.

The problem is, Kobe stans like to use stats to argue...but then when the stats go the other way they try to pretend as if stats dont matter.

You cant measure "skill" when you are talking about best EVER, because skill levels of players ALWAYS improves from generation to generation. If you took Wilt for example....Dwight Howard is more SKILLED then he ever was. And Dwight isnt that skilled by todays standards. But you would NEVER say that Howard is as great as Wilt. Different age of Basketball. You can only compare a players skill...for THEIR time. And Jordan was head and shoulders above the rest of the league. There were NEVER any questions as to whether he was the best basketball player in the world. Kobe is constantly in the midst of a debate as to whether he is the best player in the NBA right now. If you were watchin basketball during Jordans era, no one ever said that anyone else was the best. As a matter of face, Jordan was already considered the greatest all time before his career was over. Thats why Kobe can never be on his level.

This is a lie, straight up...Jordan wasn't considered the best until he won a title, in the 90s.

LOL At what point in Kobe's career was he ever considered the hands down greatest player in the game? LOL. He is ALWAYS part of a debate. My point is that Jordan wasnt part of a debate except for early in his career. And if you dont know that Jordan was considered the greatest of all time BEFORE he was done...then you simply dont know your basketball. Point blank, Kobe just can not compete with that. He is much closer to Magic than he is to Jordan in that Magic was typically part of a debate as well. You can hate it all you want, but Kobe will never been seen or respected on Jordans level. He could win the title this year...and the next 2 and would still not be considered as great as Jordan. MJs GOAT status was cemented 2/3's of the way through his career lol.

Here are just a few reasons Kobe wont catch him

Jordan- 6 Titles,  6 Finals MVP Awards, 5 NBA MVP Awards, 10 Scoring titles, 3 Steals titles, Rookie of the Year, NBA All Rookie First team, ESPN's Greatest Athlete of the 20th century
Bryant- 4 Titles*, 1 Finals MVP Award,  1 NBA MVP Award, 2 Scoring titles, NBA All Rookie Second team

I left out accolades where they are either equal (ie, NBA All Star MVP)...or where Kobe still has a shot at catching him (ie. All Star Appearances, or ALL NBA First team)

As for the accomplishments that Kobe could catch up to Jordan on...you also have to remember that Jordan played 15 seasons and took 2 breaks. Its safe to assume that in between the three peats...Jordan would have been an All NBA First team player, more than likely the scoring champ, definitely a starter in the All Star game...etc...etc.  Kobe has played 14 seasons already, so when its all said and done he will have had more years in the league...with far less accomplishments. Definintely a no brainer here lol

Whether Kobe's been considered hands down the best, or not, he's been just that, and it's evident to those who know that game...it's clear that there was no one of LeBron's marketing stature during Jordan's era...Jordan got ALL the attention, hype, and marketing ever since the day Magic stepped down. Jordan WAS the NBA. Nowadays, you have the D-Wades, the LeBron's, players who are getting just as much, if not, more attention and exposure than Kobe, while not really being on Kobe's level in terms of skills and accomplishments. The marketing aspect of it has really skewed peoples opinion. Kobe will never be the face of the NBA, the way that Jordan was. Doesn't mean he cannot surpass him in terms of skill and accomplishments...PeACe

I agree with you on the marketing tip, BUT...how exactly, will Kobe PASS MJ in terms of accomplishments?   Forget the marketing BS, and lets talk straight on the court.  What exactly would it take?


I'd be the first to admit,, Kobe, when he is on, is a better scorer than  Mj, but MJ was more consistent and effected the game in more ways (steals, blocks, scored MORE, more assistsm rebounds, better shooting percentage, etc).

So, what does Kobe have to do, in your eyes NIK, to pass MJ in terms of accomplishments?   We both know Kobe will end up playing about 6 more seasons than Mj...so I guess Kobe will get the games played over him

I dont even see how Kobe is a better scorer than MJ lol. Kobe plays in a completely different era where the league has really encouraged offense with its rule changes AND where defensive teams arent as good defensively as they were in MJ's era. Also, 10 scoring titles to 2 scoring titles for Kobe. 8 times averaging over 30 ppg in a season to 3 for Kobe. After next year Kobe will have the same amount of years played as Jordan (again, since Jordan left twice). I doubt next year Kobe will get 8 scoring titles to catch Jordan lol Kobe's 81 point game is all that helps him in this argument. But does it really? He scored MORE points then Jordan did in his 69 point game. But he wasnt more efficient, he just shot more.

Stat Lines   Points  Rebs  Assts  Steals  FGM  FGA  FG%

Jordan-        69      18      6        4       23    37   .621
Bryant-        81       6       2        3       28    46   .608

[Sccit]

the only players who can compare to MJ in terms of career stats are Wilt and Lebron.  and even Lebron is about 4 PPG away from Jordan in his prime (who was about a 32 PPG guy)

the only players who can compare in the terms of winning are Bill Russell and Robert Horry lol.

lol at stats, what about in terms of skills, clutch, taking over games, being the finisher, and being the best.

its either going to be kobe or mj



none of those old school guys  come close to kobe or MJ in terms of being the best player. but MJ didnt even play against a d-wade, lebron james, chris paul, the NBA has much more talent right now than they ever did.


lebron doesnt come close, this guys overrated i wouldnt be suprised if he joins the t-mac/grant hill club by the end of the career.

I wouldnt use the level of competition as an argument FOR Kobe. It would actually hurt considering the league has turned SO much more into an offensive league geared towards allowing players to score at will or get to the line. Jordan was playing against bruising defenses where it was ok to simply knock people on their ass. Kobe would seriously curl up in a little ball and cry if he had to see Oakley, Mason or even Starks every year in the playoffs lol. Artest woudl be the soft player on those old Knicks teams.

The problem is, Kobe stans like to use stats to argue...but then when the stats go the other way they try to pretend as if stats dont matter.

You cant measure "skill" when you are talking about best EVER, because skill levels of players ALWAYS improves from generation to generation. If you took Wilt for example....Dwight Howard is more SKILLED then he ever was. And Dwight isnt that skilled by todays standards. But you would NEVER say that Howard is as great as Wilt. Different age of Basketball. You can only compare a players skill...for THEIR time. And Jordan was head and shoulders above the rest of the league. There were NEVER any questions as to whether he was the best basketball player in the world. Kobe is constantly in the midst of a debate as to whether he is the best player in the NBA right now. If you were watchin basketball during Jordans era, no one ever said that anyone else was the best. As a matter of face, Jordan was already considered the greatest all time before his career was over. Thats why Kobe can never be on his level.

This is a lie, straight up...Jordan wasn't considered the best until he won a title, in the 90s.

LOL At what point in Kobe's career was he ever considered the hands down greatest player in the game? LOL. He is ALWAYS part of a debate. My point is that Jordan wasnt part of a debate except for early in his career. And if you dont know that Jordan was considered the greatest of all time BEFORE he was done...then you simply dont know your basketball. Point blank, Kobe just can not compete with that. He is much closer to Magic than he is to Jordan in that Magic was typically part of a debate as well. You can hate it all you want, but Kobe will never been seen or respected on Jordans level. He could win the title this year...and the next 2 and would still not be considered as great as Jordan. MJs GOAT status was cemented 2/3's of the way through his career lol.

Here are just a few reasons Kobe wont catch him

Jordan- 6 Titles,  6 Finals MVP Awards, 5 NBA MVP Awards, 10 Scoring titles, 3 Steals titles, Rookie of the Year, NBA All Rookie First team, ESPN's Greatest Athlete of the 20th century
Bryant- 4 Titles*, 1 Finals MVP Award,  1 NBA MVP Award, 2 Scoring titles, NBA All Rookie Second team

I left out accolades where they are either equal (ie, NBA All Star MVP)...or where Kobe still has a shot at catching him (ie. All Star Appearances, or ALL NBA First team)

As for the accomplishments that Kobe could catch up to Jordan on...you also have to remember that Jordan played 15 seasons and took 2 breaks. Its safe to assume that in between the three peats...Jordan would have been an All NBA First team player, more than likely the scoring champ, definitely a starter in the All Star game...etc...etc.  Kobe has played 14 seasons already, so when its all said and done he will have had more years in the league...with far less accomplishments. Definintely a no brainer here lol

Whether Kobe's been considered hands down the best, or not, he's been just that, and it's evident to those who know that game...it's clear that there was no one of LeBron's marketing stature during Jordan's era...Jordan got ALL the attention, hype, and marketing ever since the day Magic stepped down. Jordan WAS the NBA. Nowadays, you have the D-Wades, the LeBron's, players who are getting just as much, if not, more attention and exposure than Kobe, while not really being on Kobe's level in terms of skills and accomplishments. The marketing aspect of it has really skewed peoples opinion. Kobe will never be the face of the NBA, the way that Jordan was. Doesn't mean he cannot surpass him in terms of skill and accomplishments...PeACe

I agree with you on the marketing tip, BUT...how exactly, will Kobe PASS MJ in terms of accomplishments?   Forget the marketing BS, and lets talk straight on the court.  What exactly would it take?


I'd be the first to admit,, Kobe, when he is on, is a better scorer than  Mj, but MJ was more consistent and effected the game in more ways (steals, blocks, scored MORE, more assistsm rebounds, better shooting percentage, etc).

So, what does Kobe have to do, in your eyes NIK, to pass MJ in terms of accomplishments?   We both know Kobe will end up playing about 6 more seasons than Mj...so I guess Kobe will get the games played over him

I dont even see how Kobe is a better scorer than MJ lol. Kobe plays in a completely different era where the league has really encouraged offense with its rule changes AND where defensive teams arent as good defensively as they were in MJ's era. Also, 10 scoring titles to 2 scoring titles for Kobe. 8 times averaging over 30 ppg in a season to 3 for Kobe. After next year Kobe will have the same amount of years played as Jordan (again, since Jordan left twice). I doubt next year Kobe will get 8 scoring titles to catch Jordan lol Kobe's 81 point game is all that helps him in this argument. But does it really? He scored MORE points then Jordan did in his 69 point game. But he wasnt more efficient, he just shot more.

Stat Lines   Points  Rebs  Assts  Steals  FGM  FGA  FG%

Jordan-        69      18      6        4       23    37   .621
Bryant-        81       6       2        3       28    46   .608

it doesnt matter, Jordan has put up more field goal attempts than Kobe has, and has never scored that much...and you're forgetting, Jordan was untouchable. you literally couldn't breathe on Jordan without getting the foul called on you. the NBA made him untouchable, and Kobe clearly does not get anywhere near that amount of respect from the officials. I mean, you see how much Kobe gets hammered without the call being made...that NEVER would happen to Jordan...EVER. Jordan had it so much better, it's ridiculous. also, Jordan never faced a team like the Celtics in the Finals, with such tenacious defense..I mean, really, look at what Jordan went through in that threepeat run...the Jazz and the Sonics...LOL. Good teams, no doubt, but come on, now.

[teecee]

the only players who can compare to MJ in terms of career stats are Wilt and Lebron.  and even Lebron is about 4 PPG away from Jordan in his prime (who was about a 32 PPG guy)

the only players who can compare in the terms of winning are Bill Russell and Robert Horry lol.

lol at stats, what about in terms of skills, clutch, taking over games, being the finisher, and being the best.

its either going to be kobe or mj



none of those old school guys  come close to kobe or MJ in terms of being the best player. but MJ didnt even play against a d-wade, lebron james, chris paul, the NBA has much more talent right now than they ever did.


lebron doesnt come close, this guys overrated i wouldnt be suprised if he joins the t-mac/grant hill club by the end of the career.

I wouldnt use the level of competition as an argument FOR Kobe. It would actually hurt considering the league has turned SO much more into an offensive league geared towards allowing players to score at will or get to the line. Jordan was playing against bruising defenses where it was ok to simply knock people on their ass. Kobe would seriously curl up in a little ball and cry if he had to see Oakley, Mason or even Starks every year in the playoffs lol. Artest woudl be the soft player on those old Knicks teams.

The problem is, Kobe stans like to use stats to argue...but then when the stats go the other way they try to pretend as if stats dont matter.

You cant measure "skill" when you are talking about best EVER, because skill levels of players ALWAYS improves from generation to generation. If you took Wilt for example....Dwight Howard is more SKILLED then he ever was. And Dwight isnt that skilled by todays standards. But you would NEVER say that Howard is as great as Wilt. Different age of Basketball. You can only compare a players skill...for THEIR time. And Jordan was head and shoulders above the rest of the league. There were NEVER any questions as to whether he was the best basketball player in the world. Kobe is constantly in the midst of a debate as to whether he is the best player in the NBA right now. If you were watchin basketball during Jordans era, no one ever said that anyone else was the best. As a matter of face, Jordan was already considered the greatest all time before his career was over. Thats why Kobe can never be on his level.

This is a lie, straight up...Jordan wasn't considered the best until he won a title, in the 90s.

LOL At what point in Kobe's career was he ever considered the hands down greatest player in the game? LOL. He is ALWAYS part of a debate. My point is that Jordan wasnt part of a debate except for early in his career. And if you dont know that Jordan was considered the greatest of all time BEFORE he was done...then you simply dont know your basketball. Point blank, Kobe just can not compete with that. He is much closer to Magic than he is to Jordan in that Magic was typically part of a debate as well. You can hate it all you want, but Kobe will never been seen or respected on Jordans level. He could win the title this year...and the next 2 and would still not be considered as great as Jordan. MJs GOAT status was cemented 2/3's of the way through his career lol.

Here are just a few reasons Kobe wont catch him

Jordan- 6 Titles,  6 Finals MVP Awards, 5 NBA MVP Awards, 10 Scoring titles, 3 Steals titles, Rookie of the Year, NBA All Rookie First team, ESPN's Greatest Athlete of the 20th century
Bryant- 4 Titles*, 1 Finals MVP Award,  1 NBA MVP Award, 2 Scoring titles, NBA All Rookie Second team

I left out accolades where they are either equal (ie, NBA All Star MVP)...or where Kobe still has a shot at catching him (ie. All Star Appearances, or ALL NBA First team)

As for the accomplishments that Kobe could catch up to Jordan on...you also have to remember that Jordan played 15 seasons and took 2 breaks. Its safe to assume that in between the three peats...Jordan would have been an All NBA First team player, more than likely the scoring champ, definitely a starter in the All Star game...etc...etc.  Kobe has played 14 seasons already, so when its all said and done he will have had more years in the league...with far less accomplishments. Definintely a no brainer here lol

Whether Kobe's been considered hands down the best, or not, he's been just that, and it's evident to those who know that game...it's clear that there was no one of LeBron's marketing stature during Jordan's era...Jordan got ALL the attention, hype, and marketing ever since the day Magic stepped down. Jordan WAS the NBA. Nowadays, you have the D-Wades, the LeBron's, players who are getting just as much, if not, more attention and exposure than Kobe, while not really being on Kobe's level in terms of skills and accomplishments. The marketing aspect of it has really skewed peoples opinion. Kobe will never be the face of the NBA, the way that Jordan was. Doesn't mean he cannot surpass him in terms of skill and accomplishments...PeACe

I agree with you on the marketing tip, BUT...how exactly, will Kobe PASS MJ in terms of accomplishments?   Forget the marketing BS, and lets talk straight on the court.  What exactly would it take?


I'd be the first to admit,, Kobe, when he is on, is a better scorer than  Mj, but MJ was more consistent and effected the game in more ways (steals, blocks, scored MORE, more assistsm rebounds, better shooting percentage, etc).

So, what does Kobe have to do, in your eyes NIK, to pass MJ in terms of accomplishments?   We both know Kobe will end up playing about 6 more seasons than Mj...so I guess Kobe will get the games played over him

I dont even see how Kobe is a better scorer than MJ lol. Kobe plays in a completely different era where the league has really encouraged offense with its rule changes AND where defensive teams arent as good defensively as they were in MJ's era. Also, 10 scoring titles to 2 scoring titles for Kobe. 8 times averaging over 30 ppg in a season to 3 for Kobe. After next year Kobe will have the same amount of years played as Jordan (again, since Jordan left twice). I doubt next year Kobe will get 8 scoring titles to catch Jordan lol Kobe's 81 point game is all that helps him in this argument. But does it really? He scored MORE points then Jordan did in his 69 point game. But he wasnt more efficient, he just shot more.

Stat Lines   Points  Rebs  Assts  Steals  FGM  FGA  FG%

Jordan-        69      18      6        4       23    37   .621
Bryant-        81       6       2        3       28    46   .608

it doesnt matter, Jordan has put up more field goal attempts than Kobe has, and has never scored that much...and you're forgetting, Jordan was untouchable. you literally couldn't breathe on Jordan without getting the foul called on you. the NBA made him untouchable, and Kobe clearly does not get anywhere near that amount of respect from the officials. I mean, you see how much Kobe gets hammered without the call being made...that NEVER would happen to Jordan...EVER. Jordan had it so much better, it's ridiculous. also, Jordan never faced a team like the Celtics in the Finals, with such tenacious defense..I mean, really, look at what Jordan went through in that threepeat run...the Jazz and the Sonics...LOL. Good teams, no doubt, but come on, now.

I WILL admit the Celtics are a great defenseive team, but wouldn't you say Garnett, Allen and Pierce are all on the downslide of their careers?  None of them played conistently well in the series...

[Shallow]

the only players who can compare to MJ in terms of career stats are Wilt and Lebron.  and even Lebron is about 4 PPG away from Jordan in his prime (who was about a 32 PPG guy)

the only players who can compare in the terms of winning are Bill Russell and Robert Horry lol.

lol at stats, what about in terms of skills, clutch, taking over games, being the finisher, and being the best.

its either going to be kobe or mj



none of those old school guys  come close to kobe or MJ in terms of being the best player. but MJ didnt even play against a d-wade, lebron james, chris paul, the NBA has much more talent right now than they ever did.


lebron doesnt come close, this guys overrated i wouldnt be suprised if he joins the t-mac/grant hill club by the end of the career.

I wouldnt use the level of competition as an argument FOR Kobe. It would actually hurt considering the league has turned SO much more into an offensive league geared towards allowing players to score at will or get to the line. Jordan was playing against bruising defenses where it was ok to simply knock people on their ass. Kobe would seriously curl up in a little ball and cry if he had to see Oakley, Mason or even Starks every year in the playoffs lol. Artest woudl be the soft player on those old Knicks teams.

The problem is, Kobe stans like to use stats to argue...but then when the stats go the other way they try to pretend as if stats dont matter.

You cant measure "skill" when you are talking about best EVER, because skill levels of players ALWAYS improves from generation to generation. If you took Wilt for example....Dwight Howard is more SKILLED then he ever was. And Dwight isnt that skilled by todays standards. But you would NEVER say that Howard is as great as Wilt. Different age of Basketball. You can only compare a players skill...for THEIR time. And Jordan was head and shoulders above the rest of the league. There were NEVER any questions as to whether he was the best basketball player in the world. Kobe is constantly in the midst of a debate as to whether he is the best player in the NBA right now. If you were watchin basketball during Jordans era, no one ever said that anyone else was the best. As a matter of face, Jordan was already considered the greatest all time before his career was over. Thats why Kobe can never be on his level.

This is a lie, straight up...Jordan wasn't considered the best until he won a title, in the 90s.

LOL At what point in Kobe's career was he ever considered the hands down greatest player in the game? LOL. He is ALWAYS part of a debate. My point is that Jordan wasnt part of a debate except for early in his career. And if you dont know that Jordan was considered the greatest of all time BEFORE he was done...then you simply dont know your basketball. Point blank, Kobe just can not compete with that. He is much closer to Magic than he is to Jordan in that Magic was typically part of a debate as well. You can hate it all you want, but Kobe will never been seen or respected on Jordans level. He could win the title this year...and the next 2 and would still not be considered as great as Jordan. MJs GOAT status was cemented 2/3's of the way through his career lol.

Here are just a few reasons Kobe wont catch him

Jordan- 6 Titles,  6 Finals MVP Awards, 5 NBA MVP Awards, 10 Scoring titles, 3 Steals titles, Rookie of the Year, NBA All Rookie First team, ESPN's Greatest Athlete of the 20th century
Bryant- 4 Titles*, 1 Finals MVP Award,  1 NBA MVP Award, 2 Scoring titles, NBA All Rookie Second team

I left out accolades where they are either equal (ie, NBA All Star MVP)...or where Kobe still has a shot at catching him (ie. All Star Appearances, or ALL NBA First team)

As for the accomplishments that Kobe could catch up to Jordan on...you also have to remember that Jordan played 15 seasons and took 2 breaks. Its safe to assume that in between the three peats...Jordan would have been an All NBA First team player, more than likely the scoring champ, definitely a starter in the All Star game...etc...etc.  Kobe has played 14 seasons already, so when its all said and done he will have had more years in the league...with far less accomplishments. Definintely a no brainer here lol

Whether Kobe's been considered hands down the best, or not, he's been just that, and it's evident to those who know that game...it's clear that there was no one of LeBron's marketing stature during Jordan's era...Jordan got ALL the attention, hype, and marketing ever since the day Magic stepped down. Jordan WAS the NBA. Nowadays, you have the D-Wades, the LeBron's, players who are getting just as much, if not, more attention and exposure than Kobe, while not really being on Kobe's level in terms of skills and accomplishments. The marketing aspect of it has really skewed peoples opinion. Kobe will never be the face of the NBA, the way that Jordan was. Doesn't mean he cannot surpass him in terms of skill and accomplishments...PeACe

I agree with you on the marketing tip, BUT...how exactly, will Kobe PASS MJ in terms of accomplishments?   Forget the marketing BS, and lets talk straight on the court.  What exactly would it take?


I'd be the first to admit,, Kobe, when he is on, is a better scorer than  Mj, but MJ was more consistent and effected the game in more ways (steals, blocks, scored MORE, more assistsm rebounds, better shooting percentage, etc).

So, what does Kobe have to do, in your eyes NIK, to pass MJ in terms of accomplishments?   We both know Kobe will end up playing about 6 more seasons than Mj...so I guess Kobe will get the games played over him

I dont even see how Kobe is a better scorer than MJ lol. Kobe plays in a completely different era where the league has really encouraged offense with its rule changes AND where defensive teams arent as good defensively as they were in MJ's era. Also, 10 scoring titles to 2 scoring titles for Kobe. 8 times averaging over 30 ppg in a season to 3 for Kobe. After next year Kobe will have the same amount of years played as Jordan (again, since Jordan left twice). I doubt next year Kobe will get 8 scoring titles to catch Jordan lol Kobe's 81 point game is all that helps him in this argument. But does it really? He scored MORE points then Jordan did in his 69 point game. But he wasnt more efficient, he just shot more.

Stat Lines   Points  Rebs  Assts  Steals  FGM  FGA  FG%

Jordan-        69      18      6        4       23    37   .621
Bryant-        81       6       2        3       28    46   .608

it doesnt matter, Jordan has put up more field goal attempts than Kobe has, and has never scored that much...and you're forgetting, Jordan was untouchable. you literally couldn't breathe on Jordan without getting the foul called on you. the NBA made him untouchable, and Kobe clearly does not get anywhere near that amount of respect from the officials. I mean, you see how much Kobe gets hammered without the call being made...that NEVER would happen to Jordan...EVER. Jordan had it so much better, it's ridiculous. also, Jordan never faced a team like the Celtics in the Finals, with such tenacious defense..I mean, really, look at what Jordan went through in that threepeat run...the Jazz and the Sonics...LOL. Good teams, no doubt, but come on, now.

As good as Boston's defense was their egos on offense and a complete lack of discipline more than made up for it. Why was Rondo covering Gasol on that play? Because one of the big headed stars of Boston decided to do something else. Because of the egos and blatant selfishness this Boston team was not as hard to beat as some of those early 90s Knicks or Suns teams. These Celts have more talent but they don't know how to play as a team as well as they should.

[Sccit]

the only players who can compare to MJ in terms of career stats are Wilt and Lebron.  and even Lebron is about 4 PPG away from Jordan in his prime (who was about a 32 PPG guy)

the only players who can compare in the terms of winning are Bill Russell and Robert Horry lol.

lol at stats, what about in terms of skills, clutch, taking over games, being the finisher, and being the best.

its either going to be kobe or mj



none of those old school guys  come close to kobe or MJ in terms of being the best player. but MJ didnt even play against a d-wade, lebron james, chris paul, the NBA has much more talent right now than they ever did.


lebron doesnt come close, this guys overrated i wouldnt be suprised if he joins the t-mac/grant hill club by the end of the career.

I wouldnt use the level of competition as an argument FOR Kobe. It would actually hurt considering the league has turned SO much more into an offensive league geared towards allowing players to score at will or get to the line. Jordan was playing against bruising defenses where it was ok to simply knock people on their ass. Kobe would seriously curl up in a little ball and cry if he had to see Oakley, Mason or even Starks every year in the playoffs lol. Artest woudl be the soft player on those old Knicks teams.

The problem is, Kobe stans like to use stats to argue...but then when the stats go the other way they try to pretend as if stats dont matter.

You cant measure "skill" when you are talking about best EVER, because skill levels of players ALWAYS improves from generation to generation. If you took Wilt for example....Dwight Howard is more SKILLED then he ever was. And Dwight isnt that skilled by todays standards. But you would NEVER say that Howard is as great as Wilt. Different age of Basketball. You can only compare a players skill...for THEIR time. And Jordan was head and shoulders above the rest of the league. There were NEVER any questions as to whether he was the best basketball player in the world. Kobe is constantly in the midst of a debate as to whether he is the best player in the NBA right now. If you were watchin basketball during Jordans era, no one ever said that anyone else was the best. As a matter of face, Jordan was already considered the greatest all time before his career was over. Thats why Kobe can never be on his level.

This is a lie, straight up...Jordan wasn't considered the best until he won a title, in the 90s.

LOL At what point in Kobe's career was he ever considered the hands down greatest player in the game? LOL. He is ALWAYS part of a debate. My point is that Jordan wasnt part of a debate except for early in his career. And if you dont know that Jordan was considered the greatest of all time BEFORE he was done...then you simply dont know your basketball. Point blank, Kobe just can not compete with that. He is much closer to Magic than he is to Jordan in that Magic was typically part of a debate as well. You can hate it all you want, but Kobe will never been seen or respected on Jordans level. He could win the title this year...and the next 2 and would still not be considered as great as Jordan. MJs GOAT status was cemented 2/3's of the way through his career lol.

Here are just a few reasons Kobe wont catch him

Jordan- 6 Titles,  6 Finals MVP Awards, 5 NBA MVP Awards, 10 Scoring titles, 3 Steals titles, Rookie of the Year, NBA All Rookie First team, ESPN's Greatest Athlete of the 20th century
Bryant- 4 Titles*, 1 Finals MVP Award,  1 NBA MVP Award, 2 Scoring titles, NBA All Rookie Second team

I left out accolades where they are either equal (ie, NBA All Star MVP)...or where Kobe still has a shot at catching him (ie. All Star Appearances, or ALL NBA First team)

As for the accomplishments that Kobe could catch up to Jordan on...you also have to remember that Jordan played 15 seasons and took 2 breaks. Its safe to assume that in between the three peats...Jordan would have been an All NBA First team player, more than likely the scoring champ, definitely a starter in the All Star game...etc...etc.  Kobe has played 14 seasons already, so when its all said and done he will have had more years in the league...with far less accomplishments. Definintely a no brainer here lol

Whether Kobe's been considered hands down the best, or not, he's been just that, and it's evident to those who know that game...it's clear that there was no one of LeBron's marketing stature during Jordan's era...Jordan got ALL the attention, hype, and marketing ever since the day Magic stepped down. Jordan WAS the NBA. Nowadays, you have the D-Wades, the LeBron's, players who are getting just as much, if not, more attention and exposure than Kobe, while not really being on Kobe's level in terms of skills and accomplishments. The marketing aspect of it has really skewed peoples opinion. Kobe will never be the face of the NBA, the way that Jordan was. Doesn't mean he cannot surpass him in terms of skill and accomplishments...PeACe

I agree with you on the marketing tip, BUT...how exactly, will Kobe PASS MJ in terms of accomplishments?   Forget the marketing BS, and lets talk straight on the court.  What exactly would it take?


I'd be the first to admit,, Kobe, when he is on, is a better scorer than  Mj, but MJ was more consistent and effected the game in more ways (steals, blocks, scored MORE, more assistsm rebounds, better shooting percentage, etc).

So, what does Kobe have to do, in your eyes NIK, to pass MJ in terms of accomplishments?   We both know Kobe will end up playing about 6 more seasons than Mj...so I guess Kobe will get the games played over him

I dont even see how Kobe is a better scorer than MJ lol. Kobe plays in a completely different era where the league has really encouraged offense with its rule changes AND where defensive teams arent as good defensively as they were in MJ's era. Also, 10 scoring titles to 2 scoring titles for Kobe. 8 times averaging over 30 ppg in a season to 3 for Kobe. After next year Kobe will have the same amount of years played as Jordan (again, since Jordan left twice). I doubt next year Kobe will get 8 scoring titles to catch Jordan lol Kobe's 81 point game is all that helps him in this argument. But does it really? He scored MORE points then Jordan did in his 69 point game. But he wasnt more efficient, he just shot more.

Stat Lines   Points  Rebs  Assts  Steals  FGM  FGA  FG%

Jordan-        69      18      6        4       23    37   .621
Bryant-        81       6       2        3       28    46   .608

it doesnt matter, Jordan has put up more field goal attempts than Kobe has, and has never scored that much...and you're forgetting, Jordan was untouchable. you literally couldn't breathe on Jordan without getting the foul called on you. the NBA made him untouchable, and Kobe clearly does not get anywhere near that amount of respect from the officials. I mean, you see how much Kobe gets hammered without the call being made...that NEVER would happen to Jordan...EVER. Jordan had it so much better, it's ridiculous. also, Jordan never faced a team like the Celtics in the Finals, with such tenacious defense..I mean, really, look at what Jordan went through in that threepeat run...the Jazz and the Sonics...LOL. Good teams, no doubt, but come on, now.

I WILL admit the Celtics are a great defenseive team, but wouldn't you say Garnett, Allen and Pierce are all on the downslide of their careers?  None of them played conistently well in the series...

of course the celtic big 3 aren't in the prime of their career, but as a unit, they play great team ball...one of the best team ball units i've ever seen, by far. and people need to quit acting like jordan was something else, cuz he once clinched a finals series with a 5-19 FG performance, and that was against a decent defense, at best...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199606160CHI.html


and I don't remember Jordan ever grabbing 15 boards in a Finals game either......give credit where it's due.

[Sccit]

the only players who can compare to MJ in terms of career stats are Wilt and Lebron.  and even Lebron is about 4 PPG away from Jordan in his prime (who was about a 32 PPG guy)

the only players who can compare in the terms of winning are Bill Russell and Robert Horry lol.

lol at stats, what about in terms of skills, clutch, taking over games, being the finisher, and being the best.

its either going to be kobe or mj



none of those old school guys  come close to kobe or MJ in terms of being the best player. but MJ didnt even play against a d-wade, lebron james, chris paul, the NBA has much more talent right now than they ever did.


lebron doesnt come close, this guys overrated i wouldnt be suprised if he joins the t-mac/grant hill club by the end of the career.

I wouldnt use the level of competition as an argument FOR Kobe. It would actually hurt considering the league has turned SO much more into an offensive league geared towards allowing players to score at will or get to the line. Jordan was playing against bruising defenses where it was ok to simply knock people on their ass. Kobe would seriously curl up in a little ball and cry if he had to see Oakley, Mason or even Starks every year in the playoffs lol. Artest woudl be the soft player on those old Knicks teams.

The problem is, Kobe stans like to use stats to argue...but then when the stats go the other way they try to pretend as if stats dont matter.

You cant measure "skill" when you are talking about best EVER, because skill levels of players ALWAYS improves from generation to generation. If you took Wilt for example....Dwight Howard is more SKILLED then he ever was. And Dwight isnt that skilled by todays standards. But you would NEVER say that Howard is as great as Wilt. Different age of Basketball. You can only compare a players skill...for THEIR time. And Jordan was head and shoulders above the rest of the league. There were NEVER any questions as to whether he was the best basketball player in the world. Kobe is constantly in the midst of a debate as to whether he is the best player in the NBA right now. If you were watchin basketball during Jordans era, no one ever said that anyone else was the best. As a matter of face, Jordan was already considered the greatest all time before his career was over. Thats why Kobe can never be on his level.

This is a lie, straight up...Jordan wasn't considered the best until he won a title, in the 90s.

LOL At what point in Kobe's career was he ever considered the hands down greatest player in the game? LOL. He is ALWAYS part of a debate. My point is that Jordan wasnt part of a debate except for early in his career. And if you dont know that Jordan was considered the greatest of all time BEFORE he was done...then you simply dont know your basketball. Point blank, Kobe just can not compete with that. He is much closer to Magic than he is to Jordan in that Magic was typically part of a debate as well. You can hate it all you want, but Kobe will never been seen or respected on Jordans level. He could win the title this year...and the next 2 and would still not be considered as great as Jordan. MJs GOAT status was cemented 2/3's of the way through his career lol.

Here are just a few reasons Kobe wont catch him

Jordan- 6 Titles,  6 Finals MVP Awards, 5 NBA MVP Awards, 10 Scoring titles, 3 Steals titles, Rookie of the Year, NBA All Rookie First team, ESPN's Greatest Athlete of the 20th century
Bryant- 4 Titles*, 1 Finals MVP Award,  1 NBA MVP Award, 2 Scoring titles, NBA All Rookie Second team

I left out accolades where they are either equal (ie, NBA All Star MVP)...or where Kobe still has a shot at catching him (ie. All Star Appearances, or ALL NBA First team)

As for the accomplishments that Kobe could catch up to Jordan on...you also have to remember that Jordan played 15 seasons and took 2 breaks. Its safe to assume that in between the three peats...Jordan would have been an All NBA First team player, more than likely the scoring champ, definitely a starter in the All Star game...etc...etc.  Kobe has played 14 seasons already, so when its all said and done he will have had more years in the league...with far less accomplishments. Definintely a no brainer here lol

Whether Kobe's been considered hands down the best, or not, he's been just that, and it's evident to those who know that game...it's clear that there was no one of LeBron's marketing stature during Jordan's era...Jordan got ALL the attention, hype, and marketing ever since the day Magic stepped down. Jordan WAS the NBA. Nowadays, you have the D-Wades, the LeBron's, players who are getting just as much, if not, more attention and exposure than Kobe, while not really being on Kobe's level in terms of skills and accomplishments. The marketing aspect of it has really skewed peoples opinion. Kobe will never be the face of the NBA, the way that Jordan was. Doesn't mean he cannot surpass him in terms of skill and accomplishments...PeACe

I agree with you on the marketing tip, BUT...how exactly, will Kobe PASS MJ in terms of accomplishments?   Forget the marketing BS, and lets talk straight on the court.  What exactly would it take?


I'd be the first to admit,, Kobe, when he is on, is a better scorer than  Mj, but MJ was more consistent and effected the game in more ways (steals, blocks, scored MORE, more assistsm rebounds, better shooting percentage, etc).

So, what does Kobe have to do, in your eyes NIK, to pass MJ in terms of accomplishments?   We both know Kobe will end up playing about 6 more seasons than Mj...so I guess Kobe will get the games played over him

I dont even see how Kobe is a better scorer than MJ lol. Kobe plays in a completely different era where the league has really encouraged offense with its rule changes AND where defensive teams arent as good defensively as they were in MJ's era. Also, 10 scoring titles to 2 scoring titles for Kobe. 8 times averaging over 30 ppg in a season to 3 for Kobe. After next year Kobe will have the same amount of years played as Jordan (again, since Jordan left twice). I doubt next year Kobe will get 8 scoring titles to catch Jordan lol Kobe's 81 point game is all that helps him in this argument. But does it really? He scored MORE points then Jordan did in his 69 point game. But he wasnt more efficient, he just shot more.

Stat Lines   Points  Rebs  Assts  Steals  FGM  FGA  FG%

Jordan-        69      18      6        4       23    37   .621
Bryant-        81       6       2        3       28    46   .608

it doesnt matter, Jordan has put up more field goal attempts than Kobe has, and has never scored that much...and you're forgetting, Jordan was untouchable. you literally couldn't breathe on Jordan without getting the foul called on you. the NBA made him untouchable, and Kobe clearly does not get anywhere near that amount of respect from the officials. I mean, you see how much Kobe gets hammered without the call being made...that NEVER would happen to Jordan...EVER. Jordan had it so much better, it's ridiculous. also, Jordan never faced a team like the Celtics in the Finals, with such tenacious defense..I mean, really, look at what Jordan went through in that threepeat run...the Jazz and the Sonics...LOL. Good teams, no doubt, but come on, now.

As good as Boston's defense was their egos on offense and a complete lack of discipline more than made up for it. Why was Rondo covering Gasol on that play? Because one of the big headed stars of Boston decided to do something else. Because of the egos and blatant selfishness this Boston team was not as hard to beat as some of those early 90s Knicks or Suns teams. These Celts have more talent but they don't know how to play as a team as well as they should.

I have no idea what you're talking about..they play great as a unit, and not individually, and that's what made them get this far.

[.:DaYg0sTyLz:.]

the only players who can compare to MJ in terms of career stats are Wilt and Lebron.  and even Lebron is about 4 PPG away from Jordan in his prime (who was about a 32 PPG guy)

the only players who can compare in the terms of winning are Bill Russell and Robert Horry lol.

lol at stats, what about in terms of skills, clutch, taking over games, being the finisher, and being the best.

its either going to be kobe or mj



none of those old school guys  come close to kobe or MJ in terms of being the best player. but MJ didnt even play against a d-wade, lebron james, chris paul, the NBA has much more talent right now than they ever did.


lebron doesnt come close, this guys overrated i wouldnt be suprised if he joins the t-mac/grant hill club by the end of the career.

I wouldnt use the level of competition as an argument FOR Kobe. It would actually hurt considering the league has turned SO much more into an offensive league geared towards allowing players to score at will or get to the line. Jordan was playing against bruising defenses where it was ok to simply knock people on their ass. Kobe would seriously curl up in a little ball and cry if he had to see Oakley, Mason or even Starks every year in the playoffs lol. Artest woudl be the soft player on those old Knicks teams.

The problem is, Kobe stans like to use stats to argue...but then when the stats go the other way they try to pretend as if stats dont matter.

You cant measure "skill" when you are talking about best EVER, because skill levels of players ALWAYS improves from generation to generation. If you took Wilt for example....Dwight Howard is more SKILLED then he ever was. And Dwight isnt that skilled by todays standards. But you would NEVER say that Howard is as great as Wilt. Different age of Basketball. You can only compare a players skill...for THEIR time. And Jordan was head and shoulders above the rest of the league. There were NEVER any questions as to whether he was the best basketball player in the world. Kobe is constantly in the midst of a debate as to whether he is the best player in the NBA right now. If you were watchin basketball during Jordans era, no one ever said that anyone else was the best. As a matter of face, Jordan was already considered the greatest all time before his career was over. Thats why Kobe can never be on his level.

This is a lie, straight up...Jordan wasn't considered the best until he won a title, in the 90s.

LOL At what point in Kobe's career was he ever considered the hands down greatest player in the game? LOL. He is ALWAYS part of a debate. My point is that Jordan wasnt part of a debate except for early in his career. And if you dont know that Jordan was considered the greatest of all time BEFORE he was done...then you simply dont know your basketball. Point blank, Kobe just can not compete with that. He is much closer to Magic than he is to Jordan in that Magic was typically part of a debate as well. You can hate it all you want, but Kobe will never been seen or respected on Jordans level. He could win the title this year...and the next 2 and would still not be considered as great as Jordan. MJs GOAT status was cemented 2/3's of the way through his career lol.

Here are just a few reasons Kobe wont catch him

Jordan- 6 Titles,  6 Finals MVP Awards, 5 NBA MVP Awards, 10 Scoring titles, 3 Steals titles, Rookie of the Year, NBA All Rookie First team, ESPN's Greatest Athlete of the 20th century
Bryant- 4 Titles*, 1 Finals MVP Award,  1 NBA MVP Award, 2 Scoring titles, NBA All Rookie Second team

I left out accolades where they are either equal (ie, NBA All Star MVP)...or where Kobe still has a shot at catching him (ie. All Star Appearances, or ALL NBA First team)

As for the accomplishments that Kobe could catch up to Jordan on...you also have to remember that Jordan played 15 seasons and took 2 breaks. Its safe to assume that in between the three peats...Jordan would have been an All NBA First team player, more than likely the scoring champ, definitely a starter in the All Star game...etc...etc.  Kobe has played 14 seasons already, so when its all said and done he will have had more years in the league...with far less accomplishments. Definintely a no brainer here lol

Whether Kobe's been considered hands down the best, or not, he's been just that, and it's evident to those who know that game...it's clear that there was no one of LeBron's marketing stature during Jordan's era...Jordan got ALL the attention, hype, and marketing ever since the day Magic stepped down. Jordan WAS the NBA. Nowadays, you have the D-Wades, the LeBron's, players who are getting just as much, if not, more attention and exposure than Kobe, while not really being on Kobe's level in terms of skills and accomplishments. The marketing aspect of it has really skewed peoples opinion. Kobe will never be the face of the NBA, the way that Jordan was. Doesn't mean he cannot surpass him in terms of skill and accomplishments...PeACe

I agree with you on the marketing tip, BUT...how exactly, will Kobe PASS MJ in terms of accomplishments?   Forget the marketing BS, and lets talk straight on the court.  What exactly would it take?


I'd be the first to admit,, Kobe, when he is on, is a better scorer than  Mj, but MJ was more consistent and effected the game in more ways (steals, blocks, scored MORE, more assistsm rebounds, better shooting percentage, etc).

So, what does Kobe have to do, in your eyes NIK, to pass MJ in terms of accomplishments?   We both know Kobe will end up playing about 6 more seasons than Mj...so I guess Kobe will get the games played over him

I dont even see how Kobe is a better scorer than MJ lol. Kobe plays in a completely different era where the league has really encouraged offense with its rule changes AND where defensive teams arent as good defensively as they were in MJ's era. Also, 10 scoring titles to 2 scoring titles for Kobe. 8 times averaging over 30 ppg in a season to 3 for Kobe. After next year Kobe will have the same amount of years played as Jordan (again, since Jordan left twice). I doubt next year Kobe will get 8 scoring titles to catch Jordan lol Kobe's 81 point game is all that helps him in this argument. But does it really? He scored MORE points then Jordan did in his 69 point game. But he wasnt more efficient, he just shot more.

Stat Lines   Points  Rebs  Assts  Steals  FGM  FGA  FG%

Jordan-        69      18      6        4       23    37   .621
Bryant-        81       6       2        3       28    46   .608

it doesnt matter, Jordan has put up more field goal attempts than Kobe has, and has never scored that much...and you're forgetting, Jordan was untouchable. you literally couldn't breathe on Jordan without getting the foul called on you. the NBA made him untouchable, and Kobe clearly does not get anywhere near that amount of respect from the officials. I mean, you see how much Kobe gets hammered without the call being made...that NEVER would happen to Jordan...EVER. Jordan had it so much better, it's ridiculous. also, Jordan never faced a team like the Celtics in the Finals, with such tenacious defense..I mean, really, look at what Jordan went through in that threepeat run...the Jazz and the Sonics...LOL. Good teams, no doubt, but come on, now.

lol

Jordan has more field goal attempts yes. For his career he has also played one more year than Kobe has so far..not to mention the years Kobe played with Shaq. Obviously Kobe took less shots. Jordan never had another big time scorer who he could feed off of like Kobe had. More FGA's is irrelevant really, because Jordan also shot a higher percentage from the field. So he not only was the better scorer as far as averages, scoring titles, etc...he was also the more efficient scorer. As far as Jordan being untouchable lol. Jordan averaged 8.4 Free Throws/game (Playoffs included). Kobe is at 7.6 (Playoffs included). Youre talking LESS than 1 FTA per game difference lol. Hardly enough to close the gap between Kobe and Jordan. And when you do it on a per minute basis, its even closer. Seeing as how Kobe played the entire year his first two seasons...but only averaged 15 and 26 minutes per game those two seasons. It makes his FT per game look lower when compared to Jordan who played starter minutes from the beginning. Per minute, your talkin Jordan averaging a FTA every 4.6 minutes...and Kobe every 4.8 minutes. Pretty damn close for people who say Kobe doesnt get any calls lol

[teecee]

the only players who can compare to MJ in terms of career stats are Wilt and Lebron.  and even Lebron is about 4 PPG away from Jordan in his prime (who was about a 32 PPG guy)

the only players who can compare in the terms of winning are Bill Russell and Robert Horry lol.

lol at stats, what about in terms of skills, clutch, taking over games, being the finisher, and being the best.

its either going to be kobe or mj



none of those old school guys  come close to kobe or MJ in terms of being the best player. but MJ didnt even play against a d-wade, lebron james, chris paul, the NBA has much more talent right now than they ever did.


lebron doesnt come close, this guys overrated i wouldnt be suprised if he joins the t-mac/grant hill club by the end of the career.

I wouldnt use the level of competition as an argument FOR Kobe. It would actually hurt considering the league has turned SO much more into an offensive league geared towards allowing players to score at will or get to the line. Jordan was playing against bruising defenses where it was ok to simply knock people on their ass. Kobe would seriously curl up in a little ball and cry if he had to see Oakley, Mason or even Starks every year in the playoffs lol. Artest woudl be the soft player on those old Knicks teams.

The problem is, Kobe stans like to use stats to argue...but then when the stats go the other way they try to pretend as if stats dont matter.

You cant measure "skill" when you are talking about best EVER, because skill levels of players ALWAYS improves from generation to generation. If you took Wilt for example....Dwight Howard is more SKILLED then he ever was. And Dwight isnt that skilled by todays standards. But you would NEVER say that Howard is as great as Wilt. Different age of Basketball. You can only compare a players skill...for THEIR time. And Jordan was head and shoulders above the rest of the league. There were NEVER any questions as to whether he was the best basketball player in the world. Kobe is constantly in the midst of a debate as to whether he is the best player in the NBA right now. If you were watchin basketball during Jordans era, no one ever said that anyone else was the best. As a matter of face, Jordan was already considered the greatest all time before his career was over. Thats why Kobe can never be on his level.

This is a lie, straight up...Jordan wasn't considered the best until he won a title, in the 90s.

LOL At what point in Kobe's career was he ever considered the hands down greatest player in the game? LOL. He is ALWAYS part of a debate. My point is that Jordan wasnt part of a debate except for early in his career. And if you dont know that Jordan was considered the greatest of all time BEFORE he was done...then you simply dont know your basketball. Point blank, Kobe just can not compete with that. He is much closer to Magic than he is to Jordan in that Magic was typically part of a debate as well. You can hate it all you want, but Kobe will never been seen or respected on Jordans level. He could win the title this year...and the next 2 and would still not be considered as great as Jordan. MJs GOAT status was cemented 2/3's of the way through his career lol.

Here are just a few reasons Kobe wont catch him

Jordan- 6 Titles,  6 Finals MVP Awards, 5 NBA MVP Awards, 10 Scoring titles, 3 Steals titles, Rookie of the Year, NBA All Rookie First team, ESPN's Greatest Athlete of the 20th century
Bryant- 4 Titles*, 1 Finals MVP Award,  1 NBA MVP Award, 2 Scoring titles, NBA All Rookie Second team

I left out accolades where they are either equal (ie, NBA All Star MVP)...or where Kobe still has a shot at catching him (ie. All Star Appearances, or ALL NBA First team)

As for the accomplishments that Kobe could catch up to Jordan on...you also have to remember that Jordan played 15 seasons and took 2 breaks. Its safe to assume that in between the three peats...Jordan would have been an All NBA First team player, more than likely the scoring champ, definitely a starter in the All Star game...etc...etc.  Kobe has played 14 seasons already, so when its all said and done he will have had more years in the league...with far less accomplishments. Definintely a no brainer here lol

Whether Kobe's been considered hands down the best, or not, he's been just that, and it's evident to those who know that game...it's clear that there was no one of LeBron's marketing stature during Jordan's era...Jordan got ALL the attention, hype, and marketing ever since the day Magic stepped down. Jordan WAS the NBA. Nowadays, you have the D-Wades, the LeBron's, players who are getting just as much, if not, more attention and exposure than Kobe, while not really being on Kobe's level in terms of skills and accomplishments. The marketing aspect of it has really skewed peoples opinion. Kobe will never be the face of the NBA, the way that Jordan was. Doesn't mean he cannot surpass him in terms of skill and accomplishments...PeACe

I agree with you on the marketing tip, BUT...how exactly, will Kobe PASS MJ in terms of accomplishments?   Forget the marketing BS, and lets talk straight on the court.  What exactly would it take?


I'd be the first to admit,, Kobe, when he is on, is a better scorer than  Mj, but MJ was more consistent and effected the game in more ways (steals, blocks, scored MORE, more assistsm rebounds, better shooting percentage, etc).

So, what does Kobe have to do, in your eyes NIK, to pass MJ in terms of accomplishments?   We both know Kobe will end up playing about 6 more seasons than Mj...so I guess Kobe will get the games played over him

I dont even see how Kobe is a better scorer than MJ lol. Kobe plays in a completely different era where the league has really encouraged offense with its rule changes AND where defensive teams arent as good defensively as they were in MJ's era. Also, 10 scoring titles to 2 scoring titles for Kobe. 8 times averaging over 30 ppg in a season to 3 for Kobe. After next year Kobe will have the same amount of years played as Jordan (again, since Jordan left twice). I doubt next year Kobe will get 8 scoring titles to catch Jordan lol Kobe's 81 point game is all that helps him in this argument. But does it really? He scored MORE points then Jordan did in his 69 point game. But he wasnt more efficient, he just shot more.

Stat Lines   Points  Rebs  Assts  Steals  FGM  FGA  FG%

Jordan-        69      18      6        4       23    37   .621
Bryant-        81       6       2        3       28    46   .608

it doesnt matter, Jordan has put up more field goal attempts than Kobe has, and has never scored that much...and you're forgetting, Jordan was untouchable. you literally couldn't breathe on Jordan without getting the foul called on you. the NBA made him untouchable, and Kobe clearly does not get anywhere near that amount of respect from the officials. I mean, you see how much Kobe gets hammered without the call being made...that NEVER would happen to Jordan...EVER. Jordan had it so much better, it's ridiculous. also, Jordan never faced a team like the Celtics in the Finals, with such tenacious defense..I mean, really, look at what Jordan went through in that threepeat run...the Jazz and the Sonics...LOL. Good teams, no doubt, but come on, now.

I WILL admit the Celtics are a great defenseive team, but wouldn't you say Garnett, Allen and Pierce are all on the downslide of their careers?  None of them played conistently well in the series...

of course the celtic big 3 aren't in the prime of their career, but as a unit, they play great team ball...one of the best team ball units i've ever seen, by far. and people need to quit acting like jordan was something else, cuz he once clinched a finals series with a 5-19 FG performance, and that was against a decent defense, at best...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199606160CHI.html


and I don't remember Jordan ever grabbing 15 boards in a Finals game either......give credit where it's due.

I think you are referring to his game against the Sonics...I am actually old enoughthat I remember without having to look it up?  How many ASSISTS and boards did MJ have that game?   Either way it was not a DO OR DIE game, I'm sure you see the difference...in fact, MJ never even played in a finals game 7.  


I remember being disappointed in MJ in Game 6 against the JAzz in 98.  He was shooting poorly, making bad decisions, had no assists, etc.   WE all know how that ended!   I

[.:DaYg0sTyLz:.]

the only players who can compare to MJ in terms of career stats are Wilt and Lebron.  and even Lebron is about 4 PPG away from Jordan in his prime (who was about a 32 PPG guy)

the only players who can compare in the terms of winning are Bill Russell and Robert Horry lol.

lol at stats, what about in terms of skills, clutch, taking over games, being the finisher, and being the best.

its either going to be kobe or mj



none of those old school guys  come close to kobe or MJ in terms of being the best player. but MJ didnt even play against a d-wade, lebron james, chris paul, the NBA has much more talent right now than they ever did.


lebron doesnt come close, this guys overrated i wouldnt be suprised if he joins the t-mac/grant hill club by the end of the career.

I wouldnt use the level of competition as an argument FOR Kobe. It would actually hurt considering the league has turned SO much more into an offensive league geared towards allowing players to score at will or get to the line. Jordan was playing against bruising defenses where it was ok to simply knock people on their ass. Kobe would seriously curl up in a little ball and cry if he had to see Oakley, Mason or even Starks every year in the playoffs lol. Artest woudl be the soft player on those old Knicks teams.

The problem is, Kobe stans like to use stats to argue...but then when the stats go the other way they try to pretend as if stats dont matter.

You cant measure "skill" when you are talking about best EVER, because skill levels of players ALWAYS improves from generation to generation. If you took Wilt for example....Dwight Howard is more SKILLED then he ever was. And Dwight isnt that skilled by todays standards. But you would NEVER say that Howard is as great as Wilt. Different age of Basketball. You can only compare a players skill...for THEIR time. And Jordan was head and shoulders above the rest of the league. There were NEVER any questions as to whether he was the best basketball player in the world. Kobe is constantly in the midst of a debate as to whether he is the best player in the NBA right now. If you were watchin basketball during Jordans era, no one ever said that anyone else was the best. As a matter of face, Jordan was already considered the greatest all time before his career was over. Thats why Kobe can never be on his level.

This is a lie, straight up...Jordan wasn't considered the best until he won a title, in the 90s.

LOL At what point in Kobe's career was he ever considered the hands down greatest player in the game? LOL. He is ALWAYS part of a debate. My point is that Jordan wasnt part of a debate except for early in his career. And if you dont know that Jordan was considered the greatest of all time BEFORE he was done...then you simply dont know your basketball. Point blank, Kobe just can not compete with that. He is much closer to Magic than he is to Jordan in that Magic was typically part of a debate as well. You can hate it all you want, but Kobe will never been seen or respected on Jordans level. He could win the title this year...and the next 2 and would still not be considered as great as Jordan. MJs GOAT status was cemented 2/3's of the way through his career lol.

Here are just a few reasons Kobe wont catch him

Jordan- 6 Titles,  6 Finals MVP Awards, 5 NBA MVP Awards, 10 Scoring titles, 3 Steals titles, Rookie of the Year, NBA All Rookie First team, ESPN's Greatest Athlete of the 20th century
Bryant- 4 Titles*, 1 Finals MVP Award,  1 NBA MVP Award, 2 Scoring titles, NBA All Rookie Second team

I left out accolades where they are either equal (ie, NBA All Star MVP)...or where Kobe still has a shot at catching him (ie. All Star Appearances, or ALL NBA First team)

As for the accomplishments that Kobe could catch up to Jordan on...you also have to remember that Jordan played 15 seasons and took 2 breaks. Its safe to assume that in between the three peats...Jordan would have been an All NBA First team player, more than likely the scoring champ, definitely a starter in the All Star game...etc...etc.  Kobe has played 14 seasons already, so when its all said and done he will have had more years in the league...with far less accomplishments. Definintely a no brainer here lol

Whether Kobe's been considered hands down the best, or not, he's been just that, and it's evident to those who know that game...it's clear that there was no one of LeBron's marketing stature during Jordan's era...Jordan got ALL the attention, hype, and marketing ever since the day Magic stepped down. Jordan WAS the NBA. Nowadays, you have the D-Wades, the LeBron's, players who are getting just as much, if not, more attention and exposure than Kobe, while not really being on Kobe's level in terms of skills and accomplishments. The marketing aspect of it has really skewed peoples opinion. Kobe will never be the face of the NBA, the way that Jordan was. Doesn't mean he cannot surpass him in terms of skill and accomplishments...PeACe

I agree with you on the marketing tip, BUT...how exactly, will Kobe PASS MJ in terms of accomplishments?   Forget the marketing BS, and lets talk straight on the court.  What exactly would it take?


I'd be the first to admit,, Kobe, when he is on, is a better scorer than  Mj, but MJ was more consistent and effected the game in more ways (steals, blocks, scored MORE, more assistsm rebounds, better shooting percentage, etc).

So, what does Kobe have to do, in your eyes NIK, to pass MJ in terms of accomplishments?   We both know Kobe will end up playing about 6 more seasons than Mj...so I guess Kobe will get the games played over him

I dont even see how Kobe is a better scorer than MJ lol. Kobe plays in a completely different era where the league has really encouraged offense with its rule changes AND where defensive teams arent as good defensively as they were in MJ's era. Also, 10 scoring titles to 2 scoring titles for Kobe. 8 times averaging over 30 ppg in a season to 3 for Kobe. After next year Kobe will have the same amount of years played as Jordan (again, since Jordan left twice). I doubt next year Kobe will get 8 scoring titles to catch Jordan lol Kobe's 81 point game is all that helps him in this argument. But does it really? He scored MORE points then Jordan did in his 69 point game. But he wasnt more efficient, he just shot more.

Stat Lines   Points  Rebs  Assts  Steals  FGM  FGA  FG%

Jordan-        69      18      6        4       23    37   .621
Bryant-        81       6       2        3       28    46   .608

it doesnt matter, Jordan has put up more field goal attempts than Kobe has, and has never scored that much...and you're forgetting, Jordan was untouchable. you literally couldn't breathe on Jordan without getting the foul called on you. the NBA made him untouchable, and Kobe clearly does not get anywhere near that amount of respect from the officials. I mean, you see how much Kobe gets hammered without the call being made...that NEVER would happen to Jordan...EVER. Jordan had it so much better, it's ridiculous. also, Jordan never faced a team like the Celtics in the Finals, with such tenacious defense..I mean, really, look at what Jordan went through in that threepeat run...the Jazz and the Sonics...LOL. Good teams, no doubt, but come on, now.

Oh and...never faced teams like the Celtics? lol. The Celtics played like shit during this finals. It went 7 games because the Lakers played like shit also lol. Im not saying the Celtics are a bad team. Obviously they arent. But I would take those Sonic and Jazz teams over this aging Celtic squad that the Lakers were lucky to beat.