Were Rumsfeld and Bush really unaware of Detainee Torture?

[Ant]

If they were apparently everyone else in the government did a good job of keeping it secret.  Consider this story just released today that shows the FBI had known about the abuses, and had reported as early as December 2003.

Excerpts From NY Times:

F.B.I. memorandums portray abuse of prisoners by American military personnel in Iraq that included detainees' being beaten and choked and having lit cigarettes placed in their ears, according to newly released government documents.

The documents, released Monday in connection with a lawsuit accusing the government of being complicit in torture, also include accounts by Federal Bureau of Investigation agents who said they had seen detainees in Guantánamo Bay, Cuba, being chained in uncomfortable positions for up to 24 hours and left to urinate and defecate on themselves. An agent wrote that in one case a detainee who was nearly unconscious had pulled out much of his hair during the night.

.....

The agent, whose name was deleted from the document, wrote on July 29, 2004: "On a couple of occasions, I entered interview rooms to find a detainee chained hand and foot in a fetal position to the floor, with no chair, food or water. Most times they had urinated or defecated on themselves and had been left there for 18 24 hours or more."

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/12/21/politics/21abuse.html?hp&ex=1103691600&en=d96e9999547b00c1&ei=5094&partner=homepage

[Don Rizzle]

i can't believe rumsfeld has lasted this long i'll give him a fortnight, but then americans politicials don't have a culture of resigning when they fuck up bad.

[Thirteen]

probably not, they're too busy planning the next terrorist attack on america 

[[sepehr]]

Messed up shit man...

[Jimmy Cash2120]

i believe that the pres and vice pres were unaware

BUT someone had to know, one of the higher ups had to know what was going on

[BigBDrugStores]

who gives a shit. they tried to kill us./ we caught them. they got tourtured. end of story.
they probably didnt know because they probably didnt care.

[King Tech Quadafi]

i believe that the pres and vice pres were unaware

BUT someone had to know, one of the higher ups had to know what was going on

lol..

[Ant]

who gives a shit. they tried to kill us./ we caught them. they got tourtured. end of story.
they probably didnt know because they probably didnt care.

The people in those prisons were not necessarily trying to kill us, many of them were innocents due to the nature of the way in which we selected them for inclusion in the prison.  We basically just arrested anyone we thought was suspicious and took away their right to due process.  We have due process rights in the U.S. because of the high probability for wrongful arrests if you give police the freedom to arrest, and imprison whoever they please, without consequence.  The U.S. military had the authority to arrest, and imprison anyone they pleased for safety reasons, and while this is somewhat reasonable, its not reasonable to treat people you have arrested inhumanely to the extent these people have been treated.

[Don Jacob]

they probably didn't know right away , it's not like there's a room full of tv's in the oval office with live footage from all camps that george bush, dick cheany, rice, and powell sit around watching making sure every single soldier is spreading truth justice and the american way......lol please. they probably knew a few before it was released to the press. I don't know why people are blaming the pres and rumsfield for this........i mean shit i can see if there was an official memo from the oval office saying "torture them rag heads"  but shit like this is bound to happen. 9 of my friends are in the marines and other armed services , after bootcamp you're not a very stable person and from what i hear there's shit that goes on worse than that WITHIN the ranks....

[rafsta]

i think Bush knew, and even condoned it...