Lifestyle > Train of Thought
A movie by Theo van Gogh and Ayaan Hirsi Ali - "Submission"
virtuoso:
Wtf how can you embrace the communist manifesto have you read it properly? the reason for attacking the middle class is to ensure complete dependency and so an all powerful world government can be formed, after all they do not believe in nationality or nations borders. Clearly you fail to recognise the danger of such mass centralised control. Furthermore they make it clear that they despises the family unit, the family must be broken so values are not instilled by the parents but by the controllers, through "reeducation centres" it's a sickening read.
The analogy is don't drink that poison anymore, here have a lovely cup of cyanide instead
I TO DA GEEZY:
Keep your panties on dude. Embracing one element of the manifesto doesn't make me a communist, just like I said before. I know you also embrace elements of it. Don't you like the idea of socialist democracy? Do you fail to see the connection between the two?- I doubt it. Notwithstanding, awareness of the hazards of National perception is not to be taken lightly. There is no doubt it's a powerful tool of psychological control in the hands of those in power.
virtuoso:
No no, people confuse criticism of the states actions with nationalism that is where the problem lies. They associate the actions of the government as being as one with the nation so they feel that criticises it amounts to being unpatriotic. Whereas that is not what real patriotism is about, real patriotism is understanding what makes the country what it is, in terms of it's consitution the rule of law etc. If you were to focus attention on individual socialist policies then you could say 'well that seems reasonable" however when they are presented together as one package, it's apparent how dangerous these policies are.I did pull the trigger before you elaborated though so my bad, it's just....from reading that document....it is a very chilling document and the thought of anyone truly embracing the main aims of it just turn my stomach.
Going back to this movie by the way, it all comes down to double standards, do you think they would have allowed a movie depicting a jewish family who violently refuse to allow their son or daughter to marry a palestinian? I would say odds on the ADL would step in and scream from the roofops "evil jew haters" and the film would get pulled before it was ever able to be released anywhere within europe.
I TO DA GEEZY:
1.I too focus on individual socialist policies 2. State actions in modern democracies, more overtly those involving immorality of some sort, always rely on the intricate aspects of National perception for the purpose of garnering sympathy and reaching public consensus of some sort. "It is within our 'National Interest'"
" The people of .... are tired of...." the language is always emotional, romantic, exaggerated, filled with generalization, and at the core irrational. Just listen to the politicians on TV. There is nothing that obstructs state actions from being immoral, including the constitution and the rule of law, as you know (See US) .Hence, patriotism, even of this seemingly benign nature u've described, leads to rationalization of state actions. When it comes down to business all that matters is how many blind patriots u have supporting a morally reprehensible state action.
virtuoso:
The american government is acting outside of the constituion but a great deal of lawlessness has swept into the highest throes of power. The actions themselves are treasonous but if no one is prepared to enforce then a country gets swept into great danger. It is not patriotism that is dangerous, it is ignorance and apathy, people fall into the trap of just trusting authority without knowing what it is they are actually trusting. By the way I would like you to respond to the question I asked.
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