It's June 16, 2024, 06:43:18 AM
Look at the 92-93 year. Jordan led the bulls to the title. Had the most points per game and steals per game for the season and made 1st team all NBA. Jordan had a great season that year, yet, Barkley won the MVP and his team lost to Jordan's in the Finals. Barkley had a bigger impact on his team that season. It was only his first year with them and he brought them up to having the best record in the league. So, it's not always about individual performance.But since there's talks about the Lakers having bad players around Kobe and all, check this out. Aside from Pippen, who did Jordan have on this team? Grant was good, but he wasn't a stellar player. I think around Jordan, all these guys, who may have just been decent to good players, became strong players who were able to step up when needed. Michael JordanScottie PippenHorace GrantB.J. ArmstrongScott WilliamsStacey King Trent Tucker Bill CartwrightWill Perdue John Paxson Rodney McCray Corey Williams Darrell Walker Ed Nealy Joe Courtney Ricky Blanton Jo Jo English Not too many great names on that roster, but they won the title that year. So if Kobe is supposed to be that great, he would work with what he has and bring them to that point, IMO.
no but he'd be a better leader
Are you kidding me? The Bulls ALWAYS had consistant role players when they won rings, excellent bigs (Horace Grant, Dennis Rodman), great shooters (Toni Kukoc, Steve Kerr, John Paxson), reliable point guards (BJ Armstrong, Ron Harper), etc. etc. They were BUILT to win. It's crazy to say otherwise. When Jordan played with bums, before he hit his 30's, he always got bounced in the playoffs.
Maybe it's hard to believe it but in that list there are 3 players who started an All-Star Game (Jordan, Pippen & Armstrong) and 2 other ones who were selected (Grant & Cartwright).Now tell me who besides Kobe played an All-Star game in todays Lakers? Damn man, "besides Pippen"? Pippen is in the top-5 best SF's EVER.
Quote from: Now_I_Know on May 09, 2007, 12:17:52 AMAre you kidding me? The Bulls ALWAYS had consistant role players when they won rings, excellent bigs (Horace Grant, Dennis Rodman), great shooters (Toni Kukoc, Steve Kerr, John Paxson), reliable point guards (BJ Armstrong, Ron Harper), etc. etc. They were BUILT to win. It's crazy to say otherwise. When Jordan played with bums, before he hit his 30's, he always got bounced in the playoffs.I'm talking 92-93. There's no Rodman, Kukoc, Kerr or Harper... Stay on topic please. Again, dudes like Grant and Armstrong were decent players at best, but around Jordan they were much better. You can see Armstrong's decline in 94, when Jordan retired. So, he wasn't really all tha reliable because once Jordan bounced (and once he went to another team) his numbers decreased crazy. For Grant, his Rebounding and his Points stats all went down once he left the Bulls and Jordan. Again, Jordan made him that better player that nobody else could make him. As for Paxson, he was never that great until he got with Jordan and the bulls. His clutch shooting was never more on point until he worked with Jordan. Again... this was a player who was made better by Jordan. All these cats he played with were decent at best, but with Jordan they were better than usual.
Quote from: Don Jacob on May 09, 2007, 01:07:37 AMno but he'd be a better leader"Lamar" and "leader" are two words you can't use in the same post.
Quote from: Antonio on May 09, 2007, 02:06:25 AMMaybe it's hard to believe it but in that list there are 3 players who started an All-Star Game (Jordan, Pippen & Armstrong) and 2 other ones who were selected (Grant & Cartwright).Now tell me who besides Kobe played an All-Star game in todays Lakers? Damn man, "besides Pippen"? Pippen is in the top-5 best SF's EVER.Grant made the All-Stars once... You can thank Jordan for that. Grant found a roll on the Bulls and he excelled at it because of Jordan, IMO. Same can be said for Armstrong. When did Grant or Armstrong do anything like that AFTER playing by Jordan's side? Never. Their careers declined well after that. So what did Jordan do right that Kobe isn't? He was able to help these players who really weren't all that, into All-Star caliber players at least once in their career. Point is... Jordan took what he had and made it work. I didn't diss Pippen... So why bring him up like I did? Jordan and Pippen were great together, but they didn't win titles on their own, they had a cast surrounding them and that cast was made better by Jordan.
Quote from: Antonio on May 09, 2007, 02:06:25 AMMaybe it's hard to believe it but in that list there are 3 players who started an All-Star Game (Jordan, Pippen & Armstrong) and 2 other ones who were selected (Grant & Cartwright).Now tell me who besides Kobe played an All-Star game in todays Lakers? Damn man, "besides Pippen"? Pippen is in the top-5 best SF's EVER.Grant made the All-Stars once... You can thank Jordan for that. Grant found a roll on the Bulls and he excelled at it because of Jordan, IMO.
Same can be said for Armstrong.
When did Grant or Armstrong do anything like that AFTER playing by Jordan's side? Never. Their careers declined well after that. So what did Jordan do right that Kobe isn't? He was able to help these players who really weren't all that, into All-Star caliber players at least once in their career.
Point is... Jordan took what he had and made it work. I didn't diss Pippen... So why bring him up like I did? Jordan and Pippen were great together, but they didn't win titles on their own, they had a cast surrounding them and that cast was made better by Jordan.
THe thing with Jordan is, he elevatated others play. That is what GREAT players do, and i have a feeling Kobe will do it in the coming years, but as of now it is not happening.......
Quote from: teecee on May 09, 2007, 11:47:57 AMTHe thing with Jordan is, he elevatated others play. That is what GREAT players do, and i have a feeling Kobe will do it in the coming years, but as of now it is not happening.......This is what it boils down to. Grant & Armstrong may have had their best seasons individually, but without Jordan what did they do? With Jordan they won titles. Why? Because he made them that much better as a team. He made them that much better as players. Without Jordan nobody would remember Horace Grant or BJ Armstrong. They never would've been All-Stars. Jordan did that for them...
Antonio:Who was better than Jordan? 6 playoff MVP's without a real post player to play with puts him #1 according to 99% of bball fans. Did you watch the man play? I never saw Wilt, Russell, etc play, but the only on ethat comes close would be Magic? Is he your number one?THe thing with Jordan is, he elevatated others play. That is what GREAT players do, and i have a feeling Kobe will do it in the coming years, but as of now it is not happening.......