How the Patriots win games

[Chamillitary Click]

Yeah but if Peyton was three centimeters shorter, he'd be garbage. So if you weren't allowed to wear two pairs of socks he'd get destroyed. He's so overrated.

[Shallow]

Yeah but if Peyton was three centimeters shorter, he'd be garbage. So if you weren't allowed to wear two pairs of socks he'd get destroyed. He's so overrated.

That's not the same thing. My argument is that Brady looks better than he really is because of the coordinators and play callers around him. I said the same thing about Drew Brees and last year helped me feel better about my opinion of Drew.

These opinions are not based around success and numbers, but what I actually see with my own eyes. For example Aaron Rodgers has both a great OC and play caller but I have never said he looks so much better because of that. I think Rodgers is good enough to excel as one of the very best in most existing systems. What I see from him looks that good.

What I see from Brady when the offense is clicking is a lot of time in the pocket, a large a gap, and wide open WRs and TEs who have to adjust to most of the throws. And when all of that isn't there I see a very mediocre QB. I think he would look terrible on over 50% of the teams in the NFL.

Where as I feel Peyton could make 95% of the NFL teams contenders to make the playoffs with double digit wins.

[Russell Bell]

the patriots go through offensive coordinators like toilet paper and tom brady is def a top 10 QB...probably 6 or 7 if you ask me.


with that said before the patriots changed their system in '07 when they got Moss and Welker, the Patriots were a low risk team that ran the ball a lot.  They won 3 titles that way.  Then Brady tried to turn into Peyton Manning and hasn't won a ring since but had 2 MVP seasons, one pretty historic.  The irony there is delicious 

That's incorrect. Tom Brady has only had 3 OCs and each successor was the understudy before taking over. Also, each of the three have experienced great offensive success with much lesser QBs after leaving Brady. Wies made studs out of Brady Quinn and Jimmy Clausen in college, and brought a broken Matt Cassel back to the probowl. McDaniels took Cassel to the probowl, and for a while almost made Kyle Orton look like a probowler, and Kyle Orton is a complete scrub of a QB. And Bill O'Brien is just getting started at Penn St, already getting offers to return to the NFL as HC by the end of last season.

We've seen the NE Offensive system succeed without Brady. I want to see Brady succeed outside of the system. I don't think he can.

The problem and hypocrisy with statements like that is we won't ever see if theyre true or not, so you can sit safely and say things without ever having to be called on them.  I know you think Brady is overrated and that's fine, but the problem is you think and can argue he's overrated because of something you'll never be able to be proven wrong on and you know that 

Bullshit! I predicted 10-6 to 12-4 the day Brady got injured in 08. I predicted Cassel to be exposed his first year in KC, and to be a stud his second year. I predicted Kyle Orton to put up very solid numbers his first year in Denver. These weren't hypotheticals, and certainly not hypocrisies. They were before the fact predictions that all came through.  And they were all based on my understanding of he Erhardt-Perkins offensive system, mastered in the modern times by Charlie Wies, and taught to McDaniels and O'Brien. And if you doubt any of what I say, go look through my post history.

And going back to college, you can see Brady Quinn, and Clausen look like studs with it.


So I go back 10 years and say Tom Brady is an overrated QB that's propped up by a great system, and since then we get to see 4 QBs who look like shit before and after that system, look like pro-bowlers with in that system, and I'm crazy for thinking Brady would fall apart with out it?


On record, I will say that Tom Brady is better than all those guys and wouldn't just end up a back up in a few weeks, but after a couple failed years in a place like Oakland or Buffalo, Tom Brady would be out of a job looking for another, just like Drew Bledsoe, who won 2 AFC Titles with that system, ended up.


And I never could have predicted the Colts cutting Peyton, so who knows what the future holds for Brady. We may get to see my theory shown true or false.

One problem w all that.  You arent talking about brady youre talking about jimmy clausen and matt cassel. I'll say it again...u will never be able to prove that tom brady is overrated because of that system cuz he aint leaving it..which is why u "prove" ur point using other lesser qbs.

[Shallow Jr]

the patriots go through offensive coordinators like toilet paper and tom brady is def a top 10 QB...probably 6 or 7 if you ask me.


with that said before the patriots changed their system in '07 when they got Moss and Welker, the Patriots were a low risk team that ran the ball a lot.  They won 3 titles that way.  Then Brady tried to turn into Peyton Manning and hasn't won a ring since but had 2 MVP seasons, one pretty historic.  The irony there is delicious 

That's incorrect. Tom Brady has only had 3 OCs and each successor was the understudy before taking over. Also, each of the three have experienced great offensive success with much lesser QBs after leaving Brady. Wies made studs out of Brady Quinn and Jimmy Clausen in college, and brought a broken Matt Cassel back to the probowl. McDaniels took Cassel to the probowl, and for a while almost made Kyle Orton look like a probowler, and Kyle Orton is a complete scrub of a QB. And Bill O'Brien is just getting started at Penn St, already getting offers to return to the NFL as HC by the end of last season.

We've seen the NE Offensive system succeed without Brady. I want to see Brady succeed outside of the system. I don't think he can.

The problem and hypocrisy with statements like that is we won't ever see if theyre true or not, so you can sit safely and say things without ever having to be called on them.  I know you think Brady is overrated and that's fine, but the problem is you think and can argue he's overrated because of something you'll never be able to be proven wrong on and you know that 

Bullshit! I predicted 10-6 to 12-4 the day Brady got injured in 08. I predicted Cassel to be exposed his first year in KC, and to be a stud his second year. I predicted Kyle Orton to put up very solid numbers his first year in Denver. These weren't hypotheticals, and certainly not hypocrisies. They were before the fact predictions that all came through.  And they were all based on my understanding of he Erhardt-Perkins offensive system, mastered in the modern times by Charlie Wies, and taught to McDaniels and O'Brien. And if you doubt any of what I say, go look through my post history.

And going back to college, you can see Brady Quinn, and Clausen look like studs with it.


So I go back 10 years and say Tom Brady is an overrated QB that's propped up by a great system, and since then we get to see 4 QBs who look like shit before and after that system, look like pro-bowlers with in that system, and I'm crazy for thinking Brady would fall apart with out it?


On record, I will say that Tom Brady is better than all those guys and wouldn't just end up a back up in a few weeks, but after a couple failed years in a place like Oakland or Buffalo, Tom Brady would be out of a job looking for another, just like Drew Bledsoe, who won 2 AFC Titles with that system, ended up.


And I never could have predicted the Colts cutting Peyton, so who knows what the future holds for Brady. We may get to see my theory shown true or false.

One problem w all that.  You arent talking about brady youre talking about jimmy clausen and matt cassel. I'll say it again...u will never be able to prove that tom brady is overrated because of that system cuz he aint leaving it..which is why u "prove" ur point using other lesser qbs.

Bullshit. If you knew anything about football, you'd know Tom Brady is nothing more than an average QB who has been fortunate in his career. Peyton on the other hand is virtually equivalent to a prophet and has been making miracles throughout his career despite horrible supporting casts. If Tom Brady didn't play in Bill's system he'd be nothing more than Chad Henne, whereas Peyton is a god among mortals and could take the Jaguars to a Superbowl.

[Shallow]

the patriots go through offensive coordinators like toilet paper and tom brady is def a top 10 QB...probably 6 or 7 if you ask me.


with that said before the patriots changed their system in '07 when they got Moss and Welker, the Patriots were a low risk team that ran the ball a lot.  They won 3 titles that way.  Then Brady tried to turn into Peyton Manning and hasn't won a ring since but had 2 MVP seasons, one pretty historic.  The irony there is delicious 

That's incorrect. Tom Brady has only had 3 OCs and each successor was the understudy before taking over. Also, each of the three have experienced great offensive success with much lesser QBs after leaving Brady. Wies made studs out of Brady Quinn and Jimmy Clausen in college, and brought a broken Matt Cassel back to the probowl. McDaniels took Cassel to the probowl, and for a while almost made Kyle Orton look like a probowler, and Kyle Orton is a complete scrub of a QB. And Bill O'Brien is just getting started at Penn St, already getting offers to return to the NFL as HC by the end of last season.

We've seen the NE Offensive system succeed without Brady. I want to see Brady succeed outside of the system. I don't think he can.

The problem and hypocrisy with statements like that is we won't ever see if theyre true or not, so you can sit safely and say things without ever having to be called on them.  I know you think Brady is overrated and that's fine, but the problem is you think and can argue he's overrated because of something you'll never be able to be proven wrong on and you know that 

Bullshit! I predicted 10-6 to 12-4 the day Brady got injured in 08. I predicted Cassel to be exposed his first year in KC, and to be a stud his second year. I predicted Kyle Orton to put up very solid numbers his first year in Denver. These weren't hypotheticals, and certainly not hypocrisies. They were before the fact predictions that all came through.  And they were all based on my understanding of he Erhardt-Perkins offensive system, mastered in the modern times by Charlie Wies, and taught to McDaniels and O'Brien. And if you doubt any of what I say, go look through my post history.

And going back to college, you can see Brady Quinn, and Clausen look like studs with it.


So I go back 10 years and say Tom Brady is an overrated QB that's propped up by a great system, and since then we get to see 4 QBs who look like shit before and after that system, look like pro-bowlers with in that system, and I'm crazy for thinking Brady would fall apart with out it?


On record, I will say that Tom Brady is better than all those guys and wouldn't just end up a back up in a few weeks, but after a couple failed years in a place like Oakland or Buffalo, Tom Brady would be out of a job looking for another, just like Drew Bledsoe, who won 2 AFC Titles with that system, ended up.


And I never could have predicted the Colts cutting Peyton, so who knows what the future holds for Brady. We may get to see my theory shown true or false.

One problem w all that.  You arent talking about brady youre talking about jimmy clausen and matt cassel. I'll say it again...u will never be able to prove that tom brady is overrated because of that system cuz he aint leaving it..which is why u "prove" ur point using other lesser qbs.

Where did I say "prove"? And I can only use the QBs that have played in that system by the same guys that Brady had calling his plays. And I'm not so sure how much lesser a QB Drew Bledsoe is. He did win two AFC Championship games. It's not like he's a scrub.

Another QB in another currently great system with a great playcaller, is Drew Brees. With Sean Payton he's near the top of the heap; an MVP argument. With out Sean Payton, he's not even close. I called that on Brees years ago. So why shouldn't I use the same logic for Brady?