It's May 23, 2024, 08:06:00 AM
yes, and my other point is.. muslims arent a race... you can "opt in" to being a muslim
Quote from: Trauma on November 18, 2003, 09:43:26 PMI've went through this before, but here goes again.In the bible, Abraham was a great man, that's about all you need to know about him, it sums it up perfectly. He couldn't have children until very late in life, when he finally had 1 son, after praying for years that he could have children to pass along his lineage. As the boy grew older, Abraham was commanded by an angel to kill his 1 son as a sacrifice to god. Abraham was such a devout man, he was at the brink of killing his son (had him sprawn out on the rock that rests under the Temple Mount in Jerusalem), when an angel appeared and told Abraham he didn't have to kill his son, Abraham instead sacrificed a symbolic lamb tangled in the thorns nearby.Anyways, as a reward for Abraham's obedience (he was willing to sacrifice the only thing he had ever wanted more than anything in the world simply because God had told him to), Abraham was given the Abrahamic Covenant with God. God told him that everyone who entered heaven would be one of his seed. In short: Jews will simply claim (if they're versed in the old testament) that anyone saved by God today is a descendant of Abraham. They believe this because the bible says it right there in black and white, so to them, there's no way a muslim can be a descendant of Abraham.Yes, you're right, there's no way a muslim is going to heaven because some terrorists do the shit they do. But of course Hitler will be in heaven right next to Stalin and Bush. By the way, I hope you know that muslims descend from the line of Ishmael, Abraham's other son.
I've went through this before, but here goes again.In the bible, Abraham was a great man, that's about all you need to know about him, it sums it up perfectly. He couldn't have children until very late in life, when he finally had 1 son, after praying for years that he could have children to pass along his lineage. As the boy grew older, Abraham was commanded by an angel to kill his 1 son as a sacrifice to god. Abraham was such a devout man, he was at the brink of killing his son (had him sprawn out on the rock that rests under the Temple Mount in Jerusalem), when an angel appeared and told Abraham he didn't have to kill his son, Abraham instead sacrificed a symbolic lamb tangled in the thorns nearby.Anyways, as a reward for Abraham's obedience (he was willing to sacrifice the only thing he had ever wanted more than anything in the world simply because God had told him to), Abraham was given the Abrahamic Covenant with God. God told him that everyone who entered heaven would be one of his seed. In short: Jews will simply claim (if they're versed in the old testament) that anyone saved by God today is a descendant of Abraham. They believe this because the bible says it right there in black and white, so to them, there's no way a muslim can be a descendant of Abraham.
I'll clear it up, the muslim religion was based in the middle east, at first this was a paganic religion it's monoteistic direction was brought by Muhamed, but even up untill that point it existed just in a differend form, now the people who were the original Muslims were those same Ishmaelite tribes in the Arabic Paninsula.Islam is not a rase it's a religion, and it's the easiest one to convert into, u have to say one sentence to become Muslim, I was talkin' bout the Original Muslims and about the background Islam is based upon.
You fuckin idiot. If you're gonna take someone else's position, at least get your fuckin facts straight before you add your opinion. You said that Jews could argue that no muslim could possibly go to heaven, and that only descendants of Abraham could. When in fact muslims are descendants of Abraham.
Quote from: I TO DA GEEZY on November 20, 2003, 10:52:32 PMI'll clear it up, the muslim religion was based in the middle east, at first this was a paganic religion it's monoteistic direction was brought by Muhamed, but even up untill that point it existed just in a differend form, now the people who were the original Muslims were those same Ishmaelite tribes in the Arabic Paninsula.Islam is not a rase it's a religion, and it's the easiest one to convert into, u have to say one sentence to become Muslim, I was talkin' bout the Original Muslims and about the background Islam is based upon.One thing wasn't very clear to me; are you saying that a form of Islam existed before Mohammed? If you are, that is completely false. There was no Islam before Mohammed, Islam began with Mohammed. That's why the belief in Mohammed is one of the main principles of the religion.
About the Mohammed/Pagan topic:Paganism was the dominant religion, then Mohammed destroyed it. He didn't "re-direct" paganism to become monotheistic, he converted all the Pagans (or Killed them ). They are 2 different religions, Islam did not derive from Paganism at all.
Trauma you clearly have no fuckin clue about anything. Muhammed didn't turn paganic religions into Islam, he spoke out against paganism, and informed people about there being One Almighty God. In addition, muslims don't belive that Islam is the original religion. We accept and believe what happened before, we acknowledge the Torah and the Bible to be holy books, we believe in all the prophets that came before Muhammed, including Jesus; the only thing is that we consider the other religions to be incomplete because they don't include the life of Muhammed, who to us was God's last messenger.Please stay out of topics you don't know shit about. I already schooled you on the patriot act discussion, and the spending bill one, when will you learn you fool.
Quote from: Lincoln on November 21, 2003, 12:55:31 PMAbout the Mohammed/Pagan topic:Paganism was the dominant religion, then Mohammed destroyed it. He didn't "re-direct" paganism to become monotheistic, he converted all the Pagans (or Killed them ). They are 2 different religions, Islam did not derive from Paganism at all.destroyI never said Muhamed was pro-paganic he wasn't, to re-direct a paganic religion into a monotheistic one is the same as to destroy the paganic one and replace it with a monotheistic one, so the arguement is not about a technical describtion, but what proves Islam did not totally alienate from it's origin, is that black stone(I think it's called Kabah or something) it's still considered holly, and another thing, acording to some historions Allah was actually one of the many gods that the earlly form of Islam worshiped, his massage to Muhamad was what rendered him as the only god, or may be as the god of all gods(as some chose to acsept it at first).
Quote from: I TO DA GEEZY on November 22, 2003, 03:36:14 AMQuote from: Lincoln on November 21, 2003, 12:55:31 PMAbout the Mohammed/Pagan topic:Paganism was the dominant religion, then Mohammed destroyed it. He didn't "re-direct" paganism to become monotheistic, he converted all the Pagans (or Killed them ). They are 2 different religions, Islam did not derive from Paganism at all.destroyI never said Muhamed was pro-paganic he wasn't, to re-direct a paganic religion into a monotheistic one is the same as to destroy the paganic one and replace it with a monotheistic one, so the arguement is not about a technical describtion, but what proves Islam did not totally alienate from it's origin, is that black stone(I think it's called Kabah or something) it's still considered holly, and another thing, acording to some historions Allah was actually one of the many gods that the earlly form of Islam worshiped, his massage to Muhamad was what rendered him as the only god, or may be as the god of all gods(as some chose to acsept it at first). The Kabaa stone is part of the Hajj to Mecca. It is used so one can get a feeling of Mohammed's life (I think). And yes, Allah was one of the Gods worshipped but remember, Allah is simply the Arabic word for God. Muslims, Christians & Jews all worship the same God.