West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => West Coast Classics => Topic started by: Quadruple OG on July 06, 2006, 02:51:54 PM
-
going through this thread (http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=114140.0), it's humerous at how some people are trying to defend the Cali iz Active album. Saying that "Cali Iz Active" did ok with 30,000 sales is like saying George W Bush has been an ok President. Tha Dogg Pound had articles on MTV.com and in The Source, a mixtape to promote the album, commercials on tv, not to mention the video, and they still couldn't sell shit.
Point blank, them opening up at 30,000 is terrible. That number is pathetic and I'm wondering how this is not considered a flop on this board yet Mobb Deep's new album selling 100,000 albums is?
By the way, the excuses that Tha Dogg Pound released the album independently and that they released it through Koch Records are NOT VALID EXCUSES. Jim Jones, B.G., DJ Khaled, and D-Block are all on Koch and have sold more, plus Cube sold 140,000 copies of his album independently with virtually no spins (on the east coast) and no video play, plus has not released an album in 6 years.
-
going through this thread (http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=114140.0), it's humerous at how some people are trying to defend the Cali iz Active album. Saying that "Cali Iz Active" did ok with 30,000 sales is like saying George W Bush has been an ok President. Tha Dogg Pound had articles on MTV.com and in The Source, a mixtape to promote the album, commercials on tv, not to mention the video, and they still couldn't sell shit.
Point blank, them opening up at 30,000 is terrible. That number is pathetic and I'm wondering how this is not considered a flop on this board yet Mobb Deep's new album selling 100,000 albums is?
By the way, the excuses that Tha Dogg Pound released the album independently and that they released it through Koch Records are NOT VALID EXCUSES. Jim Jones, B.G., DJ Khaled, and D-Block are all on Koch and have sold more, plus Cube sold 140,000 copies of his album independently with virtually no spins (on the east coast) and no video play, plus has not released an album in 6 years.
I know that this is targeted at the sales topic in general, although my particular post didn't defend the selling of 30,000. It is an awfully low number, and lower than I personally anticipated. However, I stand by my point where I said that if they push out another single using one of the more mainstream cuts and end up selling 100k, that's an acceptable amount by Koch's standards. Maybe they will, maybe they won't but the commercial potential is there. I've been saying it for a while now - "Cali Iz Active" was never going to blow on a mainstream level, even though I really enjoyed the track as a fan.
Cube is distributed by Virgin in the UK (and maybe the rest of Europe) and is, if my memory serves me right, distributed in the US by Interscope, so he has some form of major label help even if Lench Mob itself is independant. Plus, I don't think the Cube comparison is fair at all. With his success in Hollywood, Cube never went anywhere and has always been in the public eye. He's also become a cultural icon, and movie fans (hell, fans in general) are frequently reminded in biographies, interviews, and so on, that he started his career as an exceptional rapper. Add to that all the talk of the work with Dre, the rumoured NWA album, and a classic legacy, and it should come as no surprise that Cube sold so well. There's always been anticipation for Cube to return to music, while movies ensure that he isn't forgotten about.
DPG, meanwhile, have been out of the public eye for far too long and, as a result, it's no surprise that their appeal has faded. That's partly their fault, although there are of course other factors, such as bad record deals and the obvious fact that anyone on an independantly funded label such as DPG Recordz is going to struggle to break into the mainstream. The music they've released has also been decidedly hit-and-miss IMO, although nowhere near as bad as some people on here would suggest. I guess this just proves Warren right: the game don't wait for anybody, and DPG were simply out of the game for too long.
-
people just download albums now. its so much easier, like someone said in another thread, its probably platinum on the net before it was even released in stores.
-
omg, they had an article on mtv.com!!! how can they not go platinum?
i cant see daz, kurupt or snoop ever bouncing back and dropping another cd after this horrable flop
RIP DPG
-
30,000 a week is pretty bad....Its even worse that Snoop went plat w Tha Eastsidaz and he cant even sell 50k with Daz n Kurupt, two guys who have classic records under there belt, veterans in the game.
Its sad, but I guess nobody is checking for Tha Doggpound anymore......
-
BTW, Ice Cubes videos have been played much more than Cali Iz Active, and Cube had sick promotion for LNCL.....Ice Cube is HUGE right now...But then again, he DID release a bangin album.
-
The album is sub par and the single was average. It is true that there are a lot of worse albums that sell more and I think that should be attributed to the fact this release was on a label that fashions themselves as the community college of record labels. I also think that the DPG has just reached its plateau as far as fans go. I don’t think they as a camp are attracting anyone who didn’t like them 10 years ago and therefore they have a LOT less room to experiment creatively and deviate from their original formula. The other problem is they consider themselves legends (which they are) and feel because of that status they can phone in their verses, have short arms and deep pockets when it comes to production and bang out 100 mediocre tracks in a week instead of working on 30 amazing tracks over a year. In the current hip hop climate with G-Unit in the east and the South running things that type of mindset just doesn’t cut it. A strong selling west coast album needs to be groundbreaking just to compete with the average shit coming from the east and south.
-
The album is sub par and the single was average. It is true that there are a lot of worse albums that sell more and I think that should be attributed to the fact this release was on a label that fashions themselves as the community college of record labels. I also think that the DPG has just reached its plateau as far as fans go. I don’t think they as a camp are attracting anyone who didn’t like them 10 years ago and therefore they have a LOT less room to experiment creatively and deviate from their original formula. The other problem is they consider themselves legends (which they are) and feel because of that status they can phone in their verses, have short arms and deep pockets when it comes to production and bang out 100 mediocre tracks in a week instead of working on 30 amazing tracks over a year. In the current hip hop climate with G-Unit in the east and the South running things that type of mindset just doesn’t cut it. A strong selling west coast album needs to be groundbreaking just to compete with the average shit coming from the east and south.
well said
+1
-
weak album, weak sales
-
Good Points. I'll attribute the "flop" to half assed music. How many people on this forum would say "Daz, Kurupt, and Snoop have all steadily improved musically and creatively expanded in the last several years"? or "Compare their work from the first 7 years in the game to the last 7 years in the game. Their shit in the last 7 years DESTROY's the first 7!" LOL, NOBODY. To me, anybody that would say that is in complete and utter denial.
For instance, I'd say the single was average at best. And you know what? That's actually BETTER than I thought it would be. These guys have lowered expectations so much, that now if I don't think it's COMPLETELY wack, that they've actually impressed me. How twisted is that shit? If this type of single were released on their initial albums, it would have been the wackest shit on the album. But DPG 2006, this ain't too bad. They've half assed it for so long, talked out their ass so much, and it's really catching up to them. It's like each album from these guys either together or solo has shown a decline in effort and quality. In the 90's through 2000/2001 I'd cop their shit sight unseen (unheard) because I still had faith that they were gonna bring the heat. However, 6 years later I've eaten enough of their bullshit that they have to prove themselves to me again. LOL, and I was a HUGE fan. Imagine what some BG thinks of this half assed shit. Of course he's not gonna buy it.
Their flop is not due to their age nor is it due to illegal downloading. If it's their age, why is Dre still the most sought after producer in the game? If it's cuz of downloading, why are artists still going 5x platinum? Take a look at artists like Three 6 Mafia and Twista...those cats have been in the game for years and never really saw mainstream success up until recently. You know why? Cuz "Stay Fly" and "Slow Jamz" were dope fuckin songs. If those songs are wack, those artists would not have seen that type of success in this stage of their respective careers.
Bottom line, they're catching bricks cuz the music is half assed - fuck that QUARTER ASSED.
-
Good Points. I'll attribute the "flop" to half assed music. How many people on this forum would say "Daz, Kurupt, and Snoop have all steadily improved musically and creatively expanded in the last several years"? or "Compare their work from the first 7 years in the game to the last 7 years in the game. Their shit in the last 7 years DESTROY's the first 7!" LOL, NOBODY. To me, anybody that would say that is in complete and utter denial.
For instance, I'd say the single was average at best. And you know what? That's actually BETTER than I thought it would be. These guys have lowered expectations so much, that now if I don't think it's COMPLETELY wack, that they've actually impressed me. How twisted is that shit? If this type of single were released on their initial albums, it would have been the wackest shit on the album. But DPG 2006, this ain't too bad. They've half assed it for so long, talked out their ass so much, and it's really catching up to them. It's like each album from these guys either together or solo has shown a decline in effort and quality. In the 90's through 2000/2001 I'd cop their shit sight unseen (unheard) because I still had faith that they were gonna bring the heat. However, 6 years later I've eaten enough of their bullshit that they have to prove themselves to me again. LOL, and I was a HUGE fan. Imagine what some BG thinks of this half assed shit. Of course he's not gonna buy it.
Their flop is not due to their age nor is it due to illegal downloading. If it's their age, why is Dre still the most sought after producer in the game? If it's cuz of downloading, why are artists still going 5x platinum? Take a look at artists like Three 6 Mafia and Twista...those cats have been in the game for years and never really saw mainstream success up until recently. You know why? Cuz "Stay Fly" and "Slow Jamz" were dope fuckin songs. If those songs are wack, those artists would not have seen that type of success in this stage of their respective careers.
Bottom line, they're catching bricks cuz the music is half assed - fuck that QUARTER ASSED.
You can sit here and tell me that Rappers INCLUDING Daz and Kurupt dont sell less because of CD BURNERS all you want. But thats The stupidest thing i ever heard. I know that Cali Iz Active wouldnt have sold a million copies if not for Cd burners, but they would have sold closer to at least 50 K. Think about if you couldnt preview tracks on the net, and therfore burn Cd's> people would go in buying cd's with no prior knowledge..And would buy the Album becuz they are tha DOGG POUND. But why buy the Cd when you can burn it. Anybody that says Burners dont affect sales, get in reality.
-
Good Points. I'll attribute the "flop" to half assed music. How many people on this forum would say "Daz, Kurupt, and Snoop have all steadily improved musically and creatively expanded in the last several years"? or "Compare their work from the first 7 years in the game to the last 7 years in the game. Their shit in the last 7 years DESTROY's the first 7!" LOL, NOBODY. To me, anybody that would say that is in complete and utter denial.
For instance, I'd say the single was average at best. And you know what? That's actually BETTER than I thought it would be. These guys have lowered expectations so much, that now if I don't think it's COMPLETELY wack, that they've actually impressed me. How twisted is that shit? If this type of single were released on their initial albums, it would have been the wackest shit on the album. But DPG 2006, this ain't too bad. They've half assed it for so long, talked out their ass so much, and it's really catching up to them. It's like each album from these guys either together or solo has shown a decline in effort and quality. In the 90's through 2000/2001 I'd cop their shit sight unseen (unheard) because I still had faith that they were gonna bring the heat. However, 6 years later I've eaten enough of their bullshit that they have to prove themselves to me again. LOL, and I was a HUGE fan. Imagine what some BG thinks of this half assed shit. Of course he's not gonna buy it.
Their flop is not due to their age nor is it due to illegal downloading. If it's their age, why is Dre still the most sought after producer in the game? If it's cuz of downloading, why are artists still going 5x platinum? Take a look at artists like Three 6 Mafia and Twista...those cats have been in the game for years and never really saw mainstream success up until recently. You know why? Cuz "Stay Fly" and "Slow Jamz" were dope fuckin songs. If those songs are wack, those artists would not have seen that type of success in this stage of their respective careers.
Bottom line, they're catching bricks cuz the music is half assed - fuck that QUARTER ASSED.
You can sit here and tell me that Rappers INCLUDING Daz and Kurupt dont sell less because of CD BURNERS all you want. But thats The stupidest thing i ever heard. I know that Cali Iz Active wouldnt have sold a million copies if not for Cd burners, but they would have sold closer to at least 50 K. Think about if you couldnt preview tracks on the net, and therfore burn Cd's> people would go in buying cd's with no prior knowledge..And would buy the Album becuz they are tha DOGG POUND. But why buy the Cd when you can burn it. Anybody that says Burners dont affect sales, get in reality.
Slap yourself. So, if they would have gotten 50k it wouldn't have been a flop? You're killing me dog. Burning CD's ABSOLUTELY effects sales, BUT IT'S NOT THE REASON THIS ALBUM FLOPPED. Which is what I originally stated. Reading comprehension is crucial :grumpy:
-
30.000 is not so bad when you see that CIA is the best chart-newcomer of rap-music this weak on place #28 behind Shwanna's, but I don't count Shawnna. ;)
-
BTW, Ice Cubes videos have been played much more than Cali Iz Active, and Cube had sick promotion for LNCL.....Ice Cube is HUGE right now...But then again, he DID release a bangin album.
Cube had more magazine and press hype than Tha Dogg Pound, but I've seen Cali iz active more times on tv than "Why we thugs". However I haven't heard either song on Philly radio. Shit, I don't even know the last time I heard either act on Philly radio for that matter
-
daz n kurupt is out of the game for sho.
yeah...cd burning have lot of effects on sales...however...people would still buy the album if it was tight...if the production was from daz.
-
LOL @ blaming cd burners for the flop
every album gets burned, Cube's album got leaked way before CIA and it destroyed CIA in sales
-
LOL @ blaming cd burners for the flop
every album gets burned, Cube's album got leaked way before CIA and it destroyed CIA in sales
well...it's not the sole reason why it's been sold 30k...the album itself is wack...that's pure simple.
-
LOL @ blaming cd burners for the flop
every album gets burned, Cube's album got leaked way before CIA and it destroyed CIA in sales
well...it's not the sole reason why it's been sold 30k...the album itself is wack...that's pure simple.
exactly
-
going through this thread (http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=114140.0), it's humerous at how some people are trying to defend the Cali iz Active album. Saying that "Cali Iz Active" did ok with 30,000 sales is like saying George W Bush has been an ok President. Tha Dogg Pound had articles on MTV.com and in The Source, a mixtape to promote the album, commercials on tv, not to mention the video, and they still couldn't sell shit.
Point blank, them opening up at 30,000 is terrible. That number is pathetic and I'm wondering how this is not considered a flop on this board yet Mobb Deep's new album selling 100,000 albums is?
By the way, the excuses that Tha Dogg Pound released the album independently and that they released it through Koch Records are NOT VALID EXCUSES. Jim Jones, B.G., DJ Khaled, and D-Block are all on Koch and have sold more, plus Cube sold 140,000 copies of his album independently with virtually no spins (on the east coast) and no video play, plus has not released an album in 6 years.
I know that this is targeted at the sales topic in general, although my particular post didn't defend the selling of 30,000. It is an awfully low number, and lower than I personally anticipated. However, I stand by my point where I said that if they push out another single using one of the more mainstream cuts and end up selling 100k, that's an acceptable amount by Koch's standards. Maybe they will, maybe they won't but the commercial potential is there. I've been saying it for a while now - "Cali Iz Active" was never going to blow on a mainstream level, even though I really enjoyed the track as a fan.
Cube is distributed by Virgin in the UK (and maybe the rest of Europe) and is, if my memory serves me right, distributed in the US by Interscope, so he has some form of major label help even if Lench Mob itself is independant. Plus, I don't think the Cube comparison is fair at all. With his success in Hollywood, Cube never went anywhere and has always been in the public eye. He's also become a cultural icon, and movie fans (hell, fans in general) are frequently reminded in biographies, interviews, and so on, that he started his career as an exceptional rapper. Add to that all the talk of the work with Dre, the rumoured NWA album, and a classic legacy, and it should come as no surprise that Cube sold so well. There's always been anticipation for Cube to return to music, while movies ensure that he isn't forgotten about.
DPG, meanwhile, have been out of the public eye for far too long and, as a result, it's no surprise that their appeal has faded. That's partly their fault, although there are of course other factors, such as bad record deals and the obvious fact that anyone on an independantly funded label such as DPG Recordz is going to struggle to break into the mainstream. The music they've released has also been decidedly hit-and-miss IMO, although nowhere near as bad as some people on here would suggest. I guess this just proves Warren right: the game don't wait for anybody, and DPG were simply out of the game for too long.
Cube was not distributed by Interscope in the states......He used Virgin for his Oversees distribution only......That's why I don't even speak about his oversees sales because they don't mean shit over here(except for his pockets). NO MAJOR HELP IN THE STATES HOMIE.
-
Good Points. I'll attribute the "flop" to half assed music. How many people on this forum would say "Daz, Kurupt, and Snoop have all steadily improved musically and creatively expanded in the last several years"? or "Compare their work from the first 7 years in the game to the last 7 years in the game. Their shit in the last 7 years DESTROY's the first 7!" LOL, NOBODY. To me, anybody that would say that is in complete and utter denial.
For instance, I'd say the single was average at best. And you know what? That's actually BETTER than I thought it would be. These guys have lowered expectations so much, that now if I don't think it's COMPLETELY wack, that they've actually impressed me. How twisted is that shit? If this type of single were released on their initial albums, it would have been the wackest shit on the album. But DPG 2006, this ain't too bad. They've half assed it for so long, talked out their ass so much, and it's really catching up to them. It's like each album from these guys either together or solo has shown a decline in effort and quality. In the 90's through 2000/2001 I'd cop their shit sight unseen (unheard) because I still had faith that they were gonna bring the heat. However, 6 years later I've eaten enough of their bullshit that they have to prove themselves to me again. LOL, and I was a HUGE fan. Imagine what some BG thinks of this half assed shit. Of course he's not gonna buy it.
Their flop is not due to their age nor is it due to illegal downloading. If it's their age, why is Dre still the most sought after producer in the game? If it's cuz of downloading, why are artists still going 5x platinum? Take a look at artists like Three 6 Mafia and Twista...those cats have been in the game for years and never really saw mainstream success up until recently. You know why? Cuz "Stay Fly" and "Slow Jamz" were dope fuckin songs. If those songs are wack, those artists would not have seen that type of success in this stage of their respective careers.
Bottom line, they're catching bricks cuz the music is half assed - fuck that QUARTER ASSED.
You can sit here and tell me that Rappers INCLUDING Daz and Kurupt dont sell less because of CD BURNERS all you want. But thats The stupidest thing i ever heard. I know that Cali Iz Active wouldnt have sold a million copies if not for Cd burners, but they would have sold closer to at least 50 K. Think about if you couldnt preview tracks on the net, and therfore burn Cd's> people would go in buying cd's with no prior knowledge..And would buy the Album becuz they are tha DOGG POUND. But why buy the Cd when you can burn it. Anybody that says Burners dont affect sales, get in reality.
oink is by far the best music piracy site on the net (outside of irc) and it's only been downloaded a little over 400 times. busta and ghostface on the other hand are around 9-10k
-
BTW, Ice Cubes videos have been played much more than Cali Iz Active, and Cube had sick promotion for LNCL.....Ice Cube is HUGE right now...But then again, he DID release a bangin album.
Cube had more magazine and press hype than Tha Dogg Pound, but I've seen Cali iz active more times on tv than "Why we thugs". However I haven't heard either song on Philly radio. Shit, I don't even know the last time I heard either act on Philly radio for that matter
man, Go To Church is HUGE right now....I seen way more commercials for "Laugh Now, Cry Later", seen Cube on RapCity twice, 106 nPark twice and his album has been talked about on MuchMusic, MTV and BET alot more than Cali Iz Active.
-
I don't think a daz or kurupt album has ever sold 30,000 copies in the first week, for the past 5 years. and combined those 2 have dropped a shitload of albums in the last 5 years. so 30,000 ain't too bad.
-
I don't think a daz or kurupt album has ever sold 30,000 copies in the first week, for the past 5 years. and combined those 2 have dropped a shitload of albums in the last 5 years. so 30,000 ain't too bad.
thats tru, i be coppin em... i love DPG
-
lmao Dipset's A&R 'Duke da God' sold 50k opening week :laugh: this shit is digusting ;D
-
LOL @ blaming cd burners for the flop
every album gets burned, Cube's album got leaked way before CIA and it destroyed CIA in sales
well...it's not the sole reason why it's been sold 30k...the album itself is wack...that's pure simple.
exactly
-
Let's wait 2 more and see how many they'll sell. You can help, go out and buy it ;)
With another video (maybe with diddy or banner) they'll push it to 100k - 150k I hope. Do you how much Dillinger & Young Gotti II sold?
BTW: How many units sold of "Bullys Wit Fullys 3" so far? This shit is def. bangin!
-
Blaming CD burning and downloading is a non-argument, because every artist can suffer from it. The 'average' rap fan is as likely to download 50's album as much as Tha Pound's - probably more so. But you won't hear anyone complaining that 50's sales are jeapordised by that.
I haven't heard CIA. I probably won't. It doesn't interest me at all and while I would probably pick it up to hear if I see a second hand copy for a fiver in a few months, I certainly wouldn't dream of paying full-price.
Nevertheless, the objective fact here is that the album is a relative flop next to a) other current hip-hop albums and b) Snoop or Tha Pound at their peak.
As far as I can tell, it comes down to what some here have already said: there's simply no demand for this album. Don't get me wrong, I like Snoop and Daz is a pretty good producer, but did anyone really need this reunion in their lives? Just my two cents.
-
Its sad, but I guess nobody is checking for Tha Doggpound anymore......
that their is simple truth.......most these new fans dont even know who dpg are
-
Since when is your album supposed to do all it's gonna do in a week or so? In independent circles 30,000 first week would be a good thing. I think it could go 300,000 to gold+ if they choose the next single right. Daz should do a remix that could be downloaded with purchase.
www.tagworld.com/thablaqsinattra
-
Let's wait 2 more and see how many they'll sell. You can help, go out and buy it ;)
With another video (maybe with diddy or banner) they'll push it to 100k - 150k I hope. Do you how much Dillinger & Young Gotti II sold?
Why pay $11.99 for a coaster when I can go to Chili's and steal some from the table for free?
-
Since when is your album supposed to do all it's gonna do in a week or so? In independent circles 30,000 first week would be a good thing. I think it could go 300,000 to gold+ if they choose the next single right. Daz should do a remix that could be downloaded with purchase.
www.tagworld.com/thablaqsinattra
actually, the majority of the albums do most of their business the first couple weeks after they are released. Rarely does an album explode sales wise weeks/months after they are released. Pretty much the only time that an album will gain sales after being released is right after the grammy's. And this album is the furthest thing from being nomiated for a grammy
-
it was a terrible album...and yes worse albums have sold more...but that isnt an excuse
being a legend doesnt mean you dont have to work hard on an album any more....if you dont put in work it shows on the record...a lotta this album was lazy...its disrespectful to the fans that have supported you for over a decade
never thought i'd say this but i made a mistake buying this album :(...and i hope dogg pound dont put out another one coz im not buying that...theyre just not hungry anymore...cube was, and it showed
peace
-
Nevertheless, the objective fact here is that the album is a relative flop next to b) Snoop or Tha Pound at their peak.
Snoop's featured only on a few songs and what I hear is near on his peak from today. Dude's hungry, check "It's All Hood" his verse fucks Daz and Kurupt's one deep down in their asses!
-
it was a terrible album...and yes worse albums have sold more...but that isnt an excuse
being a legend doesnt mean you dont have to work hard on an album any more....if you dont put in work it shows on the record...a lotta this album was lazy...its disrespectful to the fans that have supported you for over a decade
never thought i'd say this but i made a mistake buying this album :(...and i hope dogg pound dont put out another one coz im not buying that...theyre just not hungry anymore...cube was, and it showed
peace
LOL, I was gonna buy it too but u changed my mind. Thanx for saving me money ;D