It's June 16, 2024, 07:35:28 AM
Total Members Voted: 45
Quote from: MoSavThanLegit on August 07, 2006, 05:44:04 PMSome of these WC artists need to help themselves before Dre can help themTrue!
Some of these WC artists need to help themselves before Dre can help them
1. at this point the birthplace of hip hop is 100% irrelevant. Kool Herc invented the shit, not the entire state of NY. yall got bullshit out there too, just like anywhere else.
2. LOL are you fuckin kidding me? California is the most populated and most diverse state in the country. The fact that you think we are nothin but lowriders and blunts is just proof that you are out of touch with the West Coast and are hangin on to 10+ year old West Coast stereotypes. No, we dont wear chucks and flannels either. Get the fuck outta here, lol. And just for the record, you got just as many, and actually probably more rappers on the East claiming gangsta this and thug that in everything they do. 50 Cent, Benie Segal, Fat Joe, Camron and the Dipset, Ja Rule, Lil Kim, Jay Z, Memphis Bleek, etc etc etc etc.
And no, what you are saying does not characterize 99% of West Coast rap fans, again, that is you overgeneralizing us, an uninformed generalization at that. I would recommend that you take a trip to Cali, but then you will just see what you want to see. Yes there is lowriders and blunts out here, but if you honestly believe thats all we are, then you need to get off your computer and leave the house sometime.
Quote from: Turf Hitta on August 07, 2006, 04:46:24 PM1. at this point the birthplace of hip hop is 100% irrelevant. Kool Herc invented the shit, not the entire state of NY. yall got bullshit out there too, just like anywhere else.Not nearly as much as some places (the West being one of them).Quote from: Turf Hitta on August 07, 2006, 04:46:24 PM2. LOL are you fuckin kidding me? California is the most populated and most diverse state in the country. The fact that you think we are nothin but lowriders and blunts is just proof that you are out of touch with the West Coast and are hangin on to 10+ year old West Coast stereotypes. No, we dont wear chucks and flannels either. Get the fuck outta here, lol. And just for the record, you got just as many, and actually probably more rappers on the East claiming gangsta this and thug that in everything they do. 50 Cent, Benie Segal, Fat Joe, Camron and the Dipset, Ja Rule, Lil Kim, Jay Z, Memphis Bleek, etc etc etc etc.Cali has FAR less diversity than any other rap scene in the country, including the South. I am definitely not out of touch with Cali; even if I hadn't lived there before (and I did), just looking at this board is enough to prove you wrong.The East Coast may have lots of thug rappers, but the ratio of thugs to conscious rappers, political rappers, backpackers, etc. is far more balanced. For every 50 Cent, there are 5 Talibs or Boot Camp Cliks, while the Western ratio is more like the opposite (for every Ras Kass or Lyrics Born, there's 5 Pac or Snoop wanna-bes). West Coast niggas continue to believe that because they invented gangsta rap, that's all they should ever make.Quote from: Turf Hitta on August 07, 2006, 04:46:24 PMAnd no, what you are saying does not characterize 99% of West Coast rap fans, again, that is you overgeneralizing us, an uninformed generalization at that. I would recommend that you take a trip to Cali, but then you will just see what you want to see. Yes there is lowriders and blunts out here, but if you honestly believe thats all we are, then you need to get off your computer and leave the house sometime.Like I said, I have already lived in Cali. I know what the fuck Cali is like.And as I've said before, you only need to look at this board as proof that your argument is bullshit. I realize that only a tiny % of posters are from Cali, but like I said, it's West Coast FANS as much as West Coast rappers I'm talking about.
this cat is nuts....first off, when gangsta rap was in high gear, the east copied, and the west put out Paperboy, Ahmad, Skee-Lo, about half a dozen latin rap acts, which include Lighter Shade of Brown who was not gangsta rap, just Sunday kickback rap, and of course Pharcyde. Later, we still put out J-5, Ras Kass, Dilated People, Crooked I, and we still have Omar Cruz and tons of other Latin rappers. How could you say you lived in Cali when you don't remember how much different shit Power used to play, or maybe you where in the Bay, and you knew KMEL back then was the shit. Cali is the most culturally diverse state. Even in Hip-Hop.
Quote from: M Dogg of the Elite on August 08, 2006, 07:38:24 AMthis cat is nuts....first off, when gangsta rap was in high gear, the east copied, and the west put out Paperboy, Ahmad, Skee-Lo, about half a dozen latin rap acts, which include Lighter Shade of Brown who was not gangsta rap, just Sunday kickback rap, and of course Pharcyde. Later, we still put out J-5, Ras Kass, Dilated People, Crooked I, and we still have Omar Cruz and tons of other Latin rappers. How could you say you lived in Cali when you don't remember how much different shit Power used to play, or maybe you where in the Bay, and you knew KMEL back then was the shit. Cali is the most culturally diverse state. Even in Hip-Hop.Again, those cats are EXCEPTIONS, not the rule. I remember all of them (and was a fan of all them), but I also remember that when I was listening to Souls of Mischief, almost everyone I knew was just bumping "The Chronic" and "Doggystyle" nonstop. When G-Funk was popular, there were zillions of artists doing that style, and to this day, the gangsta/G-Funk template is still more-or-less standard for the West. There are simply too many gangstas, and West Coast FANS as a whole are quite possibly the most superficial and image-obsessed people in all of hip-hop. And this is reflected in the music.You say it's just a stereotype, but stereotypes come from somewhere.
BACK TO THE TOPIC......Personally, it's not Dre's responsibility or obligation to so called "help the west out", although I can understand why most of us feel that we need him to. I think the problem right now is that we are too dependent on Dre, and people just sit around waiting for Detox to come so that they can try to catch a deal, and producers are waiting on that so they'll know what sound to follow for the next few years. But IF Dre said "Detox is completely cancelled, and I'm retiring", the west would temporarily hate him and probably blame him for us never coming back....versus us saying "fuck it...well let's keep it movin...where's the next generation at?" I think we need to start looking towards a new sound, movement, and generation, instead of waiting on Dre to somehow bring us back. Personally, even if he comes with Detox and has a grip of west coast artists on it, it still may not "bring us back" because the 2001 era had A LOT of potential and dope artists/albums...but we still fell right back off.
I remember Power was playing all of them, not just the G-Funk. There are stereotypes, and at the time everyone was jumping on the G-Funk bandwagon, but at the same time, everyone was doing the same in the east, and in the mid-west and south. G-Funk was a nation thing that started from the west, so we got the stereotype. G-Funk and Gangsta Rap I think got worst once G-Funk died, because westcoast artist were wanting to become popular, and with the dying westcoast, they were trying to do what works, and that's G Funk/Gangsta Rap. We got tons of new artist that looked up to Ice T and NWA and 2Pac, and they all wanted to be on some Gangsta Rap shit. At the same time, that was the era that J-5 and Dilated Peoples were on the radio, and other non Gangsta Rap westcoast artist actually got some national play. It's ironic because it was at that time that the west was the most saturated with Gangsta Rappers, yet they were not getting play.
I think your argument on this is hella biased....For one, most rappers in NY who are up and coming rap about very similar topics, with most being the typical punchilnes, multis, drug, gun, and murder references. California has always had a large range of different artists, and we still do, but many of these artists just aren't heard as much. Maybe you have to be here for 21 years to understand it.
And for you to say we are the most superficial and image obsessed is definitely the most biased, incorrect assumption I've heard in a long time.....I know a LOT of people from NY, and even though many of them are somewhat trapped between "thug and college student", most of them will judge rapper's street cred just as much or more than a typical person on the West would. Most people in L.A. could really care less about how "real" somebody is...but a NY cat will knock a dope rapper just because they "ain't from the hood" "they were soft in their hood" "they didn't grow up in the gutter" and all else. Please believe, people are the same in NY, L.A., the south, and the midwest....
You can't act like everybody on the west was on the G-Funk bandwagon, as if NY hasn't jumped on EVERY single bandwagon that came along....as soon as they saw it was cool to cuss and rap about negativity, many of the artists started doing that....when Wu Tang and Nas came with that "from the streets" style, they all started doing that....when they saw it was cool to get jiggy and dress flashy, many, but not all, started doing that.....when they saw it's cool to rap about gangbangin like L.A. used to always do, some of the artists did that, such as Dipset and others.
If you know what Cali is like and you know all about the Cali rap scene and all that shit, how come you keep using "this board" as your point of reference? This is the internet, not California. Every single "point" you thought you made is officially voided because you are basing your "knowledge" of the West Coast on a fuckin internet message board where most of the people here aint even from Cali.
You obviously do not know much about the California rap scene if you cant see how diverse the shit is here. We got cats like Paris (who Chuck D is signed with by the way), Askari X, The Coup, then you got Del and Heiro,The Lifesavas, Blackalicious, Zion I, Aceyalone, Dilated Peoples then you got cats like Messy Marv, C-Bo, Yukmouth, Guce, Killa Tay, then you got Too Short, Mac Dre, Mac Mall, Xzibit Then you got The Federation, Kinsmoke, The Team, The Pack and then you got E-40 in his own damn league, Crooked I who is the best lyricist in rap and Ice Cube who is as versatile as anybody in rap.
the disproportionate number of gangstas to "alternative" artists is obvious. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: You can list all the dope, unique artists from Cali you want, but for every Pharcyde, there are 10 Snoop or Pac wanna-bes.
Quote from: Turf Hitta on August 08, 2006, 09:04:59 PMIf you know what Cali is like and you know all about the Cali rap scene and all that shit, how come you keep using "this board" as your point of reference? This is the internet, not California. Every single "point" you thought you made is officially voided because you are basing your "knowledge" of the West Coast on a fuckin internet message board where most of the people here aint even from Cali.I am using both. But most of the white kids on this board who are fulfilling the stereotypes I'm discussing are doing so because they are directly imitating Cali rap fans who ARE from Cali. West Coast fans, both on this board and in Cali (and I know many), are very much obsessed with gangsta image and other superficial traits.
Quote from: Turf Hitta on August 08, 2006, 09:04:59 PM You obviously do not know much about the California rap scene if you cant see how diverse the shit is here. We got cats like Paris (who Chuck D is signed with by the way), Askari X, The Coup, then you got Del and Heiro,The Lifesavas, Blackalicious, Zion I, Aceyalone, Dilated Peoples then you got cats like Messy Marv, C-Bo, Yukmouth, Guce, Killa Tay, then you got Too Short, Mac Dre, Mac Mall, Xzibit Then you got The Federation, Kinsmoke, The Team, The Pack and then you got E-40 in his own damn league, Crooked I who is the best lyricist in rap and Ice Cube who is as versatile as anybody in rap. I've said it before, and I'll say it again:Quotethe disproportionate number of gangstas to "alternative" artists is obvious. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: You can list all the dope, unique artists from Cali you want, but for every Pharcyde, there are 10 Snoop or Pac wanna-bes.You also seem to be missing my point. I don't have any particular problem with Cali. I do, however, have a big problem with the fact that it is West Coast rap fans who are generally the ones doing most of the complaining about the state of hip-hop today, when many of them listen to artists who are just as responsible for fucking up the game as anyone from the East or the West. They are the biggest bunch of hypocrites I've ever seen.
Quote from: M Dogg of the Elite on August 08, 2006, 08:04:07 AMI remember Power was playing all of them, not just the G-Funk. There are stereotypes, and at the time everyone was jumping on the G-Funk bandwagon, but at the same time, everyone was doing the same in the east, and in the mid-west and south. G-Funk was a nation thing that started from the west, so we got the stereotype. G-Funk and Gangsta Rap I think got worst once G-Funk died, because westcoast artist were wanting to become popular, and with the dying westcoast, they were trying to do what works, and that's G Funk/Gangsta Rap. We got tons of new artist that looked up to Ice T and NWA and 2Pac, and they all wanted to be on some Gangsta Rap shit. At the same time, that was the era that J-5 and Dilated Peoples were on the radio, and other non Gangsta Rap westcoast artist actually got some national play. It's ironic because it was at that time that the west was the most saturated with Gangsta Rappers, yet they were not getting play.Bullshit. I remember Power playing probably 90% gangsta records, both from L.A. and from the Bay. And G-Funk wasn't imitated THAT much outside of Cali; the Midwest (Bone Thugs) were about the only other people who adopted it. New York followed the stripped-down sound of RZA and the pop-sampling of Diddy when those styles became popular. They retained their own niche.Quote from: R-Tistic on August 08, 2006, 11:58:11 AMI think your argument on this is hella biased....For one, most rappers in NY who are up and coming rap about very similar topics, with most being the typical punchilnes, multis, drug, gun, and murder references. California has always had a large range of different artists, and we still do, but many of these artists just aren't heard as much. Maybe you have to be here for 21 years to understand it.First of all, part of the reason those artists aren't heard as much is because their own coast refuses to support them. I remember Pharcyde, Digital Underground, Freestyle Fellowship, Hieroglyphics, etc. getting far more love in the East than they were ever getting in the West. So what does that say about the West, then?Second, as I have said, the disproportionate number of gangstas to "alternative" artists is obvious. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: You can list all the dope, unique artists from Cali you want, but for every Pharcyde, there are 10 Snoop or Pac wanna-bes.Quote from: R-Tistic on August 08, 2006, 11:58:11 AMAnd for you to say we are the most superficial and image obsessed is definitely the most biased, incorrect assumption I've heard in a long time.....I know a LOT of people from NY, and even though many of them are somewhat trapped between "thug and college student", most of them will judge rapper's street cred just as much or more than a typical person on the West would. Most people in L.A. could really care less about how "real" somebody is...but a NY cat will knock a dope rapper just because they "ain't from the hood" "they were soft in their hood" "they didn't grow up in the gutter" and all else. Please believe, people are the same in NY, L.A., the south, and the midwest....Not nearly as much as in L.A., and honestly, the West in general. West Coast rappers and fans alike are the ones who most frequently make the complaints about how certain hip-hop artists aren't "real enough" because they rap about things that aren't considered "street". 9 times out of 10, when I hear somebody criticizing 50 Cent or T.I. or Nelly or whoever, they'll immediately reference Pac or Cube.NYC people aren't perfect, either. Many of them can be elitist, and the backpacker sentiments can piss me off. But generally speaking, they are far more open and tolerant of a wider variety of hip-hop styles than the average West Coast fans.Quote from: R-Tistic on August 08, 2006, 11:58:11 AMYou can't act like everybody on the west was on the G-Funk bandwagon, as if NY hasn't jumped on EVERY single bandwagon that came along....as soon as they saw it was cool to cuss and rap about negativity, many of the artists started doing that....when Wu Tang and Nas came with that "from the streets" style, they all started doing that....when they saw it was cool to get jiggy and dress flashy, many, but not all, started doing that.....when they saw it's cool to rap about gangbangin like L.A. used to always do, some of the artists did that, such as Dipset and others. Adopting bad langauge on record is about the ONLY bandwagon that the East took from the West. But when it came time for the gangsta/hardcore age, the East carved out their own style and did their own thing; so even if they were gangsta, they were gangsta in their own way. "Illmatic" and "Ready To Die" sound vastly different from "Dogg Food" and "All Eyez On Me".And yes, everybody on the West was on the G-Funk bandwagon. Even to this day, G-Funk influences are obvious in most West Coast records.Quote from: Turf Hitta on August 08, 2006, 09:04:59 PMIf you know what Cali is like and you know all about the Cali rap scene and all that shit, how come you keep using "this board" as your point of reference? This is the internet, not California. Every single "point" you thought you made is officially voided because you are basing your "knowledge" of the West Coast on a fuckin internet message board where most of the people here aint even from Cali.I am using both. But most of the white kids on this board who are fulfilling the stereotypes I'm discussing are doing so because they are directly imitating Cali rap fans who ARE from Cali. West Coast fans, both on this board and in Cali (and I know many), are very much obsessed with gangsta image and other superficial traits.Quote from: Turf Hitta on August 08, 2006, 09:04:59 PM You obviously do not know much about the California rap scene if you cant see how diverse the shit is here. We got cats like Paris (who Chuck D is signed with by the way), Askari X, The Coup, then you got Del and Heiro,The Lifesavas, Blackalicious, Zion I, Aceyalone, Dilated Peoples then you got cats like Messy Marv, C-Bo, Yukmouth, Guce, Killa Tay, then you got Too Short, Mac Dre, Mac Mall, Xzibit Then you got The Federation, Kinsmoke, The Team, The Pack and then you got E-40 in his own damn league, Crooked I who is the best lyricist in rap and Ice Cube who is as versatile as anybody in rap. I've said it before, and I'll say it again:Quotethe disproportionate number of gangstas to "alternative" artists is obvious. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: You can list all the dope, unique artists from Cali you want, but for every Pharcyde, there are 10 Snoop or Pac wanna-bes.You also seem to be missing my point. I don't have any particular problem with Cali. I do, however, have a big problem with the fact that it is West Coast rap fans who are generally the ones doing most of the complaining about the state of hip-hop today, when many of them listen to artists who are just as responsible for fucking up the game as anyone from the East or the West. They are the biggest bunch of hypocrites I've ever seen.