This series proves why Duncan is better than Shaq

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

^^Did you not see that Kobe shot 29 of 86 in the four losses, it's right there clear as crystal, what do you gotta say about that.  Despite getting harassed on defense Shaq still shot fantastic percentages, so they SHOULD have given him the ball more and if Detroit was blocking the passing lanes then Kobe shouldn't have missed so god damn much, don't even trip and say Kobe didn't fuck up, who cares what he did in the Western Conference finals, he didn't do much in the finals, which shows he shoulda just sit down and shut up and let it be Shaq's team for another couple of championships, nuff said

Kobe wasn't unquestionably better than Shaq by 2004? LOL if you deny this. The fact that Shaq demanded the offense, and didn't come through (who cares about percentages, dude showed up EVERY OTHER game) obviously threw the rest of the team off...Deep down inside, you know what's up. Kobe shoulda' had the offense by '03. I GUARANTEE the dynasty would still be alive had that been the case...PeACe

[Don Jacob]

^^Did you not see that Kobe shot 29 of 86 in the four losses, it's right there clear as crystal, what do you gotta say about that.  Despite getting harassed on defense Shaq still shot fantastic percentages, so they SHOULD have given him the ball more and if Detroit was blocking the passing lanes then Kobe shouldn't have missed so god damn much, don't even trip and say Kobe didn't fuck up, who cares what he did in the Western Conference finals, he didn't do much in the finals, which shows he shoulda just sit down and shut up and let it be Shaq's team for another couple of championships, nuff said

Kobe wasn't unquestionably better than Shaq by 2004? LOL if you deny this. The fact that Shaq demanded the offense, and didn't come through (who cares about percentages, dude showed up EVERY OTHER game) obviously threw the rest of the team off...Deep down inside, you know what's up. Kobe shoulda' had the offense by '03. I GUARANTEE the dynasty would still be alive had that been the case...PeACe

the sad thing is that the offense did run through kobe in that series and kobe let us down big time.
fact of the matter was when shaq got the ball he delivered. if shaq was out of shape so was kobe because he didn't put up numbers qutie as nice when it mattered that shaq did. kobe's numbers were more unbalanced than shaq's were.


look at the stats

Shaq 2004 NBA finals:
S. O'Neal
 26.6  points per game, 10.8  rebounds per game, 1.6  assists per game, over .500  field goal percentage!  what more could you want from shaq, when the team wasn't able to get the ball to him??


game 1:

Shaq:
MP  FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
45  13  16  .813   0   0     8   12    5      11   1     0   1      6   4  34

kobe:
MP  FG FGA FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
47  10  27  .370    1   6      4   4      1     4     4   4      2    3   2    25

after game one you can conclude that shaq
-shot better than kobe 2.5x
-and was more agressive on defense
-was NOT affected by detroits defense, unlike kobe

you can also conclude that
-the offense ran through kobe  as shaq shot 16 times and kobe shot 27


game 2:

shaq:
 MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
 48  10  20   .500    0   0      9  14   3      7    3       0   1      3   5  29

Kobe:
MP  FG FGA FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
49  14  27  .519    1   5      4   5      0    4     7     2   0       5   5  33


after game two you can concludethat shaq:
- was not affected by the detroit defense
- put together his second straight great game (disproving your showing up every other night theory)
you can also concluded:
-the offense ran through mostly kobe as he shot 27 shots and shaq shot 20, proving the theory that if you feed shaq the ball more you win....which they did


game 3:

shaq:
 MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
 38   7  14    .500    0   0      0   2      2   8       1   1     0     2   5  14

Kobe:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF  PTS
45   4  13    .307   0   4      3   3     0      3   5      1   1       4   3   11

after game 3 you can conclude that:
-shaq and kobe were both affected by the detroit defense
-shaq was less affected as, he still shot at .500
-kobe's performance was more of a 180 degree change than shaq's
-the offense never got off the ground

game 4:

shaq:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
47  16  21  .762    0   0       4  11   3      20   2   0     1       2   4  36

kobe:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
45   8  25     .320  2   6      2   2       0   0      2   1       0   3   3    20

after game 4 you can conclude:
-shaq rebounded from his his bad performance from game 3
-kobe did not posting up his second consecutive bad game of the series
-the offense definately ran through kobe this game as he jacked up more shots than shaq but ended up with LESS, i said LESS poitns
-kobe was affected by the detroit defense
-shaq was not affected by the defense
-shaq showed up on the defensive end kobe did not
-shaq grabbed 20 rebounds, kobe not 1
-shaq 3 great performances 1 bad one
-kobe 1 great performance 1 average, and two bad ones, reverses your theory about shaq showing up every other game


game 5

shaq:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
35   7   13  .538    0   0      6  16     2      8   1    1     0      1   4  20

kobe:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
45   7  21   .333    0   2     10  11   1     3     4     1   0       3   2  24

after game five you can conclude:
-for the FIFTH  i said FIIIIIIIFTH straight game the offense ran through mostly kobe
-kobe took far more shots than shaq yet they ended up with almost the same points
-kobe was devastated by detroits defense, where as shaq was less
- shaq still turned in a good performance where as kobe turned in an average one at best
- finals score is  shaq 3 great games, 1 bad one , 1 good one ;  kobe 3 bad games, 1 bad one, 1 average one

after 2004 season the offense ran through kobe 110%, then we failed to make playoffs
after 2004 season the offense runs through shaq some where else, he almsot wins mvp, and is one rebound away from making it to the finals again



you're wrong NIK just admit it

[teecee]

^^Did you not see that Kobe shot 29 of 86 in the four losses, it's right there clear as crystal, what do you gotta say about that.  Despite getting harassed on defense Shaq still shot fantastic percentages, so they SHOULD have given him the ball more and if Detroit was blocking the passing lanes then Kobe shouldn't have missed so god damn much, don't even trip and say Kobe didn't fuck up, who cares what he did in the Western Conference finals, he didn't do much in the finals, which shows he shoulda just sit down and shut up and let it be Shaq's team for another couple of championships, nuff said

Kobe wasn't unquestionably better than Shaq by 2004? LOL if you deny this. The fact that Shaq demanded the offense, and didn't come through (who cares about percentages, dude showed up EVERY OTHER game) obviously threw the rest of the team off...Deep down inside, you know what's up. Kobe shoulda' had the offense by '03. I GUARANTEE the dynasty would still be alive had that been the case...PeACe

the sad thing is that the offense did run through kobe in that series and kobe let us down big time.
fact of the matter was when shaq got the ball he delivered. if shaq was out of shape so was kobe because he didn't put up numbers qutie as nice when it mattered that shaq did. kobe's numbers were more unbalanced than shaq's were.


look at the stats

Shaq 2004 NBA finals:
S. O'Neal
 26.6  points per game, 10.8  rebounds per game, 1.6  assists per game, over .500  field goal percentage!  what more could you want from shaq, when the team wasn't able to get the ball to him??


game 1:

Shaq:
MP  FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
45  13  16  .813   0   0     8   12    5      11   1     0   1      6   4  34

kobe:
MP  FG FGA FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
47  10  27  .370    1   6      4   4      1     4     4   4      2    3   2    25

after game one you can conclude that shaq
-shot better than kobe 2.5x
-and was more agressive on defense
-was NOT affected by detroits defense, unlike kobe

you can also conclude that
-the offense ran through kobe  as shaq shot 16 times and kobe shot 27


game 2:

shaq:
 MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
 48  10  20   .500    0   0      9  14   3      7    3       0   1      3   5  29

Kobe:
MP  FG FGA FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
49  14  27  .519    1   5      4   5      0    4     7     2   0       5   5  33


after game two you can concludethat shaq:
- was not affected by the detroit defense
- put together his second straight great game (disproving your showing up every other night theory)
you can also concluded:
-the offense ran through mostly kobe as he shot 27 shots and shaq shot 20, proving the theory that if you feed shaq the ball more you win....which they did


game 3:

shaq:
 MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
 38   7  14    .500    0   0      0   2      2   8       1   1     0     2   5  14

Kobe:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF  PTS
45   4  13    .307   0   4      3   3     0      3   5      1   1       4   3   11

after game 3 you can conclude that:
-shaq and kobe were both affected by the detroit defense
-shaq was less affected as, he still shot at .500
-kobe's performance was more of a 180 degree change than shaq's
-the offense never got off the ground

game 4:

shaq:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
47  16  21  .762    0   0       4  11   3      20   2   0     1       2   4  36

kobe:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
45   8  25     .320  2   6      2   2       0   0      2   1       0   3   3    20

after game 4 you can conclude:
-shaq rebounded from his his bad performance from game 3
-kobe did not posting up his second consecutive bad game of the series
-the offense definately ran through kobe this game as he jacked up more shots than shaq but ended up with LESS, i said LESS poitns
-kobe was affected by the detroit defense
-shaq was not affected by the defense
-shaq showed up on the defensive end kobe did not
-shaq grabbed 20 rebounds, kobe not 1
-shaq 3 great performances 1 bad one
-kobe 1 great performance 1 average, and two bad ones, reverses your theory about shaq showing up every other game


game 5

shaq:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
35   7   13  .538    0   0      6  16     2      8   1    1     0      1   4  20

kobe:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
45   7  21   .333    0   2     10  11   1     3     4     1   0       3   2  24

after game five you can conclude:
-for the FIFTH  i said FIIIIIIIFTH straight game the offense ran through mostly kobe
-kobe took far more shots than shaq yet they ended up with almost the same points
-kobe was devastated by detroits defense, where as shaq was less
- shaq still turned in a good performance where as kobe turned in an average one at best
- finals score is  shaq 3 great games, 1 bad one , 1 good one ;  kobe 3 bad games, 1 bad one, 1 average one

after 2004 season the offense ran through kobe 110%, then we failed to make playoffs
after 2004 season the offense runs through shaq some where else, he almsot wins mvp, and is one rebound away from making it to the finals again



you're wrong NIK just admit it

Don Jacob, you are just influenced by the media; the media, who hate Kobe, likely manipulated those numbers to make it look like Kobe took more shots, shot a far worse percentage, and thus played worse than Shaq.  However, if you ask NIK, that is not the case.  It was Shaq who took ridiculous fadeaway off balance three's (he wore number 8 this series), it was Shaq who took forced shots when double teamed despite having a center who was shooting like 60 percent for the series.

Enough with the stats and facts, NIK is right because, as he says, if he "truly believes" something, than he is right and thus entitled to his opinion! 

[hisairness]

^^Did you not see that Kobe shot 29 of 86 in the four losses, it's right there clear as crystal, what do you gotta say about that.  Despite getting harassed on defense Shaq still shot fantastic percentages, so they SHOULD have given him the ball more and if Detroit was blocking the passing lanes then Kobe shouldn't have missed so god damn much, don't even trip and say Kobe didn't fuck up, who cares what he did in the Western Conference finals, he didn't do much in the finals, which shows he shoulda just sit down and shut up and let it be Shaq's team for another couple of championships, nuff said

Kobe wasn't unquestionably better than Shaq by 2004? LOL if you deny this. The fact that Shaq demanded the offense, and didn't come through (who cares about percentages, dude showed up EVERY OTHER game) obviously threw the rest of the team off...Deep down inside, you know what's up. Kobe shoulda' had the offense by '03. I GUARANTEE the dynasty would still be alive had that been the case...PeACe

the sad thing is that the offense did run through kobe in that series and kobe let us down big time.
fact of the matter was when shaq got the ball he delivered. if shaq was out of shape so was kobe because he didn't put up numbers qutie as nice when it mattered that shaq did. kobe's numbers were more unbalanced than shaq's were.


look at the stats

Shaq 2004 NBA finals:
S. O'Neal
 26.6  points per game, 10.8  rebounds per game, 1.6  assists per game, over .500  field goal percentage!  what more could you want from shaq, when the team wasn't able to get the ball to him??


game 1:

Shaq:
MP  FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
45  13  16  .813   0   0     8   12    5      11   1     0   1      6   4  34

kobe:
MP  FG FGA FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
47  10  27  .370    1   6      4   4      1     4     4   4      2    3   2    25

after game one you can conclude that shaq
-shot better than kobe 2.5x
-and was more agressive on defense
-was NOT affected by detroits defense, unlike kobe

you can also conclude that
-the offense ran through kobe  as shaq shot 16 times and kobe shot 27


game 2:

shaq:
 MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
 48  10  20   .500    0   0      9  14   3      7    3       0   1      3   5  29

Kobe:
MP  FG FGA FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
49  14  27  .519    1   5      4   5      0    4     7     2   0       5   5  33


after game two you can concludethat shaq:
- was not affected by the detroit defense
- put together his second straight great game (disproving your showing up every other night theory)
you can also concluded:
-the offense ran through mostly kobe as he shot 27 shots and shaq shot 20, proving the theory that if you feed shaq the ball more you win....which they did


game 3:

shaq:
 MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
 38   7  14    .500    0   0      0   2      2   8       1   1     0     2   5  14

Kobe:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF  PTS
45   4  13    .307   0   4      3   3     0      3   5      1   1       4   3   11

after game 3 you can conclude that:
-shaq and kobe were both affected by the detroit defense
-shaq was less affected as, he still shot at .500
-kobe's performance was more of a 180 degree change than shaq's
-the offense never got off the ground

game 4:

shaq:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
47  16  21  .762    0   0       4  11   3      20   2   0     1       2   4  36

kobe:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
45   8  25     .320  2   6      2   2       0   0      2   1       0   3   3    20

after game 4 you can conclude:
-shaq rebounded from his his bad performance from game 3
-kobe did not posting up his second consecutive bad game of the series
-the offense definately ran through kobe this game as he jacked up more shots than shaq but ended up with LESS, i said LESS poitns
-kobe was affected by the detroit defense
-shaq was not affected by the defense
-shaq showed up on the defensive end kobe did not
-shaq grabbed 20 rebounds, kobe not 1
-shaq 3 great performances 1 bad one
-kobe 1 great performance 1 average, and two bad ones, reverses your theory about shaq showing up every other game


game 5

shaq:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
35   7   13  .538    0   0      6  16     2      8   1    1     0      1   4  20

kobe:
MP  FG FGA  FG%  3P 3PA  FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK  TO  PF PTS
45   7  21   .333    0   2     10  11   1     3     4     1   0       3   2  24

after game five you can conclude:
-for the FIFTH  i said FIIIIIIIFTH straight game the offense ran through mostly kobe
-kobe took far more shots than shaq yet they ended up with almost the same points
-kobe was devastated by detroits defense, where as shaq was less
- shaq still turned in a good performance where as kobe turned in an average one at best
- finals score is  shaq 3 great games, 1 bad one , 1 good one ;  kobe 3 bad games, 1 bad one, 1 average one

after 2004 season the offense ran through kobe 110%, then we failed to make playoffs
after 2004 season the offense runs through shaq some where else, he almsot wins mvp, and is one rebound away from making it to the finals again



you're wrong NIK just admit it

Don Jacob, you are just influenced by the media; the media, who hate Kobe, likely manipulated those numbers to make it look like Kobe took more shots, shot a far worse percentage, and thus played worse than Shaq.  However, if you ask NIK, that is not the case.  It was Shaq who took ridiculous fadeaway off balance three's (he wore number 8 this series), it was Shaq who took forced shots when double teamed despite having a center who was shooting like 60 percent for the series.

Enough with the stats and facts, NIK is right because, as he says, if he "truly believes" something, than he is right and thus entitled to his opinion! 

I'd say NIK got punked again.  Prepare yourselves for some backpedaling and LMAO'ing from him.

And teecee, you forgot that NIK's opinions are "very valid" and he has the internet status to back that up.

[Canuck]

^^^what he'll do is find one small detail in which don jacob made a mistake and go on about that and ignore the fact he was proved wrong.

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

Where was I proved wrong? None of you fucks even watched the series...The offense ran through Shaq, this isn't up for debate...The problem with Shaq was that he was OUT OF SHAPE, he couldn't play as many minutes as Kobe. By EVERY 4th quarter, Shaq was already worn out, and couldn't even get off the ground. KOBE AVERAGED MORE BLOCKS THAN SHAQ. DISGUSTING...SHAQ IS SUPPOSED TO SHOOT A HIGH PERCENTAGE! Every shot he took was a lay-up or dunk. Yes, Kobe had a bad shooting series, but Shaq kept bitching at him every chance he got! When Shaq sat down, Kobe took over and ran the offense the right way, with no fat distractions...That's how Kobe won Game 2. Offense runs through Kobe, Lakers win that series. Shaq was out to prove that he was woth $30 million a year, and still had games with under 10 rebounds and under 20 points...The team as a whole had a bad series, but I GUARANTEE more wins had the offense ran through Kobe and had Shaq not been requesting the ball every trip down the floor, putting pressure on not just Kobe, but THE WHOLE TEAM...PeACe

[Don Jacob]

Where was I proved wrong?

well i'll break it down for you again...

The offense ran through Shaq, this isn't up for debate...

total shots attempted:

Shaq=84
Kobe=113

The problem with Shaq was that he was OUT OF SHAPE, he couldn't play as many minutes as Kobe.

minutes per game

shaq=42.6
kobe=46.2

oh wow what a difference  your young swing man averaged 3.6 minutes more than your old center

(game 1 kobe played 2 more minutes than shaq, game two 1 more minute than shaq, and in game 4 shaq actually played more minutes than kobe)


 

KOBE AVERAGED MORE BLOCKS THAN SHAQ.

blocks per game:

shaq- 0.6
kobe-0.6

(nevermind all of kobe's blocks came from the perimeter, as most of detroits offense came from there, equaling less shot block opportunities in the low post)

DISGUSTING...SHAQ IS SUPPOSED TO SHOOT A HIGH PERCENTAGE! Every shot he took was a lay-up or dunk.

actually their were a lot of those one handed banks that he's known for, but even if all he did was dunk and lay up the ball  how do you say ben wallace stopped shaq??

BACK PEDDLING MOMENT #1^^^^^

also shaq is a 7'1-2, 300 pound center, he's not going to pull of for three pointers ,lol

shaq's fg% ( or how effective ben wallace was on shaq

game 1: 81.3%
game 2: 50%
game 3: 50%
game 4: 76.2%
game 5: 53.8%

Yes, Kobe had a bad shooting series, but Shaq kept bitching at him every chance he got!

that's your excuse? you mean to tell me kobe can shoot with 10 hands in his face but can't shoot if shaq is 'bitching at him'?

by saying this you're essentially saying two things
1) kobe is a pussy
2) detroit's defense had nothing to do with it

which we know the ladder is not true because detroit had more answer for kobe than they did for shaq, they were able to 'stop' or trip up kobe while they were not able to trip up shaq. anyone who watched that series (instead of watching kobe) knows that detroit had no answer for shaq, their only answer for shaq was denying him the ball by defending everyone else and their passing lanes to him. they knew they could win the series with kobe jacking up shots, they couldn't win if they had shaq scoring and setting up plays though.

When Shaq sat down, Kobe took over and ran the offense the right way, with no fat distractions...That's how Kobe won Game 2.

you didn't really watch that game huh? yeah sure kobe hit the three but look what shaq did when he was tired in the second half and in overtime

Shaquille O'Neal added 29 points for the Lakers[/u], six of them coming in the extra period as Los Angeles improved to 7-0 in overtime games during the regular season and postseason.

This time, things looked fairly hopeless for the Lakers as they trailed by six points with less than 40 seconds left in regulation. But O'Neal converted a three-point play and Chauncey Billups missed a runner for Detroit, giving the Lakers a last shot.



sorry buddy but kobe didn't win that game for us , he had A LOT of help from shaq

Offense runs through Kobe, Lakers win that series.

again the offense did run through kobe, it couldn't run through shaq because the team couldn't get him the ball.

fact IS and it's highlighted perfectly in post game articles and stats that when kobe heads the lakers they can't win a playoff series.

again the offense ran through kobe

shots attempted

shaq: 84
kobe: 113


S

haq was out to prove that he was woth $30 million a year, and still had games with under 10 rebounds and under 20 points...

oh really ?

shaq:
game 1: 34 points , 11 rebounds
game 2: 29 points, 7 rebounds
game 3: 14 points, 8 rebounds
game 4: 36 points, 20 rebounds
game 5: 20 points , 8 rebounds

average:  26.6 ppg, 10.8 rpg

^^^^that's alot better than

kobe:

game 1: 25 points,  4 rebounds
game 2: 33 points, 4 rebounds
game 3: 11 points, 3 rebounds
game 4: 20 points, 0 rebounds
game 5: 24 points, 3 rebounds

average: 22.6 ppg, 2.8 rpg

Shaq >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kobe 2004 nba finals

The team as a whole had a bad series, but I GUARANTEE more wins had the offense ran through Kobe and had Shaq not been requesting the ball every trip down the floor, putting pressure on not just Kobe, but THE WHOLE TEAM...PeACe

again the offense did run through kobe he attempted far more shots and his time of possestion far did shaq's. in those games wehre shaq outscored kobe, kobe attempted moer shots than him,lol.  again the offense was kobe's and we lost ....badly. had the lakers been able to pound the ball into shaq better we would have had a better chance of winning this series. also let their be a healthy karl malone, and let their be a phil jackson who let's derek fisher start over payton.

[Bay Area Jat]

+1 for the Don. He has been DOMINATING this debate

[Don Jacob]

^+1


i'm just keeping it real

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

LOL@"dominating" the debate...He keeps mentioning how Shaq played less minutes and had less shot attempts, but the offense was running through him. Why is this? THATS RIGHT

The problem with Shaq was that he was OUT OF SHAPE, he couldn't play as many minutes as Kobe. By EVERY 4th quarter, Shaq was already worn out, and couldn't even get off the ground.

Why ignore my main point?

Saying no one had an answer for Shaq in thats series is pretty funny, considering the amount of analysts claiming Ben Wallace shut him down by wearing him out early in the games...Also funny how you keep ignoring that Kobe was undisputedly superior by 2004...PeACe

[Bay Area Jat]

Not against the Pistons he wasn't. D-Wade and LBJ have both beaten the pistons in a playoff series. Something Kobe hasn't done

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

^Kobe had ONE series against them...Every Laker had a bad series against Detroit in that series. Kobe was STILL superior to Shaq from 2002 on...PeACe

[Don Jacob]

LOL@"dominating" the debate...He keeps mentioning how Shaq played less minutes and had less shot attempts, but the offense was running through him. Why is this? THATS RIGHT

the offense did not run through shaq, it ran through kobe, the lakers couldn't even get shaq the ball.
still the fact remains that shaq payed 3 minutes less and shot like 40 less shots and still managed to score more and be more productive than kobe lol , your'e done.

The problem with Shaq was that he was OUT OF SHAPE, he couldn't play as many minutes as Kobe. By EVERY 4th quarter, Shaq was already worn out, and couldn't even get off the ground.


Why ignore my main point?

how am i ignoring you when i posted this?

minutes per game

shaq=42.6
kobe=46.2

oh wow what a difference   your young swing man averaged 3.6 minutes more than your old center

(game 1 kobe played 2 more minutes than shaq, game two 1 more minute than shaq, and in game 4 shaq actually played more minutes than kobe)

and this

you didn't really watch that game huh? yeah sure kobe hit the three but look what shaq did when he was tired in the second half and in overtime

Shaquille O'Neal added 29 points for the Lakers[/u], six of them coming in the extra period as Los Angeles improved to 7-0 in overtime games during the regular season and postseason.

This time, things looked fairly hopeless for the Lakers as they trailed by six points with less than 40 seconds left in regulation. But O'Neal converted a three-point play and Chauncey Billups missed a runner for Detroit, giving the Lakers a last shot.



sorry buddy but kobe didn't win that game for us , he had A LOT of help from shaq

Saying no one had an answer for Shaq in thats series is pretty funny, considering the amount of analysts claiming Ben Wallace shut him down by wearing him out early in the games...Also funny how you keep ignoring that Kobe was undisputedly superior by 2004...PeACe

1.

shaq's fg% ( or how effective ben wallace was on shaq

game 1: 81.3%
game 2: 50%
game 3: 50%
game 4: 76.2%
game 5: 53.8%

 shaq:
game 1: 34 points , 11 rebounds
game 2: 29 points, 7 rebounds
game 3: 14 points, 8 rebounds
game 4: 36 points, 20 rebounds
game 5: 20 points , 8 rebounds

average:  26.6 ppg, 10.8 rpg

i don't know how that is slowing shaq down when he wasn't even averaging those numbers in the regular season, from the looks of those stats shaq was having a better game against wallace. the only thing wallace and wallace shut down were the passing lanes TO shaq.

2. if kobe was such a stud then why couldn't he carry the team to the championship? i mean shit he shot like 120 shots....it's not like he wasn't getting the ball. if kobe was so superior to shaq then he should have blossomed in that series shaq was getting no passes , so kobe could have easily taken over that series.  but fact was he got shut down hard core by the defense. shaq didn't.  larry brown knew this and this is why they won.

[Don Jacob]

^Kobe had ONE series against them...Every Laker had a bad series against Detroit in that series. Kobe was STILL superior to Shaq from 2002 on...PeACe

he had more series against the suns and he managed to do WORSE against them.

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

Again, you keep denying that the offense was running through Shaq because he was too fat to hold up for a whole game. That makes no sense. And you keep ignoring that this was not vintage Shaq, this was Shaq who put up less than 10 rebounds in 2/5 Finals games and couldn't pick up more than half a block average over the whole series...Come on now...PeACe