"King Kunta" like or dislike poll

[TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96']

I'm not discrediting him completely. He's like Phil Jackson. Jordan and Kobe never won without Phil, but Phil never won without Jordan or Kobe either. Calling Dre a great composer is like giving Phil credit for a great fade-away. You can coach the play and call it to set up a great fade away, but only a hand ful of players can consistently make the shot to win a game.

Not a bad analogy, but honestly who was the Jordan from a production standpoint in the NWA days?  Surely you don't think DJ Yella was Michael Jordan?  And over at Death Row, who was the Kobe, from a production standpoint?  Then who was the Michael Jordan at Aftermath who took Eminem from the underground sound of "Just Don't Give A Fuck" to overnight platinum superstar with "My Name Is"?

[Sccit]

i duno bout all that....the chronic is what rap evolved into. this is more like him blatantly tryna do somethin different just to be different. we had neo-soul in the early 2000s...and now the neo-funk genre is finally here.

Dre was using live bands to cover old songs and then just loop the part he liked. That akes less talent than using a turn table to find the right parts of the records at the right tempo and then loop, mix, and scratch. What Dre was doing musically was not evolution. Not that Dre was the inventor of this new style. It was simply easier to bring in musicians than it was to get the master tapes of the old songs so the tracks wouldn't contain all the other parts of the music the rap producer didn't want.

But it took away from the creativity of the hip hop DJ producer, to find the special parts of obscure records, change the tempos and tones. What Havoc did with Herbie Hancock for Shook Ones was genius. Wht Dre did with Leon Heywood for G Thang was no better than what Puff was doing in the mid 90s.

You could argue what Primo did in the 90s was the evolution of Hip Hop, but not Dre. Dre is a great producer in the sense that he knows how to string together elements and guide them for the purpose of a successful record. Premier was a great producer in the sense that he knew how to create new sounds using old sounds. Dre made hits using unknown songs to the point where the his audience never knew it wasn't original. Hip Hop at its finest is using old songs to the point where it becomes and sounds completely original.

again, i disagree.....it's harder to recreate a sound than it is to sample it. and thats from experience.

If you're talking about learning to play instruments and then replaying the music in the right key at the right temp, then yes you're right. If you just go up up to a group of serious professional musicians and play them Woman to Woman by Joe Cocker and then tell them to replay the main riff and they do it, then you're wrong.

Dre's not the one re playing the tracks.

it's much harder to compose on dre's level than U think

Produce. Not compose. Dre's not a composer. Even the original stuff was composed by Storch and/or Elizondo. Storch composed the piano on D.R.E. Dre produced it. Dre as a producer shouldn't get any more credit that a movie producer, but you guys want to give him credit like a movie director, and give him cinematography credits too.

He was once great at what he does, but it was not as hard to recreate those old songs as you think. And it was much harder and more creative to do what Havoc did. I'll give Dre his due for getting to the position he's in, but to say wow what a skill set and what a genius is like saying wow Shaq is such a skilled baller when in reality if you take away 5 inches and 50 pounds he may not even make it into the league. Lock Dre in a room by himself with instruments, records, and turntables and he will come out with nothing. As opposed to someone like Quincy Jones who would walk out with a full album of quality.

dre is a composer...to compose is to "write or create a work of art" and thats exactly what dre does. people bring pieces to dre and he puts them all together and creates an incredible composition out of it. what he does is ingenious and unmatched by any other producer in hip-hop history. he's lightyears above your average producer who gets behind a drum machine and comes up with a quick beat that sounds dope. he is the director, bottom line...and what ur saying about locking dre in a room is borderline retarded. lock stanley kubrick in a room with a camera, a movie set, and some film and he will come out with nothing.....but with the proper pieces, he will come out with some greatness ala dr. mufuckin dre.

[Sccit]

Produce. Not compose. Dre's not a composer. Even the original stuff was composed by Storch and/or Elizondo. Storch composed the piano on D.R.E. Dre produced it. Dre as a producer shouldn't get any more credit that a movie producer, but you guys want to give him credit like a movie director, and give him cinematography credits too.

He was once great at what he does, but it was not as hard to recreate those old songs as you think. And it was much harder and more creative to do what Havoc did. I'll give Dre his due for getting to the position he's in, but to say wow what a skill set and what a genius is like saying wow Shaq is such a skilled baller when in reality if you take away 5 inches and 50 pounds he may not even make it into the league. Lock Dre in a room by himself with instruments, records, and turntables and he will come out with nothing. As opposed to someone like Quincy Jones who would walk out with a full album of quality.

I've been trying to learn more about the actual music making process in regards to the producing side of things, and I never have really been able to find much information.

But that said, there is one argument that always seems to hold true in Dre's favor.  Like when those Death Row disses first started to come out and Daz was claiming credit and all these other "ghost producers" at the Row, Dre used to reply smugly that, "If they are supposedly the ones who were really doing it, then let's see them do it without me".   And still, nobody has ever been able to sound as dope without Dre around.

For whatever reason, from the days of Wrecking Cru up until today, if Dre is there shit always comes out hotter.  So obviously, there is something that he does better than anyone else in the room, and without him it can't be done.

because dre is dre....what he does is beyond comprehension. people like shallow hear shit like "oh, dre doesnt even come up with the beats", and in their simple mind, they see that as a lack of talent. when in reality, coming up with the beat is the simple part. bringing that beat to life and squeezin it for every last drop of potential is actually the taxing part....and no one else can do it like dre. bottom line. 

[Triple OG Rapsodie]

Its not one of my favorites

[Shallow]

I'm not discrediting him completely. He's like Phil Jackson. Jordan and Kobe never won without Phil, but Phil never won without Jordan or Kobe either. Calling Dre a great composer is like giving Phil credit for a great fade-away. You can coach the play and call it to set up a great fade away, but only a hand ful of players can consistently make the shot to win a game.

Not a bad analogy, but honestly who was the Jordan from a production standpoint in the NWA days?  Surely you don't think DJ Yella was Michael Jordan?  And over at Death Row, who was the Kobe, from a production standpoint?  Then who was the Michael Jordan at Aftermath who took Eminem from the underground sound of "Just Don't Give A Fuck" to overnight platinum superstar with "My Name Is"?

Jordan was Snoop and Kobe was Eminem. I didn't imply the producer is the basketball player, thats the rapper. The producer is the producer, and that's Dre. In all I was slightly off because Dre is a lot like a Movie Director, the ones that don't write the script or set up the shots, but rather the ones that adjust the words and choose the right shots.

I give Dre a lot of credit, like I do Phil Jackson. The problem is that he gets Bill Russell like credit when he shouldn't.

[Shallow]

Stanley Kubrick in his prime was charge of every aspect of his films. He wrote the words, set up the shots, edited the film. To say he wouldn't come out of a locked room with genius is absurd. He has all the skills to create a film from scratch and the mind to think of something genius, even in an empty room.

Dre doesn't have the musical talent to write notes or play those notes at a high level. I'm sorry you don't want to admit that.

And we're talking music so I'm using the musical definition of compose not the webster definition. I know what compose can also mean in other walks of life, but it doesn't apply to music. When a producer takes an entire arrangement as its recorded and gets a studio band to cover it, I don't give him credit. Just like I don't give credit to Kanye when he takes full recorded melodies and loops them.

Taking a small riff here, and mixing it with another melody from somehwhere, or creating a harmony from two different peices is fantastic and worth the label composer. But what Dre did for the beat of Cali Love or G Thang is nothing special.

[westside159]

To Pimp A Butterfly is a good album .  BEST SONGS

1. YOU AINT GOTTA LIE
2. KING KUNTA
3. HOOD POLITICS
4. HOW MUCH A DOLLAR COST
5. COMPLEXION

[westside159]

King Kunta has a dj type of beat and production to it . I think the beat is dope and the song is dope . King Kunta was a old slave and it's a creative concept song with a funky beat . 

[Hack Wilson - real]

King Kunta has a dj type of beat and production to it . I think the beat is dope and the song is dope . King Kunta was a old slave and it's a creative concept song with a funky beat . 

no.  Kunta Kinte was an old slave.  Get his name right.

[HighEyeCue]

To Pimp A Butterfly is a good album .  BEST SONGS

1. YOU AINT GOTTA LIE
2. KING KUNTA
3. HOOD POLITICS
4. HOW MUCH A DOLLAR COST
5. COMPLEXION

I agree...dope track and dope album

much too early to call it classic or anything though

[Sccit]

Stanley Kubrick in his prime was charge of every aspect of his films. He wrote the words, set up the shots, edited the film. To say he wouldn't come out of a locked room with genius is absurd. He has all the skills to create a film from scratch and the mind to think of something genius, even in an empty room.

Dre doesn't have the musical talent to write notes or play those notes at a high level. I'm sorry you don't want to admit that.

And we're talking music so I'm using the musical definition of compose not the webster definition. I know what compose can also mean in other walks of life, but it doesn't apply to music. When a producer takes an entire arrangement as its recorded and gets a studio band to cover it, I don't give him credit. Just like I don't give credit to Kanye when he takes full recorded melodies and loops them.

Taking a small riff here, and mixing it with another melody from somehwhere, or creating a harmony from two different peices is fantastic and worth the label composer. But what Dre did for the beat of Cali Love or G Thang is nothing special.

he has the ear, which is the most important aspect...youre completely downplaying dre's genius, but thats okay. you're not alone.

[TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96']

he is the director, bottom line...and what ur saying about locking dre in a room is borderline retarded. lock stanley kubrick in a room with a camera, a movie set, and some film and he will come out with nothing.....

Shit... human beings can't even make a pencil by themselves in a room.  But that's another discussion...

...Anyway, you guys are saying Dre just takes bits and pieces from other people and composes but he is also telling others what sound to make and gets exactly what he wants either by doing it himself or having someone else do it.  Without knowing the technical aspect of producing I can just use some of Dre's quotes as evidence... Dre said in one interview the difference between him and other producers is that sound that is in his head, he can get that on record.  While other producers can't get the sound they really want so they settle for what they can get.

[TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96']

Jordan was Snoop and Kobe was Eminem. I didn't imply the producer is the basketball player, thats the rapper. The producer is the producer, and that's Dre. In all I was slightly off because Dre is a lot like a Movie Director, the ones that don't write the script or set up the shots, but rather the ones that adjust the words and choose the right shots.

I give Dre a lot of credit, like I do Phil Jackson. The problem is that he gets Bill Russell like credit when he shouldn't.

I don't know how other people feel but I think even working without Snoop (Jordan) and Eminem (Kobe) that Dre's shit is way more bomb than any other producer.  In fact, his own solo joints are more bomb than any other producer.  "Keep They Heads Wringing" and "Let Me Ride" must be like Phil is coaching and dunking on fools.

[Sccit]

Jordan was Snoop and Kobe was Eminem. I didn't imply the producer is the basketball player, thats the rapper. The producer is the producer, and that's Dre. In all I was slightly off because Dre is a lot like a Movie Director, the ones that don't write the script or set up the shots, but rather the ones that adjust the words and choose the right shots.

I give Dre a lot of credit, like I do Phil Jackson. The problem is that he gets Bill Russell like credit when he shouldn't.

I don't know how other people feel but I think even working without Snoop (Jordan) and Eminem (Kobe) that Dre's shit is way more bomb than any other producer.  In fact, his own solo joints are more bomb than any other producer.  "Keep They Heads Wringing" and "Let Me Ride" must be like Phil is coaching and dunking on fools.

THE MAIN SIMILARITY BETWEEN PHIL JACKSON AND DR. DRE IS THAT THEY'RE BOTH GENIUSES

[M Dogg™]

Produce. Not compose. Dre's not a composer. Even the original stuff was composed by Storch and/or Elizondo. Storch composed the piano on D.R.E. Dre produced it. Dre as a producer shouldn't get any more credit that a movie producer, but you guys want to give him credit like a movie director, and give him cinematography credits too.

He was once great at what he does, but it was not as hard to recreate those old songs as you think. And it was much harder and more creative to do what Havoc did. I'll give Dre his due for getting to the position he's in, but to say wow what a skill set and what a genius is like saying wow Shaq is such a skilled baller when in reality if you take away 5 inches and 50 pounds he may not even make it into the league. Lock Dre in a room by himself with instruments, records, and turntables and he will come out with nothing. As opposed to someone like Quincy Jones who would walk out with a full album of quality.

I've been trying to learn more about the actual music making process in regards to the producing side of things, and I never have really been able to find much information.

But that said, there is one argument that always seems to hold true in Dre's favor.  Like when those Death Row disses first started to come out and Daz was claiming credit and all these other "ghost producers" at the Row, Dre used to reply smugly that, "If they are supposedly the ones who were really doing it, then let's see them do it without me".   And still, nobody has ever been able to sound as dope without Dre around.

For whatever reason, from the days of Wrecking Cru up until today, if Dre is there shit always comes out hotter.  So obviously, there is something that he does better than anyone else in the room, and without him it can't be done.

I'm not discrediting him completely. He's like Phil Jackson. Jordan and Kobe never won without Phil, but Phil never won without Jordan or Kobe either. Calling Dre a great composer is like giving Phil credit for a great fade-away. You can coach the play and call it to set up a great fade away, but only a hand ful of players can consistently make the shot to win a game.

Your problem with this is Dre was winning 'chips with Eazy E and 50 Cent on the mic. Dr. Dre is as talented a producer as there is. All these people claiming, I found this sample for Dre, I played this string for Dre, ain't none of them make a beat like Dre. Some of the most celebrated people in music are the conductors, and conductors don't play the music, they can play the music, but they don't play the music on shows. Dre does play live drums, and he had live drums in his production since NWA. He tells the musicians he works with the sound he wants when he's making the beat, and they play it for him. If you are trying to give credit to everyone else for Dr. Dre's success, then why ain't Scott Storch, Daz, DJ Yella, and Mel Man have more hits and great beats compared to Dr. Dre. For all we know, Dr. Dre may only be a great mixer, but that mixing is what makes the songs song better than anyone else out there. So you can try to talk about Dre all you want, the dude has the best ear for music in hip-hop, and will go down as the number 1 producer in hip-hop history.