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Quote from: 7even the Harbinger on August 06, 2004, 03:54:21 AMQuote from: I TO DA GEEZY on August 06, 2004, 12:15:06 AMIt's interesting that a person's motive for believing in God could be used to negate his(God's) exitance, like saying " If someone's life is shitty he's gonna believe in god for the sake of hope, to endure the hard times, meaning that God is actually an illusion, Opium for the people if you will, a Psychological protection mechanism, distortion of reallity"----->How would u explain rich and sucsessfull people who believe in God than?!---> easilly, the more you have to loose the more apprehensive you are as for loosing it, a stressfull situation, a frustration equivalent to that of a poor person, and again the person is searching for a refuge, and finds GOD."A discussion concerning the psychological motives that bring a person to believe in some fictional saviour is off-throwing and is a playground for speculation since it's about the person's subjective preception of GOD. The questions you need to ask in order to try and comprehand GOD are diffrend, What triggered the begining( Not what was in the begning), What started it? How do you define GOD?Is GOD a parallel for love or hope in your mind? - If so, you're getting into your subjective reallity conditioned viewes again. Can something emerge out of nothing? phisiclly NO, than how do you explain the start of every metter in the universe? What is perfect emptyness? what was there before there was anything? In a Random combination of possible consequenses how come a creature that can ask itself these questions was produced?1. if nothing can emerge out of nothing, how can there be a God in the first place?2. from your last lines, I regard that you think humans are way too great to just be there without being created by a higher being. I have to say youre dead wrong. Human arent all that. Definitely not. We were just blessed by evolution, so that we became the smartest folks on earth, but that is where it stops.3. so if God created everything, and humans have a soul and shit, how do you define humans? let's say humans are evolutionized apes. so, during the process from apes to human, when was it actually homo sapiens and when was it still a dumb creature? when did the soul fly into the being!? also, how come so much time elapsed until these cool humans emerged. I mean, Dinosaurs were here WAY longer than we, and we will destroy ourselves WAY faster than the Dinosaurs were wiped out. Hm, OR, Do Dinosaurs have had souls too? Are Dinosaurs in heaven too? 1.Here's the thing, nothing can emerge out of emptyness, that's what physics preaches, it's true as far as every possible metter in the universe goes, if you take GOD as metter or as a physical object than your question is adequate, However I don't, I have no idea how to define it in earthly\human terminology, I don't think anyone can, may be you can, that's why acording to you God couldn't have just existed--> something needed to create him too as far as human logic goes, right?---Well, before there was anything, before there was even "time" do you think such definitions as "before" and "after" existed?!....in an emptyness, with no time, no metter, no space as well, complete un-comprehandable nothingness....2.Oh no, I don't see humans as so Great that they just had to be created by a higher being but only as a creature which could be self concious enough to question it's own creation and evolvement, questions through which it could come to a conclusion it can't comprehand the creation to it's fullest and still be aware of it, it's a paradox if you haven't realised by now---Knowing all the basic rules up on which the universe opperates and to be unable to explain it's start, since it's start defies it's own rules, all we know is this, mathmaticlly as far as probabillity goes, The conditions on planet earth are among the most unlikely and coincidencial in the universe and than billions of years later by that same coincidence a creature evolves to a point it could question it's own existance....doesn't it seem like some kind of a pattern?3.Here you go talking about souls and stuff, If you've noticed I haven't said a word about souls, I haven't said a thing about the bible's interpretation of history, mainly because it's very perplexing and complex.
Quote from: I TO DA GEEZY on August 06, 2004, 12:15:06 AMIt's interesting that a person's motive for believing in God could be used to negate his(God's) exitance, like saying " If someone's life is shitty he's gonna believe in god for the sake of hope, to endure the hard times, meaning that God is actually an illusion, Opium for the people if you will, a Psychological protection mechanism, distortion of reallity"----->How would u explain rich and sucsessfull people who believe in God than?!---> easilly, the more you have to loose the more apprehensive you are as for loosing it, a stressfull situation, a frustration equivalent to that of a poor person, and again the person is searching for a refuge, and finds GOD."A discussion concerning the psychological motives that bring a person to believe in some fictional saviour is off-throwing and is a playground for speculation since it's about the person's subjective preception of GOD. The questions you need to ask in order to try and comprehand GOD are diffrend, What triggered the begining( Not what was in the begning), What started it? How do you define GOD?Is GOD a parallel for love or hope in your mind? - If so, you're getting into your subjective reallity conditioned viewes again. Can something emerge out of nothing? phisiclly NO, than how do you explain the start of every metter in the universe? What is perfect emptyness? what was there before there was anything? In a Random combination of possible consequenses how come a creature that can ask itself these questions was produced?1. if nothing can emerge out of nothing, how can there be a God in the first place?2. from your last lines, I regard that you think humans are way too great to just be there without being created by a higher being. I have to say youre dead wrong. Human arent all that. Definitely not. We were just blessed by evolution, so that we became the smartest folks on earth, but that is where it stops.3. so if God created everything, and humans have a soul and shit, how do you define humans? let's say humans are evolutionized apes. so, during the process from apes to human, when was it actually homo sapiens and when was it still a dumb creature? when did the soul fly into the being!? also, how come so much time elapsed until these cool humans emerged. I mean, Dinosaurs were here WAY longer than we, and we will destroy ourselves WAY faster than the Dinosaurs were wiped out. Hm, OR, Do Dinosaurs have had souls too? Are Dinosaurs in heaven too?
It's interesting that a person's motive for believing in God could be used to negate his(God's) exitance, like saying " If someone's life is shitty he's gonna believe in god for the sake of hope, to endure the hard times, meaning that God is actually an illusion, Opium for the people if you will, a Psychological protection mechanism, distortion of reallity"----->How would u explain rich and sucsessfull people who believe in God than?!---> easilly, the more you have to loose the more apprehensive you are as for loosing it, a stressfull situation, a frustration equivalent to that of a poor person, and again the person is searching for a refuge, and finds GOD."A discussion concerning the psychological motives that bring a person to believe in some fictional saviour is off-throwing and is a playground for speculation since it's about the person's subjective preception of GOD. The questions you need to ask in order to try and comprehand GOD are diffrend, What triggered the begining( Not what was in the begning), What started it? How do you define GOD?Is GOD a parallel for love or hope in your mind? - If so, you're getting into your subjective reallity conditioned viewes again. Can something emerge out of nothing? phisiclly NO, than how do you explain the start of every metter in the universe? What is perfect emptyness? what was there before there was anything? In a Random combination of possible consequenses how come a creature that can ask itself these questions was produced?
Quote from: SMiLE on August 06, 2004, 09:21:13 AMQuote from: Sikotic aka Birdman on August 05, 2004, 08:37:39 PMWhy would anyone NOT think God exsists?In my opinion, many times (not all) it comes down to two things.1. They've had lonely depressing horrible childhoods2. Their parents didn't believe and taught them it was 'intelligent' not to believe in stories a.k.a. religion2. They don't want to believe that they're not in control of thingsdisgusting.
Quote from: Sikotic aka Birdman on August 05, 2004, 08:37:39 PMWhy would anyone NOT think God exsists?In my opinion, many times (not all) it comes down to two things.1. They've had lonely depressing horrible childhoods2. Their parents didn't believe and taught them it was 'intelligent' not to believe in stories a.k.a. religion2. They don't want to believe that they're not in control of things
Why would anyone NOT think God exsists?
Quote from: Sikotic aka Birdman on August 05, 2004, 08:37:39 PMWhy would anyone NOT think God exsists?That's easy to answer.If one is not raised with religion, (in most cases) this person doesn't believe. It's that simple.I'm not raised with religion, so I look at religion more down to earth than anyone who actually is raised with religion. If you are raised by Musims you are very likely to become (be) a Muslim and if you are raised by Christians you are very likely to become (be) Christian. In other words: it's all indoctrination
If all flying creatures would have been created by God...why not give them all the same equipment?
Quote from: I TO DA GEEZY on August 06, 2004, 06:49:59 AMQuote from: 7even the Harbinger on August 06, 2004, 03:54:21 AMQuote from: I TO DA GEEZY on August 06, 2004, 12:15:06 AMIt's interesting that a person's motive for believing in God could be used to negate his(God's) exitance, like saying " If someone's life is shitty he's gonna believe in god for the sake of hope, to endure the hard times, meaning that God is actually an illusion, Opium for the people if you will, a Psychological protection mechanism, distortion of reallity"----->How would u explain rich and sucsessfull people who believe in God than?!---> easilly, the more you have to loose the more apprehensive you are as for loosing it, a stressfull situation, a frustration equivalent to that of a poor person, and again the person is searching for a refuge, and finds GOD."A discussion concerning the psychological motives that bring a person to believe in some fictional saviour is off-throwing and is a playground for speculation since it's about the person's subjective preception of GOD. The questions you need to ask in order to try and comprehand GOD are diffrend, What triggered the begining( Not what was in the begning), What started it? How do you define GOD?Is GOD a parallel for love or hope in your mind? - If so, you're getting into your subjective reallity conditioned viewes again. Can something emerge out of nothing? phisiclly NO, than how do you explain the start of every metter in the universe? What is perfect emptyness? what was there before there was anything? In a Random combination of possible consequenses how come a creature that can ask itself these questions was produced?1. if nothing can emerge out of nothing, how can there be a God in the first place?2. from your last lines, I regard that you think humans are way too great to just be there without being created by a higher being. I have to say youre dead wrong. Human arent all that. Definitely not. We were just blessed by evolution, so that we became the smartest folks on earth, but that is where it stops.3. so if God created everything, and humans have a soul and shit, how do you define humans? let's say humans are evolutionized apes. so, during the process from apes to human, when was it actually homo sapiens and when was it still a dumb creature? when did the soul fly into the being!? also, how come so much time elapsed until these cool humans emerged. I mean, Dinosaurs were here WAY longer than we, and we will destroy ourselves WAY faster than the Dinosaurs were wiped out. Hm, OR, Do Dinosaurs have had souls too? Are Dinosaurs in heaven too? 1.Here's the thing, nothing can emerge out of emptyness, that's what physics preaches, it's true as far as every possible metter in the universe goes, if you take GOD as metter or as a physical object than your question is adequate, However I don't, I have no idea how to define it in earthly\human terminology, I don't think anyone can, may be you can, that's why acording to you God couldn't have just existed--> something needed to create him too as far as human logic goes, right?---Well, before there was anything, before there was even "time" do you think such definitions as "before" and "after" existed?!....in an emptyness, with no time, no metter, no space as well, complete un-comprehandable nothingness....2.Oh no, I don't see humans as so Great that they just had to be created by a higher being but only as a creature which could be self concious enough to question it's own creation and evolvement, questions through which it could come to a conclusion it can't comprehand the creation to it's fullest and still be aware of it, it's a paradox if you haven't realised by now---Knowing all the basic rules up on which the universe opperates and to be unable to explain it's start, since it's start defies it's own rules, all we know is this, mathmaticlly as far as probabillity goes, The conditions on planet earth are among the most unlikely and coincidencial in the universe and than billions of years later by that same coincidence a creature evolves to a point it could question it's own existance....doesn't it seem like some kind of a pattern?3.Here you go talking about souls and stuff, If you've noticed I haven't said a word about souls, I haven't said a thing about the bible's interpretation of history, mainly because it's very perplexing and complex.Your theories remind me of the ones of Thomas Aquin from ~1500 ... and I thought that was out-dated. It's nothing shorter of a coincidence than your birth. I mean, your father has millions of sperm-thingys and the exact one did it make trough at the exact time, and this before when your parents were born, and before when their parents were born. No imagine that - and most amazing, it happens a million times a day!
Helicoptors and planes indeed have different designs,but they fly in different ways don't they? This means they aren't doing the same thing and is a reason for their change in structure.
Quote from: 7even the Harbinger on August 06, 2004, 10:46:04 AMQuote from: I TO DA GEEZY on August 06, 2004, 06:49:59 AMQuote from: 7even the Harbinger on August 06, 2004, 03:54:21 AMQuote from: I TO DA GEEZY on August 06, 2004, 12:15:06 AMIt's interesting that a person's motive for believing in God could be used to negate his(God's) exitance, like saying " If someone's life is shitty he's gonna believe in god for the sake of hope, to endure the hard times, meaning that God is actually an illusion, Opium for the people if you will, a Psychological protection mechanism, distortion of reallity"----->How would u explain rich and sucsessfull people who believe in God than?!---> easilly, the more you have to loose the more apprehensive you are as for loosing it, a stressfull situation, a frustration equivalent to that of a poor person, and again the person is searching for a refuge, and finds GOD."A discussion concerning the psychological motives that bring a person to believe in some fictional saviour is off-throwing and is a playground for speculation since it's about the person's subjective preception of GOD. The questions you need to ask in order to try and comprehand GOD are diffrend, What triggered the begining( Not what was in the begning), What started it? How do you define GOD?Is GOD a parallel for love or hope in your mind? - If so, you're getting into your subjective reallity conditioned viewes again. Can something emerge out of nothing? phisiclly NO, than how do you explain the start of every metter in the universe? What is perfect emptyness? what was there before there was anything? In a Random combination of possible consequenses how come a creature that can ask itself these questions was produced?1. if nothing can emerge out of nothing, how can there be a God in the first place?2. from your last lines, I regard that you think humans are way too great to just be there without being created by a higher being. I have to say youre dead wrong. Human arent all that. Definitely not. We were just blessed by evolution, so that we became the smartest folks on earth, but that is where it stops.3. so if God created everything, and humans have a soul and shit, how do you define humans? let's say humans are evolutionized apes. so, during the process from apes to human, when was it actually homo sapiens and when was it still a dumb creature? when did the soul fly into the being!? also, how come so much time elapsed until these cool humans emerged. I mean, Dinosaurs were here WAY longer than we, and we will destroy ourselves WAY faster than the Dinosaurs were wiped out. Hm, OR, Do Dinosaurs have had souls too? Are Dinosaurs in heaven too? 1.Here's the thing, nothing can emerge out of emptyness, that's what physics preaches, it's true as far as every possible metter in the universe goes, if you take GOD as metter or as a physical object than your question is adequate, However I don't, I have no idea how to define it in earthly\human terminology, I don't think anyone can, may be you can, that's why acording to you God couldn't have just existed--> something needed to create him too as far as human logic goes, right?---Well, before there was anything, before there was even "time" do you think such definitions as "before" and "after" existed?!....in an emptyness, with no time, no metter, no space as well, complete un-comprehandable nothingness....2.Oh no, I don't see humans as so Great that they just had to be created by a higher being but only as a creature which could be self concious enough to question it's own creation and evolvement, questions through which it could come to a conclusion it can't comprehand the creation to it's fullest and still be aware of it, it's a paradox if you haven't realised by now---Knowing all the basic rules up on which the universe opperates and to be unable to explain it's start, since it's start defies it's own rules, all we know is this, mathmaticlly as far as probabillity goes, The conditions on planet earth are among the most unlikely and coincidencial in the universe and than billions of years later by that same coincidence a creature evolves to a point it could question it's own existance....doesn't it seem like some kind of a pattern?3.Here you go talking about souls and stuff, If you've noticed I haven't said a word about souls, I haven't said a thing about the bible's interpretation of history, mainly because it's very perplexing and complex.Your theories remind me of the ones of Thomas Aquin from ~1500 ... and I thought that was out-dated. It's nothing shorter of a coincidence than your birth. I mean, your father has millions of sperm-thingys and the exact one did it make trough at the exact time, and this before when your parents were born, and before when their parents were born. No imagine that - and most amazing, it happens a million times a day! Let's assume The Creation of the universe and the evolvement of it into it's current state is by Coincidence, Let's assume that the creation of Earth was merely by Coincidence as well, Let's also assume Earth's perfect equilibrium within it's environment in space is also by Coincidence, it's distance from the Sun is too, as far as we're concerned. The fact water is in it's most unlikely condition in the universe here on earth is by Coincidence, because you know that universally the most common condition for water is "frozen", and all these Coincidences lead to the creation of life on earth which also makes the creation of life to be by Coincidence,every evolvement and every birth of every human being is of course also by Coincidence and so is every thing ever created, any existing metter reflect's Coincidence through it, in fact Im starting to wonder what is not by Coincidence acording to you, can we render a person deciding to undergo plastic surgery as a coincidence too?- No?! because there's that whole thing with decision, with "Choice", when you decide to do something and then do it, it's no longer rendered as "by coincidence", right?.....but wait, The creation of this person was by Coincidence meaning that whatever he does is by Coincidence too right?....How is it possible that in a never ending sequence of coincidences suddenly comes a moment when it's no longer by Coincidence?--- The Key to answering this question is "choice"....And was there choice before there were humans?!....p.s"God gave us choice."oh one more thing, In this post When you see the term "Coincidence" you should just replace it with "God" or "creator"....Believing in coincidence can also be defined as a religion, it's just like believing in GOD, This way you just don't need to explore The Creator's essence, it's very convenient because you will be able to sleep at night.