West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => West Coast Connection => Topic started by: Duck Duck Doggy on May 02, 2025, 10:55:41 AM
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I feel like the music he’s released since Relapse has only hurt his legacy. Imagine if he just disappeared into the mountains like he says on ‘Business’. We would all be saying why isn’t he releasing new music!!! But we live in the alternate universe where he continues to release music that just never lives up. At this point I don’t think we’re ever getting a classic Em album again. :-\ :'( :grumpy:
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I feel like the music he’s released since Relapse has only hurt his legacy. Imagine if he just disappeared into the mountains like he says on ‘Business’. We would all be saying why isn’t he releasing new music!!! But we live in the alternate universe where he continues to release music that just never lives up. At this point I don’t think we’re ever getting a classic Em album again. :-\ :'( :grumpy:
Really if he wanted to go out like Pac he would’ve stopped after the 8 Mile soundtrack because “Lose Yourself” is his magnum opus.
That said, I don’t think you realize how popular Eminem is with the kids these days. They are idiots and think the best rapper is the one who raps the fastest—so I have several students even all the way here in the Arab Gulf that worship Eminem and spend like a whole week just trying to memorize one of his songs where he “raps fast” and then mastering it and showing it off at school.
So actually his legend has grown way bigger. The young kids love his post 8 Mile and post Relapse stuff more because he “raps fast” lol
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Most young Eminem fans don’t know the songs with Dre and D12.
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I feel like the music he’s released since Relapse has only hurt his legacy. Imagine if he just disappeared into the mountains like he says on ‘Business’. We would all be saying why isn’t he releasing new music!!! But we live in the alternate universe where he continues to release music that just never lives up. At this point I don’t think we’re ever getting a classic Em album again. :-\ :'( :grumpy:
if he stopped after Eminem Show, could argue, would be more respected...
i personally thing it's amazing what he did from Kamikaze on... incredible run for an artist that's been at it that long.
that shady xv era was awful stretch - 2014-17
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Relapse had great production but Em ruined it on a lot of tracks with that accent he was doing
I liked MMLP2 and Kamikaze the best out of the rest
So I would say he’s been hit and miss since Relapse
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I feel like the music he’s released since Relapse has only hurt his legacy. Imagine if he just disappeared into the mountains like he says on ‘Business’. We would all be saying why isn’t he releasing new music!!! But we live in the alternate universe where he continues to release music that just never lives up. At this point I don’t think we’re ever getting a classic Em album again. :-\ :'( :grumpy:
i don't agree with you bro. Relapse is the most outdated Eminem album for year it was released, people felt like Eminem is repeating himself and can't keep up with current music. dre as well.
i hated Recovery when it came out. But today i give it's props. Eminem broke his beak like an old eagle, reborn and became someone stronger with releasing relapse.
Recovery, Marshall Mathers LP 2 and Music To Be Murdered By are considered classics already. These albums are way better and succesful than Encore and Relapse.
If only producer Eminem could work with would be Dr. Dre, yeah than Relapse should be his last album so he won't humilate himself one more time. But he saw current music is evolving, new generation's point of view is changing, there are new young producers, new technics and new visions. So he quit working with his old producers and started to work with new generation producers. thats who eminem survived.
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Recovery, Marshall Mathers LP 2 and Music To Be Murdered By are considered classics already. These albums are way better and succesful than Encore and Relapse.
classic?!
recovery was weak .. mmlp2 was dope but far from classic .. music to be murdered by was solid.
relapse is considered a cult classic nowadays .. it's the last album where eminem was actually being himself .. and the production was top notch.
encore had some duds.. but overall, there was still some classic em shit on there that stand the test of time.
yea, he went crazy wit the accents on relapse, but it's a concept album ......
after relapse he just transformed himself into someone totally different.
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classic?!
recovery was weak .. mmlp2 was dope but far from classic .. music to be murdered by was solid.
relapse is considered a cult classic nowadays .. it's the last album where eminem was actually being himself .. and the production was top notch.
encore had some duds.. but overall, there was still some classic em shit on there that stand the test of time.
yea, he went crazy wit the accents on relapse, but it's a concept album ......
after relapse he just transformed himself into someone totally different.
He had to transform himself to keep up with current music point of view and he had to do it to be relevant.
production was overdated on relapse. nobody gave a fuck about that type of music anymore those days.
relapse is not considered as a classic, but recovery is considered as classic already which is totally not my favorite eminem album but i understand the meaning and importance of recovery.
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He had to transform himself to keep up with current music point of view and he had to do it to be relevant.
production was overdated on relapse. nobody gave a fuck about that type of music anymore those days.
relapse is not considered as a classic, but recovery is considered as classic already which is totally not my favorite eminem album but i understand the meaning and importance of recovery.
lmaoooo i love how u just make definitive statements as if you're the authority on hip-hop
:dead:
never change homie
Relapse has been the subject of re-evaluation from both fans and critics over the years. This has resulted in the album developing a strong cult following, while also being viewed more positively as occupying a unique position within Eminem's wider discography.
Relapse gained a strong cult following and it is considered by many as one of Eminem's classic albums. Mark Batson, one of the co-producers with Dr. Dre, said: "When we made Relapse with Eminem, it was not well received at the moment but now it is considered to be a classic. That's how it goes." Eminem's long-time manager Paul Rosenberg singled out "Underground" as one of his favorite songs.
Rolling Stone magazine's Rob Sheffield called the album a "more painful, honest and vital record" that is on-par or better than Eminem's 2002 album The Eminem Show.[4] Stephen Thomas Erlewine of Allmusic described the album as "musically white-hot, dense, and dramatic" and said that "his flow is so good, his wordplay so sharp, it seems churlish to wish that he addressed something other than his long-standing obsessions and demons". The Daily Telegraph commended its honest depiction of Eminem's drug addiction and overuse. Although he found its concept "spotty", Vibe's Benjamin Meadows-Ingram praised Eminem's lyricism, writing that "Em works wonders with words, expanding the boundaries of the art of rap itself [...] the composition is experimental and abstract, a master toying with form". At the 52nd Grammy Awards, the album won a Grammy Award for Best Rap Album.
Mitch Findlay from HotNewHipHop touted Relapse as Eminem's strongest project after The Eminem Show: "Relapse is probably the strongest of Eminem's post-comeback catalog, largely in part to some excellent production from Dr. Dre, Dawaun Parker, and Mike Elizondo. Plus, Em seems to be in the zone here, especially when it comes to his flow. The concept, in which he embodies a depraved, accented serial killer, can be a little tiresome, but it also leads to a gratuitous bout of lyrical and hilarious Grand-Guignol." He singled out "Hello", "Beautiful" and "Deja Vu" as highlights.[100][101] In 2019, Findlay included "Same Song & Dance" and "Music Box" on his "Dr. Dre's Top 10 Most Haunting Beats".[102] Complex magazine's "The 100 Best Eminem Songs" ranks "Stay Wide Awake" at number 86, "Elevator" at number 81, "My Darling" at number 79, "Underground" at number 74, "3 a.m." at number 67, "Insane" at number 27, and "Déjà Vu" at number 20.
Drew Landry from DJBooth called Relapse a "dark, disturbing and often hilarious album" and said: "Relapse sounds like a "how many violent dick jokes can I shout before someone tries to decapitate me" science experiment. If you simply sit back and embrace the depravity, though, it's oddly glorious. Eminem wasn't trying to make radio hits nor was he trying to inspire fans; he just wanted to gross us all out. And in that regard, holy shit does he succeed." He singled out "Insane", "Stay Wide Awake", "Same Song & Dance", "Medicine Ball" and "3 a.m." as the five most disgusting songs on the album and referred to the album as "an episode of South Park written by Stephen King".
Patrick Bierut from UDiscoverMusic named Relapse "the true marvel Of Eminem's sinister return to hip-hop" and said "Relapse remains one of the most overlooked releases not only of Eminem's career, but the mid-to-late 00s. Not only is it the Eminem album in which Dr. Dre had the truest hand in production, it's also the most remarkable demonstration of his raw ability to rap better than almost anyone else. Due to its divisive content, however, Relapse doesn't get enough credit for being the marvel it truly is."[105]
Spin also included some songs of the album on the top 100 of All 289 Eminem Songs, Ranked article, included "Déjà Vu" at 36 position, "Crack a Bottle" at number 48, "Beautiful" at number 62, "3 a.m." at number 68, "Elevator" at number 76, "Stay Wide Awake" at number 79 and "Underground" at number 82.[106] HipHopDX called Relapse a "horrorcore masterpiece" and said: "the record stands as an artistic achievement that further solidifies Eminem as one of the greatest, most creative MCs to ever pick up a microphone. The article goes on to reflect the changing fan sentiment toward the album, stating that it took "years to uncover its brilliance".[2]
homie... instead of making general statements that don't line up with reality, u can just say that YOU didn't like relapse. record shows that hardcore eminem fans love the album. on the contrary, they consider recovery a sappy pile of shit and a try hard effort to go pop by eminem. i don't know any real hip-hop head who values that album. it's mostly the same crowd that likes taylor swift and rihanna that was digging recovery. was it successful as a pop album? absolutely.. but not revered by the heads. like u said, he felt the need to re-invent himself and came with a contrived effort that was not true to his authentic self, and that's what he's been doing ever since.
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Relapse was the last Eminem album I realy listened 2, only that “forever” song was weak. All the albums after relapse where boring.
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“Forever” was not on the OG release…it was added on “Relapse: Refill”
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Recovery with not afraid and that ri-ri song is outta here. Me personaly likes older stuff, but my kids loves this new one. Hudini, godzilla and so.
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I just went back and listened to Relapse last night...now that it is fresh on my mind here are a few thoughts
better than I remembered it...that track Beautiful is really that, one of the best Em songs in the last 20 years...I looked at the credits and looks like it was maybe recorded during the Encore sessions before he went to rehab...the accents are a little too much at times but Em was really spitting, better than he has any time since...and the production is crazy, a lot of it sounds like it could have been meant for Detox
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He had to transform himself to keep up with current music point of view and he had to do it to be relevant.
production was overdated on relapse. nobody gave a fuck about that type of music anymore those days.
relapse is not considered as a classic, but recovery is considered as classic already which is totally not my favorite eminem album but i understand the meaning and importance of recovery.
Jesus Christ you got EVERYTHING wrong lmao
When Relapse came out people were praising the shit put of it's production, it was the content and accents that bothred people so much. These days Relapse is considered a cult classic, that's a fact. Just check out Em's forums.
Recovery was hot when it came out, and it was indeed a modern new sound that people fucked with back in 2010. But it's fresh status only lasted for like 3 years, and since 2013 that shit been aging worse than a milk on a hot summer day. That Recovery sound became history. Why do you think everybody was making fun of Em for working with Alex Da Kid and using Recovery style in 2013/2017 and begged him to go back working with Dre? And why MTBMB was considered an improvement over Revival? Why do you think Em uses leftovers from Relapse on his newer albums, and not from Recovery?
It's kinda ironic how Relapse was considered outdated when it was released but ended aging better tham Recovery, which sounded more fresh at first.
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i don't agree with you bro. Relapse is the most outdated Eminem album for year it was released, people felt like Eminem is repeating himself and can't keep up with current music. dre as well.
i hated Recovery when it came out. But today i give it's props. Eminem broke his beak like an old eagle, reborn and became someone stronger with releasing relapse.
Recovery, Marshall Mathers LP 2 and Music To Be Murdered By are considered classics already. These albums are way better and succesful than Encore and Relapse.
If only producer Eminem could work with would be Dr. Dre, yeah than Relapse should be his last album so he won't humilate himself one more time. But he saw current music is evolving, new generation's point of view is changing, there are new young producers, new technics and new visions. So he quit working with his old producers and started to work with new generation producers. thats who eminem survived.
Bro Eminem from 96-2009 is one rapper and 2010-now is a completely different rapper who caters more to a pop crowd. There is not even an argument there. It makes me question whether you’ve even listened to these albums lately.
Recovery has some decent songs on there but it’s definitely near the bottom of his catalog along with Revival
Also as far as the impact these albums had on culture and music you just had to be there when these albums came out and it sounds like you got to these albums way later in the streaming era so way different experiences. These could all be contributing factors but at the end of the day we all have our unique opinions so if that’s how you feel that’s how you feel.
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For me, he's definitely dropped down a few notches on my all-time list. Encore was the last enjoyable album. Everything after that has been lackluster, mostly in part due to the weird accent and choppy flow that he uses. I've always felt that his popularity now resides with white folks that wear Monster hats or that are emo.
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He had to transform himself to keep up with current music point of view and he had to do it to be relevant.
production was overdated on relapse. nobody gave a fuck about that type of music anymore those days.
relapse is not considered as a classic, but recovery is considered as classic already which is totally not my favorite eminem album but i understand the meaning and importance of recovery.
Jay's right Sccit. You and Siavash have a subjective love for Relapse. But the critics didn't like it and it undersold with fans as well. Eminem himself disparages the album in Recovery he apologizes for the album and says "Encore I was on um (drugs) and Relapse I was comin off them drugs" saying he like he apologizes for those two weaker albums—that clearly weren't up to his first 3 flawless masterpiece albums SSLP, MMLP, and Eminem Show which were objectively excellent with critics and the buying public. So you are just defending your and Siavash subjective view of Relapse, so you should just say, "well, many didn't like it but I really loved Relapse" and that's okay.
The production was impressive on Relapse, but it's clear Eminem was missing something. Proof was dead, and he'd already accomplished everything he'd wanted in the game. And Jay is right that by 2007 Lil Wayne and the sound that would come with Young Money and such artists brought about the skinny jeans era and people weren't so interested in that Aftermath formula of album making and sound that we were all fans of.
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Jesus Christ you got EVERYTHING wrong lmao
When Relapse came out people were praising the shit put of it's production, it was the content and accents that bothred people so much. These days Relapse is considered a cult classic, that's a fact. Just check out Em's forums.
Recovery was hot when it came out, and it was indeed a modern new sound that people fucked with back in 2010. But it's fresh status only lasted for like 3 years, and since 2013 that shit been aging worse than a milk on a hot summer day. That Recovery sound became history. Why do you think everybody was making fun of Em for working with Alex Da Kid and using Recovery style in 2013/2017 and begged him to go back working with Dre? And why MTBMB was considered an improvement over Revival? Why do you think Em uses leftovers from Relapse on his newer albums, and not from Recovery?
It's kinda ironic how Relapse was considered outdated when it was released but ended aging better tham Recovery, which sounded more fresh at first.
Jay J is not wrong and neither are you....
Yes, Relapse has developed into somewhat of a cult classic, and maybe Recovery doesn't have that same cult following.
...but certainly Jay is right that the objective narrative from critics and the buying public at the time these albums were released was that Relapse was a let down and Recovery was a solid comeback
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For me, he's definitely dropped down a few notches on my all-time list. Encore was the last enjoyable album. Everything after that has been lackluster, mostly in part due to the weird accent and choppy flow that he uses. I've always felt that his popularity now resides with white folks that wear Monster hats or that are emo.
Me personally.. MMLP2 was the only post 8 Mile album of Eminem that I really loved and thought was damn near up to the classic standard of his first 3 Aftermath releases.
I liked the sound he was coming with in that era, like the Bad Meetz Evil EP was dope as well, and "Guts Over Fear" is one of my all time favorite joints which was also released around that time/sound/era of Em.
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Thank you trace, for speaking the truth and facts. You don't need to be an authorotiy to speak facts :)
MMLP2 have songs for every kind of listeners of eminem.
Rhyme or reason, So much better, brainless for old fans
Survival, legacy, monster for fans who loved recovery and bad meets evil
So far, love game, headlights for new fans
Berzerk for old school hardcore fans
He only didnt consider fans who liked relapse :)
It also has a lot of referances to marshall mathers album.
Bonus disc is amazing.
Classic.
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Thank you trace, for speaking the truth and facts. You don't need to be an authorotiy to speak facts :)
MMLP2 have songs for every kind of listeners of eminem.
Rhyme or reason, So much better, brainless for old fans
Survival, legacy, monster for fans who loved recovery and bad meets evil
So far, love game, headlights for new fans
Berzerk for old school hardcore fans
He only didnt consider fans who liked relapse :)
It also has a lot of referances to marshall mathers album.
Bonus disc is amazing.
Classic.
Yeah, we disagree on a lot, it's funny that we have a similar understanding of Eminem's post 8-Mile career. I think it's because you and I are both explaining it objectively.
You're right about MMLP2—it's like he was remarkably sort of able to satisfy everyone all at the same time. Like the young kids still think "Rap God' is proof Eminem is the greatest just because he raps fast on that song, and they study every lyric and try to spend days trying to spit those verses at the same speed.
But as you said, older hip-hop heads from our era really love tracks like "Brainless" and "Groundhog Day".
And then sort of like just the general music buying public might have enjoyed cuts like "Legacy" or "Stronger Than I Was" I thought were excellent cuts not necassarily as a hardcore hip-hop head but I think just a music critic in general should appreciate those songs.
Then pop fans enjoyed "Monster" was a success with Rihanna
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Jay's right Sccit. You and Siavash have a subjective love for Relapse. But the critics didn't like it and it undersold with fans as well. Eminem himself disparages the album in Recovery he apologizes for the album and says "Encore I was on um (drugs) and Relapse I was comin off them drugs" saying he like he apologizes for those two weaker albums—that clearly weren't up to his first 3 flawless masterpiece albums SSLP, MMLP, and Eminem Show which were objectively excellent with critics and the buying public. So you are just defending your and Siavash subjective view of Relapse, so you should just say, "well, many didn't like it but I really loved Relapse" and that's okay.
The production was impressive on Relapse, but it's clear Eminem was missing something. Proof was dead, and he'd already accomplished everything he'd wanted in the game. And Jay is right that by 2007 Lil Wayne and the sound that would come with Young Money and such artists brought about the skinny jeans era and people weren't so interested in that Aftermath formula of album making and sound that we were all fans of.
in 2020, Eminem's opinion towards Relapse started to become more positive. Before the YouTube premiere of the "Godzilla" music video on the Lyrical Lemonade channel, Eminem answered fan questions on the live chat. Fans filled the chat with requests for Relapse 2, which Eminem addressed, "I see a lot of requests for accents!"[114] He would also post on social media celebrating the 11th anniversary of the album's release. Later that year, Eminem released Music to Be Murdered By – Side B (Deluxe Edition), which included the song "Discombobulated". On the track, he rapped in his Relapse rap style, which many fans interpreted as him both embracing and paying tribute to the album for the first time.
In a 2024 skit conducted for Complex as part of The Death of Slim Shady (Coup de Grâce) album release cycle, Eminem responds defending Relapse, acknowledging its critical reappraisal and the cult status that it has gained among his fanbase: "For what it’s worth, there’s an entire generation of people who think that (album) is a fucking classic."[117]
i know you really love recovery because it was a time in your life where u were still in love with eminem and some of the sappy tracks on there spoke to you and represented that moment in time
but from a HIP-HOP HEAD perspective, your average eminem fan was not feeling that album AT ALL ... it was looked at as a pop album and was definitely a commercial success, but eminem fans were completely disappointed in real time
relapse turned a lot of people off in real time because of the accents, but it aged much better and even developed a cult following over time
meanwhile, that entire alex da kid production style eminem was using during recovery has been mocked to death in hip-hop circles.
again.. i know you've stated in the past that recovery is a personal album to you, but you're in the minority. you're more a situational listener. you loved that album because it represented a time in your life more so than for the actual quality of the music, which unequivocally aged like milk.
here is a forum of eminem fans speaking on it:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Eminem/comments/xvee3q/recovery_or_relapse_i_prefer_recovery/
damn near no one picked recovery over relapse lol
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Jay J is not wrong and neither are you....
Yes, Relapse has developed into somewhat of a cult classic, and maybe Recovery doesn't have that same cult following.
...but certainly Jay is right that the objective narrative from critics and the buying public at the time these albums were released was that Relapse was a let down and Recovery was a solid comeback
maybe from pop critics .. the cats who vote to give lil nas x grammys over snoop lol.. it wasn't getting high praise from cats in tune with hip-hop culture
matter fact, even some pop publications like allmusic, entertainment weekly, and pitchfork rated relapse higher
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in 2020, Eminem's opinion towards Relapse started to become more positive. Before the YouTube premiere of the "Godzilla" music video on the Lyrical Lemonade channel, Eminem answered fan questions on the live chat. Fans filled the chat with requests for Relapse 2, which Eminem addressed, "I see a lot of requests for accents!"[114] He would also post on social media celebrating the 11th anniversary of the album's release. Later that year, Eminem released Music to Be Murdered By – Side B (Deluxe Edition), which included the song "Discombobulated". On the track, he rapped in his Relapse rap style, which many fans interpreted as him both embracing and paying tribute to the album for the first time.
In a 2024 skit conducted for Complex as part of The Death of Slim Shady (Coup de Grâce) album release cycle, Eminem responds defending Relapse, acknowledging its critical reappraisal and the cult status that it has gained among his fanbase: "For what it’s worth, there’s an entire generation of people who think that (album) is a fucking classic."[117]
i know you really love recovery because it was a time in your life where u were still in love with eminem and some of the sappy tracks on there spoke to you and represented that moment in time
but from a HIP-HOP HEAD perspective, your average eminem fan was not feeling that album AT ALL ... it was looked at as a pop album and was definitely a commercial success, but eminem fans were completely disappointed in real time
relapse turned a lot of people off in real time because of the accents, but it aged much better and even developed a cult following over time
meanwhile, that entire alex da kid production style eminem was using during recovery has been mocked to death in hip-hop circles.
again.. i know you've stated in the past that recovery is a personal album to you, but you're in the minority. you're more a situational listener. you loved that album because it represented a time in your life more so than for the actual quality of the music, which unequivocally aged like milk.
here is a forum of eminem fans speaking on it:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Eminem/comments/xvee3q/recovery_or_relapse_i_prefer_recovery/
damn near no one picked recovery over relapse lol
I never said Recovery was one of my favorites—I’m speaking objectively when I talk about Recovery. I have no personal affinity for Recovery. I don’t dislike it but the only post 8-Mile Eminem solo album I’ve lauded and praised on here is MMLP2 which I pointed out in this thread and you somehow missed.
Yes I don’t deny Relapse has gained more cult following over the years but I’m talking about in the era these albums were released
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Thank you trace, for speaking the truth and facts. You don't need to be an authorotiy to speak facts :)
MMLP2 have songs for every kind of listeners of eminem.
Rhyme or reason, So much better, brainless for old fans
Survival, legacy, monster for fans who loved recovery and bad meets evil
So far, love game, headlights for new fans
Berzerk for old school hardcore fans
He only didnt consider fans who liked relapse :)
It also has a lot of referances to marshall mathers album.
Bonus disc is amazing.
Classic.
infinite i can say is an authority on eminem
but even the authority can be wrong once in a while
you're right about mmlp2 being his best album in the post 00s era tho
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I never said Recovery was one of my favorites—I’m speaking objectively when I talk about Recovery. I have no personal affinity for Recovery. I don’t dislike it but the only post 8-Mile Eminem solo album I’ve lauded and praised on here is MMLP2 which I pointed out in this thread and you somehow missed.
Yes I don’t deny Relapse has gained more cult following over the years but I’m talking about in the era these albums were released
my mistake .. i think i confused your love for mmlp2 with recovery .... i was replying to one post at a time, so i only saw you talking about mmlp2 in this thread after i replied .. regardless, recovery was never seen as a "classic" and it was reviewed decently by your average pop fan.. but again, from a hip-hop head perspective, we were all greatly disappointed .. and since u were disappointed with it as well, you know where we comin from.
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infinite i can say is an authority on eminem
but even the authority can be wrong once in a while
you're right about mmlp2 being his best album in the post 00s era tho
I never call myself authority for anything but i also dont care if you think i am an autority on eminem or not.
I dont know how much you are into eminem since he came out and how much you spent your life to listen to eminem and anything about him. I did a lot but i cant say i know more than you, i advice you the same, you cant know what and how much i know. All i can say, i trust myself to say a few things about Eminem. I dont claim im an authority. I'm here to share my knowledge and read others perspective to learn smth if i miss anything.
I agree with infinite, definately not agree with you. I respect your point of view but as infite said you are making a personal comment based on what you like or not. Thats not the point at all in this threas to me.
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I never call myself authority for anything but i also dont care if you think i am an autority on eminem or not.
I dont know how much you are into eminem since he came out and how much you spent your life to listen to eminem and anything about him. I did a lot but i cant say i know more than you, i advice you the same, you cant know what and how much i know. All i can say, i trust myself to say a few things about Eminem. I dont claim im an authority. I'm here to share my knowledge and read others perspective to learn smth if i miss anything.
I agree with infinite, definately not agree with you. I respect your point of view but as infite said you are making a personal comment based on what you like or not. Thats not the point at all in this threas to me.
the thing is, you live in turkey .. i live in los angeles. it's a bit different when you are so removed from the scene and saying what's goin on and dictating how things are received within the culture. with all due respect .. you say you disagree.. and that's what i'm telling u. it's not about what you agree or disagree with.. it's about facts homie. the facts is, eminem fans hold relapse in a much higher regard than recovery. casual fans ala the pop crowd are more into recovery because it was more successful commercially as a pop crossover album. that's a fact, not an opinion brother.
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the thing is, you live in turkey .. i live in los angeles. it's a bit different when you are so removed from the scene and saying what's goin on and dictating how things are received within the culture. with all due respect .. you say you disagree.. and that's what i'm telling u. it's not about what you agree or disagree with.. it's about facts homie. the facts is, eminem fans hold relapse in a much higher regard than recovery. casual fans ala the pop crowd are more into recovery because it was more successful commercially as a pop crossover album. that's a fact, not an opinion brother.
The thing is its not about where you live. The fact is not about where you live. Even if you live in detroit you dont have right to say you know about eminem more than me. Also according to the discussion we made above with you, it became a proof of its not about you live in los angles or turkey. We made our comments bro, leave it there and let other people drop their comment, we are not here in this forum to agree with you.
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Eminem is a global star and his impact was worldwide, living in LA or Turkey has no relevance on how Eminem's albums were received.
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The thing is its not about where you live. The fact is not about where you live. Even if you live in detroit you dont have right to say you know about eminem more than me. Also according to the discussion we made above with you, it became a proof of its not about you live in los angles or turkey. We made our comments bro, leave it there and let other people drop their comment, we are not here in this forum to agree with you.
bruh wtf r u rambling on about
if we want opinions on turkish folk music we'll ask you
chill
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The thing is its not about where you live. The fact is not about where you live. Even if you live in detroit you dont have right to say you know about eminem more than me. Also according to the discussion we made above with you, it became a proof of its not about you live in los angles or turkey. We made our comments bro, leave it there and let other people drop their comment, we are not here in this forum to agree with you.
Like I wanna ride around and bump stalker music..
“Hey baby, my name is shady,
Them some nice buns, yum yum”
I don’t care how good the damn production value is… the album has no soul.
Proof had died and Eminem was searching for his identity as an artist. He said in an interview at the time that he asked himself what Proof would tell him to do for the album and that Proof would tell him to go all out and say the most shocking shit and have no fear.
Yeah sure the early albums had shock value, but it’s like comparing 1980’s WWF to 1990’s WWF. Ol School the rule was no matter how crazy shit got they still maintained it was real. Hogan fuccin choked a talk show host out and got sued for a million — just because the talk show host was saying shit like Wrestling wasn’t real in 87.’ They had soul and you really believed as a kid that Hogan and Mr T were out fighting bad guys on subways in New York City when they were away from the ring. By the 90’s you had the Undertaker putting opponents in a coffin after the match and things got ridiculous.
Sure, Em was throwing his wife in a trunk on the SSLP but there was still a hint of truth to it because they had an abusive relationship.
But the Relapse shit where by that time he’d been totally removed from his poverty and dramas with Kim and now he’s just rapping about stalking random women it lost touch with reality.
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bruh wtf r u rambling on about
if we want opinions on turkish folk music we'll ask you
chill
Sure u can ask, but i wouldnt ask you about eminem. ;D
do black people tell you to stop talking about rap because u are a jewish?
stop being racist bro, you are humiliating yourself yourself with claiming nobody here from outside of la or usa has right to talk about hip hop except of you and your crew.
you should leave la and talk people around the world. there are lots of hip hop heads, jewish, muslim, black, white, european, asian, etc... i know many of em who knows way more than you, more than me.
just chill. leave your little world in little la neighbourhood to change your perspective.
Unfortunately, one more time, we cant focus on real thing here because of fighting your ego and narrow regional nationalism. you have my number, let's discuss there if u need.
-
Like I wanna ride around and bump stalker music..
“Hey baby, my name is shady,
Them some nice buns, yum yum”
I don’t care how good the damn production value is… the album has no soul.
Proof had died and Eminem was searching for his identity as an artist. He said in an interview at the time that he asked himself what Proof would tell him to do for the album and that Proof would tell him to go all out and say the most shocking shit and have no fear.
Yeah sure the early albums had shock value, but it’s like comparing 1980’s WWF to 1990’s WWF. Ol School the rule was no matter how crazy shit got they still maintained it was real. Hogan fuccin choked a talk show host out and got sued for a million — just because the talk show host was saying shit like Wrestling wasn’t real in 87.’ They had soul and you really believed as a kid that Hogan and Mr T were out fighting bad guys on subways in New York City when they were away from the ring. By the 90’s you had the Undertaker putting opponents in a coffin after the match and things got ridiculous.
Sure, Em was throwing his wife in a trunk on the SSLP but there was still a hint of truth to it because they had an abusive relationship.
But the Relapse shit where by that time he’d been totally removed from his poverty and dramas with Kim and now he’s just rapping about stalking random women it lost touch with reality.
the problem was production. not they lyrics. yeah accents were a little bit too much but main problem was how production was outdated and boring. (except of beautiful which is the only track not produced by dre, deja vu and 3 am). the rest was classic old dre sound which every amateur beatmaker is able to imitate)
i think em's performance lyrically was great, especially on 3 am, stay wide awake, same song and dance. only good production he fucked up is "bagpipes from baghdad. he ruined that monster beat with mariah carey issue.
eminem even changed the way he rap on recovery. i wasn't a fan of his new yelling type of rap which is more straight and with less word play. but as i said it became succesful and took attention of a new generation and people who is listening to music currently.
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the problem was production. not they lyrics. yeah accents were a little bit too much but main problem was how production was outdated and boring. (except of beautiful which is the only track not produced by dre, deja vu and 3 am). the rest was classic old dre sound which every amateur beatmaker is able to imitate)
i think em's performance lyrically was great, especially on 3 am, stay wide awake, same song and dance. only good production he fucked up is "bagpipes from baghdad. he ruined that monster beat with mariah carey issue.
eminem even changed the way he rap on recovery. i wasn't a fan of his new yelling type of rap which is more straight and with less word play. but as i said it became succesful and took attention of a new generation and people who is listening to music currently.
Yeah I was still agreeing with you in my post above, just kind of adding to what we were saying. Let me make clear where I agree and where I disagree with your side…
Agree
—Recovery was obviously more well received than Relapse was when they were released
—Relapse was considered a disappointment when it dropped
—Recovery was considered a successful comeback and redemption album (from failed Relapse) when it dropped.
—I also thought the yelling had become a bit annoying. It was groundbreaking and gave me chills when I first heard it in May 2000 on “The Way I Am” MMLP, but post 8-Mile the yelling on albums had lost the charm, and was hit and miss
—the accents were a bit too much on Relapse
—the skills were still there as far as rhyming goes and flow
—the production was outdated because unfortunately we had moved away from the baggy jeans Aftermath/G Unit era and into the skinny jeans lil Wayne Young Money era
Disagree
—you liked the lyrics, but I didn’t like the lyrical CONTENT on relapse. So, if we are judging lyrics by “content” then I can’t agree with you that Relapse was dope lyrically. It had no soul, I’m not a fan of horror movies or the stalker shit, like I’m not gonna sit and watch American Psycho the movie or listen to such lyrics if they are too far removed from reality.
—you didn’t like the production on Relapse, but I thought the production value for the album was yet another Master Class from Dre. I agree with you it was outdated, but the Aftermath Sound never grows old with most fans here at the forum, I mean we grew up on his death row sound and then the resurgence era when him and Mel Man created the vintage Aftermath sound are why we are at this forum to begin with
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Yeah I was still agreeing with you in my post above, just kind of adding to what we were saying. Let me make clear where I agree and where I disagree with your side…
Agree
—Recovery was obviously more well received than Relapse was when they were released
—Relapse was considered a disappointment when it dropped
—Recovery was considered a successful comeback and redemption album (from failed Relapse) when it dropped.
—I also thought the yelling had become a bit annoying. It was groundbreaking and gave me chills when I first heard it in May 2000 on “The Way I Am” MMLP, but post 8-Mile the yelling on albums had lost the charm, and was hit and miss
—the accents were a bit too much on Relapse
—the skills were still there as far as rhyming goes and flow
—the production was outdated because unfortunately we had moved away from the baggy jeans Aftermath/G Unit era and into the skinny jeans lil Wayne Young Money era
Disagree
—you liked the lyrics, but I didn’t like the lyrical CONTENT on relapse. So, if we are judging lyrics by “content” then I can’t agree with you that Relapse was dope lyrically. It had no soul, I’m not a fan of horror movies or the stalker shit, like I’m not gonna sit and watch American Psycho the movie or listen to such lyrics if they are too far removed from reality.
—you didn’t like the production on Relapse, but I thought the production value for the album was yet another Master Class from Dre. I agree with you it was outdated, but the Aftermath Sound never grows old with most fans here at the forum, I mean we grew up on his death row sound and then the resurgence era when him and Mel Man created the vintage Aftermath sound are why we are at this forum to begin with
Sure i love aftermath sound, i'm still listening to old hip hop records more than new ones. i'm an old head bro. but eminem was not an artist to please old fans in that time. that dr. dre type of post 2001 dr. dre sound wasnt right choice for eminem in 2009.
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I thought Relapse was dope lyrically...sure the lyrics are shock value but he was spitting
the same can be said for someone like Brotha Lynch Hung...you may not agree with his content but you can not deny the skill
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After MM LP
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Sure u can ask, but i wouldnt ask you about eminem. ;D
do black people tell you to stop talking about rap because u are a jewish?
stop being racist bro, you are humiliating yourself yourself with claiming nobody here from outside of la or usa has right to talk about hip hop except of you and your crew.
you should leave la and talk people around the world. there are lots of hip hop heads, jewish, muslim, black, white, european, asian, etc... i know many of em who knows way more than you, more than me.
just chill. leave your little world in little la neighbourhood to change your perspective.
Unfortunately, one more time, we cant focus on real thing here because of fighting your ego and narrow regional nationalism. you have my number, let's discuss there if u need.
nobody told u not to talk about rap lmao
and where one resides has nothing to do with race.. so calling it racist is a desperation reach
to answer your question, i wouldn't go up to an african and try to teach him about african culture lol. that would be very arrogant of me.
hip-hop is global, of course.. but it's american culture first. so when i tell you that hip-hop heads don't value recovery in the way they value relapse, responding "i disagree" is pretty pompous.
even as a jewish person, im a guest in the house of hip-hop..but i still live the culture in its home. so what do you think being from turkey makes you?
it's not racist to say white people are guests in the house of hip-hop... eminem himself has said that. its called RESPECT. you have to have the respect to humble yourself and realize this is 1.black cultute and 2.american culture.
so are u able to speak opinions on hip-hop? absolutely .... but confidently stating that recovery is more embraced by eminem fans isn't an opinion. it's a misrepresentation of reality. opinions are one thing.. facts are another.
i'll leave you with this gem
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yGgCkqjCmeY
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Like I wanna ride around and bump stalker music..
“Hey baby, my name is shady,
Them some nice buns, yum yum”
I don’t care how good the damn production value is… the album has no soul.
Proof had died and Eminem was searching for his identity as an artist. He said in an interview at the time that he asked himself what Proof would tell him to do for the album and that Proof would tell him to go all out and say the most shocking shit and have no fear.
Yeah sure the early albums had shock value, but it’s like comparing 1980’s WWF to 1990’s WWF. Ol School the rule was no matter how crazy shit got they still maintained it was real. Hogan fuccin choked a talk show host out and got sued for a million — just because the talk show host was saying shit like Wrestling wasn’t real in 87.’ They had soul and you really believed as a kid that Hogan and Mr T were out fighting bad guys on subways in New York City when they were away from the ring. By the 90’s you had the Undertaker putting opponents in a coffin after the match and things got ridiculous.
Sure, Em was throwing his wife in a trunk on the SSLP but there was still a hint of truth to it because they had an abusive relationship.
But the Relapse shit where by that time he’d been totally removed from his poverty and dramas with Kim and now he’s just rapping about stalking random women it lost touch with reality.
it's a concept album
-
Yeah I was still agreeing with you in my post above, just kind of adding to what we were saying. Let me make clear where I agree and where I disagree with your side…
Agree
—Recovery was obviously more well received than Relapse was when they were released
—Relapse was considered a disappointment when it dropped
—Recovery was considered a successful comeback and redemption album (from failed Relapse) when it dropped.
—I also thought the yelling had become a bit annoying. It was groundbreaking and gave me chills when I first heard it in May 2000 on “The Way I Am” MMLP, but post 8-Mile the yelling on albums had lost the charm, and was hit and miss
—the accents were a bit too much on Relapse
—the skills were still there as far as rhyming goes and flow
—the production was outdated because unfortunately we had moved away from the baggy jeans Aftermath/G Unit era and into the skinny jeans lil Wayne Young Money era
Disagree
—you liked the lyrics, but I didn’t like the lyrical CONTENT on relapse. So, if we are judging lyrics by “content” then I can’t agree with you that Relapse was dope lyrically. It had no soul, I’m not a fan of horror movies or the stalker shit, like I’m not gonna sit and watch American Psycho the movie or listen to such lyrics if they are too far removed from reality.
—you didn’t like the production on Relapse, but I thought the production value for the album was yet another Master Class from Dre. I agree with you it was outdated, but the Aftermath Sound never grows old with most fans here at the forum, I mean we grew up on his death row sound and then the resurgence era when him and Mel Man created the vintage Aftermath sound are why we are at this forum to begin with
recovery was better received by who? eminem fans or casual pop fans??
if you claim recovery was better received by eminem fans then you're outa touch.
the yelling over stadium beats with skyler grey and rihanna hooks was mocked to death by hip-hop heads.
it was only embraced by pop fans.
most people loved the production on relapse .. and the only issue was they claimed the accents was over the top. which did turn a lot of people off.
but the yelling over stadium beats with pop hooks was considered so corny that it became a parody to most heads.
i was there in real time in the heart of the culture..do you know ANY hip-hop head that embraces recovery? shit, u got cey cey callin it a classic LOL. literally the first time ive ever heard that.
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recovery was better received by who? eminem fans or casual pop fans??
if you claim recovery was better received by eminem fans then you're outa touch.
the yelling over stadium beats with skyler grey and rihanna hooks was mocked to death by hip-hop heads.
it was only embraced by pop fans.
most people loved the production on relapse .. and the only issue was they claimed the accents was over the top. which did turn a lot of people off.
but the yelling over stadium beats with pop hooks was considered so corny that it became a parody to most heads.
i was there in real time in the heart of the culture..do you know ANY hip-hop head that embraces recovery? shit, u got cey cey callin it a classic LOL. literally the first time ive ever heard that.
By Eminem fans? They didn’t receive either album that well… you know what we could do is just link some old threads.. maybe you can find the main thread from when Relapse was released and the main thread from when Recovery was released and bump them up and then we can know for sure — since there were many Em fans here
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nobody told u not to talk about rap lmao
and where one resides has nothing to do with race.. so calling it racist is a desperation reach
to answer your question, i wouldn't go up to an african and try to teach him about african culture lol. that would be very arrogant of me.
hip-hop is global, of course.. but it's american culture first. so when i tell you that hip-hop heads don't value recovery in the way they value relapse, responding "i disagree" is pretty pompous.
even as a jewish person, im a guest in the house of hip-hop..but i still live the culture in its home. so what do you think being from turkey makes you?
it's not racist to say white people are guests in the house of hip-hop... eminem himself has said that. its called RESPECT. you have to have the respect to humble yourself and realize this is 1.black cultute and 2.american culture.
so are u able to speak opinions on hip-hop? absolutely .... but confidently stating that recovery is more embraced by eminem fans isn't an opinion. it's a misrepresentation of reality. opinions are one thing.. facts are another.
i'll leave you with this gem
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yGgCkqjCmeY
I guess you didn't get what i meant bro, you look confused.
I never said recovery well recieved by eminem fans :)
I even gave myself as an example because i'm an eminem fan, more than you, as i read your comment you dont seem to have enough knowledge about eminem to discuss with a turkish as a jewish guest living in los angeles. All you can bring to table is you are right because you live in america and i dont.
Just wanted to let you face it if you want to take it to location and race :)
Anyway i hated recovery when it came out as an eminem fan, most of old eminem fans felt same way, i also can say i liked relapse more than recovery in first listen but even after relapse i was feeling that it is another failure as encore and eminem should get rid of dr.dre productions as soon as possible. today we see that recovery album saved eminem's career which was going down with encore and relapse dissapointments. Because ha adapted himself to time and got new fans. He showed that he doesnt sound same old same and will not. He will always be relevant, he will able to adapt and he is going to come up with something new. That is why recovery saved his ass and well recieved by most of current music listeners even if they are eminem fan or not.
Isnt it clear what i say? Come on sccit, lets discuss about music. If you can. Let us read your perspective for once instead taking it to races and location. I believe in you
Let me introduce you a few rap groups from europe(including turkey and uk) who are dope, who are legends, better rapper than you, better producer than you. Because its about talent, its about the way you are into it and giving yourself to culture no matter where you are from. (i appriciate your effort by they way, you are my friend and i feel you have dope records but u cant fuck with legendary artists and fucking great hip hop heads from all around the world)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNPN5Tgkmd8?si=w3zaWJa8MgEDPUmm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNCexT6PpAk?si=-2Xqon5ExkhYKq8o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpTx7IlbPyw?si=FWPOg-sWQsayXLpu
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQOG5BkY2Bc?si=joAg95zu6yIQRjgJ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0i2jaRK2n4?si=Fi0LUK861OUJhO3K
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rq6w0ACBAPw?si=lOmgOwvp3As_NFWn
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always funny to see people claiming this or that for everyone like they know better and they speak for the people. just give your opinion, don't speak for others just for your ego or statement.
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By Eminem fans? They didn’t receive either album that well… you know what we could do is just link some old threads.. maybe you can find the main thread from when Relapse was released and the main thread from when Recovery was released and bump them up and then we can know for sure — since there were many Em fans here
i already peeped both official discussion threads on here earlier this morning
and i linked a thread on it from eminem's forum as well in one of my earlier posts
relapse was received wayyyyy better by fans
it's not even close
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I guess you didn't get what i meant bro, you look confused.
I never said recovery well recieved by eminem fans :)
I even gave myself as an example because i'm an eminem fan, more than you, as i read your comment you dont seem to have enough knowledge about eminem to discuss with a turkish as a jewish guest living in los angeles. All you can bring to table is you are right because you live in america and i dont.
Just wanted to let you face it if you want to take it to location and race :)
Anyway i hated recovery when it came out as an eminem fan, most of old eminem fans felt same way, i also can say i liked relapse more than recovery in first listen but even after relapse i was feeling that it is another failure as encore and eminem should get rid of dr.dre productions as soon as possible. today we see that recovery album saved eminem's career which was going down with encore and relapse dissapointments. Because ha adapted himself to time and got new fans. He showed that he doesnt sound same old same and will not. He will always be relevant, he will able to adapt and he is going to come up with something new. That is why recovery saved his ass and well recieved by most of current music listeners even if they are eminem fan or not.
Isnt it clear what i say? Come on sccit, lets discuss about music. If you can. Let us read your perspective for once instead taking it to races and location. I believe in you
Let me introduce you a few rap groups from europe(including turkey and uk) who are dope, who are legends, better rapper than you, better producer than you. Because its about talent, its about the way you are into it and giving yourself to culture no matter where you are from. (i appriciate your effort by they way, you are my friend and i feel you have dope records but u cant fuck with legendary artists and fucking great hip hop heads from all around the world)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNPN5Tgkmd8?si=w3zaWJa8MgEDPUmm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNCexT6PpAk?si=-2Xqon5ExkhYKq8o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpTx7IlbPyw?si=FWPOg-sWQsayXLpu
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQOG5BkY2Bc?si=joAg95zu6yIQRjgJ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0i2jaRK2n4?si=Fi0LUK861OUJhO3K
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rq6w0ACBAPw?si=lOmgOwvp3As_NFWn
that shit u linkin is mediocre at best :mjlol:
generic hippity hop try hard shit wit no flavor and zero originality over uninspired beats. doesn't hold a candle to what me and siavash do .. but we already been peeped u as a lowkey hater wit "unique" taste
:ray:
(https://i.ibb.co/8DHYdSwL/IMG-0797.jpg)
tell me how you're a "bigger eminem fan" than me again?
we don't care that eminem went pop and gained a new fanbase with recovery .. that was never in question. these discussions were having revolve around consensus in hip-hop circles, not the pop world.
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that shit u linkin is mediocre at best :mjlol:
generic hippity hop try hard shit wit no flavor and zero originality over uninspired beats. doesn't hold a candle to what me and siavash do .. but we already been peeped u as a lowkey hater wit "unique" taste
:ray:
(https://i.ibb.co/8DHYdSwL/IMG-0797.jpg)
tell me how you're a "bigger eminem fan" than me again?
we don't care that eminem went pop and gained a new fanbase with recovery .. that was never in question. these discussions were having revolve around consensus in hip-hop circles, not the pop world.
I know a girl in turkey who has these whole catalog. You would have smth to talk.
I'm not a hater but yeah i have a unique taste. You are right about that. I agree with you finally on smth.
Keep it cool bro.
Lets get back to discussion.
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I know a girl in turkey who has these whole catalog. You would have smth to talk.
I'm not a hater but yeah i have a unique taste. You are right about that. I agree with you finally on smth.
Keep it cool bro.
Lets get back to discussion.
i doubt she has infinite cd press or raw & uncut
those are super rare
but tell her to holla at me
:urwelcome:
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I know a girl in turkey who has these whole catalog. You would have smth to talk.
I'm not a hater but yeah i have a unique taste. You are right about that. I agree with you finally on smth.
Keep it cool bro.
Lets get back to discussion.
Im from Greek background but Id like to visit Turkey one day...I have a cousin who lives there
that shit u linkin is mediocre at best :mjlol:
generic hippity hop try hard shit wit no flavor and zero originality over uninspired beats. doesn't hold a candle to what me and siavash do .. but we already been peeped u as a lowkey hater wit "unique" taste
:ray:
(https://i.ibb.co/8DHYdSwL/IMG-0797.jpg)
tell me how you're a "bigger eminem fan" than me again?
we don't care that eminem went pop and gained a new fanbase with recovery .. that was never in question. these discussions were having revolve around consensus in hip-hop circles, not the pop world.
impressive collection 8)
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i doubt she has infinite cd press or raw & uncut
Those two what I missin from my collection.
And I am far from an Eminem fan...
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impressive collection 8)
Word
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Jay J is not wrong and neither are you....
Yes, Relapse has developed into somewhat of a cult classic, and maybe Recovery doesn't have that same cult following.
...but certainly Jay is right that the objective narrative from critics and the buying public at the time these albums were released was that Relapse was a let down and Recovery was a solid comeback
That's exactly what I said tho, Trace. So how am I wrong?
Jay's objectively wrong and you just pretty much agreed with me. Jay's saying Relapse production was disappointing and outdated and that people didn't like it, when in reality the production aspect was the only part of the album that everyone praised. Shit, I mean since we are quoting Wikipedia now, it says "Critically, the album received mixed responses upon release. Reviewers generally praised its production".
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Again, Recovery, despite sounding fresher at the time of it's release, has aged far worse than Relapse. That's a fact. There's a reason everyone was rolling their eyes at Eminem trying to imitate it's sound in 2017. And there's also a reason why Em is putting his Relapse leftovers on his newer albums and everybody loves those songs.
Jay, it's fine if you prefer Recovery to Relapse, but you disliking it for whatever reasons can't take away it's classic status. That would be just your opinion. Personally, I feel like MMLP2 is garbage, but me disliking it wouldn't change the fact that the majority loves it anyway.
Nobody's denying that Recovery was huge when it came out and that it was the album that gave Em's career a new life and got him so many new fans.
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Im from Greek background but Id like to visit Turkey one day...I have a cousin who lives there
be my guest brother, i'd be glad to host you.
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Again, Recovery, despite sounding fresher at the time of it's release, has aged far worse than Relapse. That's a fact. There's a reason everyone was rolling their eyes at Eminem trying to imitate it's sound in 2017. And there's also a reason why Em is putting his Relapse leftovers on his newer albums and everybody loves those songs.
Jay, it's fine if you prefer Recovery to Relapse, but you disliking it for whatever reasons can't take away it's classic status. That would be just your opinion. Personally, I feel like MMLP2 is garbage, but me disliking it wouldn't change the fact that the majority loves it anyway.
Nobody's denying that Recovery was huge when it came out and that it was the album that gave Em's career a new life and got him so many new fans.
no i dont prefer Recovery to Relapse. why you guys are not reading :)
i'm saying im not a fan of Recovery, i like Relapse more. But Recovery was fresh, new and suitable for current time that i was released. Eminem made a big move with changing his flow, cadance and tone, also he gave up working with Dre. he started to work with different cats and these decisions saved Eminem's career which was falling so bad after Encore and Relapse. I'm not saying i like Recovery and it's my taste, i just say that i give it's flowers for how it effected em's career in a good way.
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That's exactly what I said tho, Trace. So how am I wrong?
Jay's objectively wrong and you just pretty much agreed with me. Jay's saying Relapse production was disappointing and outdated and that people didn't like it, when in reality the production aspect was the only part of the album that everyone praised. Shit, I mean since we are quoting Wikipedia now, it says "Critically, the album received mixed responses upon release. Reviewers generally praised its production".
Are we getting wikipedia as source? you can write anything there :)
Sure dre is a fucking good mix enginner and his beats bang, if he make something sounds like a track from 2001, i think it would sound dope in production and mix wise. but it would fucking sound outdated, you know what im saying bro?
What makes Eminem sound so unique was to producek with Jeff Bass, Dj Head, Mr Porter. When he let Dr. Dre to produce him entirely it was not the right time. Actually it was never a right time for Eminem to work with dre entirely on an album honestly. 2009 was the worst time to work with Dr. Dre who doesnt know what to do and doubting himself. Music evolved and dre couldnt keep up with it. 2009 wasnt a good time for a relevant artist like Em to come up with tracks like Insane, Underground, My Mom, We Made You (which all of em were dope). Why do you think people liked "Beautiful" most?
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no i dont prefer Recovery to Relapse. why you guys are not reading :)
i'm saying im not a fan of Recovery, i like Relapse more. But Recovery was fresh, new and suitable for current time that i was released. Eminem made a big move with changing his flow, cadance and tone, also he gave up working with Dre. he started to work with different cats and these decisions saved Eminem's career which was falling so bad after Encore and Relapse. I'm not saying i like Recovery and it's my taste, i just say that i give it's flowers for how it effected em's career in a good way.
its hilarious to speak as if relapse was a flop LOL
it went gold in less than a week and was the best selling rap album of 2009
:lulz:
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Why the phuck is an Eminem thread in the westcoast section?!
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no i dont prefer Recovery to Relapse. why you guys are not reading :)
i'm saying im not a fan of Recovery, i like Relapse more. But Recovery was fresh, new and suitable for current time that i was released. Eminem made a big move with changing his flow, cadance and tone, also he gave up working with Dre. he started to work with different cats and these decisions saved Eminem's career which was falling so bad after Encore and Relapse. I'm not saying i like Recovery and it's my taste, i just say that i give it's flowers for how it effected em's career in a good way.
That's exactly what I'm saying tho. Nobody's denying that Recovery had a greater impact on Em's career than Relapse and people loved it a lot back in 2010. But the thing is, as the time passed people started to appreciate Relapse more and now this album is indeed considered a cult classic, while Recovery is mostly looked upon as something that was cool 15 years ago but now is corny af.
Take Skylar Grey for example. Em's records with her (LTWYL, INAD) were massive hits back then, but now everybody wants to roll their eyes when they see her name featured on Em's new albums. On the other hand people disliked the accents and thought the beats were outdated back in 2009, but when Em dropped Discombobulated few years ago most people seemed to love it and put it in their top 3 from the album.
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Why the phuck is an Eminem thread in the westcoast section?!
https://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php/topic,8879.msg111855.html
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That's exactly what I'm saying tho. Nobody's denying that Recovery had a greater impact on Em's career than Relapse and people loved it a lot back in 2010. But the thing is, as the time passed people started to appreciate Relapse more and now this album is indeed considered a cult classic, while Recovery is mostly looked upon as something that was cool 15 years ago but now is corny af.
Take Skylar Grey for example. Em's records with her (LTWYL, INAD) were massive hits back then, but now everybody wants to roll their eyes when they see her name featured on Em's new albums. On the other hand people disliked the accents and thought the beats were outdated back in 2009, but when Em dropped Discombobulated few years ago most people seemed to love it and put it in their top 3 from the album.
Discombombulated is definately a relapse leftover but you know S-1 and Black Bethoven co-produced the beat and made a beat switch to it and made it sound not outdated. however one song sounds like relapse on whole album makes a difference and satisfies some fans, that's a cool move. but if they put 10 songs sounds like relapse or encore on an album today, it would suck.
Relapse sure will might age better because it belongs to en era that we miss. But recovery belongs to a mainstream era for a quite period. today both are outdated. so one might age better than other. but recovery was suitable for period it came out, relapse was not. em released relapse after very long time and aftermath/interscope pushed it hard on marketing side. so sure it has sold a lot. encore sold a lot too and seems succesful but thats how em's fall off begin.
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"recovery has just surpassed 5.1 billion streams on Spotify remanining as his 3rd most streamed album to surpass this mark and in turn remains as the most streamed rap album of 2010."
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Nah. Em was never the goat. He was a good rapper, he had the interscope machine behind him and due to race he was an anomaly.
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Nah. Em was never the goat. He was a good rapper, he had the interscope machine behind him and due to race he was an anomaly.
interscope machine was behind bubba sparxxx too.
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/zLpmzrW_zlw
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Nah. Em was never the goat. He was a good rapper, he had the interscope machine behind him and due to race he was an anomaly.
I agree race played a big factor but you cannot deny the skill set he had...it would be another story if he were wack
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i already peeped both official discussion threads on here earlier this morning
and i linked a thread on it from eminem's forum as well in one of my earlier posts
relapse was received wayyyyy better by fans
it's not even close
link me
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i doubt she has infinite cd press or raw & uncut
those are super rare
but tell her to holla at me
:urwelcome:
yeah but bro I legit saw your Eminem Infinite album at your crib and you tried to claim it was an original from 97', but whoever the dumbass is that did the liner notes for it, put in some concert photo from Eminem Show Eminem that was the same as the "Sing For The Moment" music video and clearly not from 1997. I mean it was just a casual convo, so you could've meant something else
but still, would be way more dope if
a) your copy of Infinite was an original press from 97' when Infinite was released
or
b) they re-released it but reprinted the o.g liner notes to try to keep it as close and authentic to the original press as possible (not insert of a photo from Eminem Show concert)
It is an impressive collection though. But it is missing the Crown Jewel of an o.g Infinite or Slim Shady EP
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its hilarious to speak as if relapse was a flop LOL
it went gold in less than a week and was the best selling rap album of 2009
:lulz:
Then why did Eminem feel the need to apologize for it?
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Then why did Eminem feel the need to apologize for it?
Good question
it might have something with him changing his personal beliefs towards the left and maybe he thought the content was just too wild...just a theory
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Then why did Eminem feel the need to apologize for it?
Because compared to his classic run of albums at the time it felt lazy and uninspired
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Then why did Eminem feel the need to apologize for it?
he "matured"
into the rendition u now hate so much lol
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Because compared to his classic run of albums at the time it felt lazy and uninspired
Exactly
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Did he apologize for Encore?
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Did he apologize for Encore?
I think I remember him saying he was cool with about half of it which is exactly how I feel about it
The bad songs were unbelievably bad though
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I think I remember him saying he was cool with about half of it which is exactly how I feel about it
The bad songs were unbelievably bad though
best songs were leaked; "we as americans, bully, love you more" unfortunately.
dr. dre replaced them with "big winnie, rain man and ass like that"
first album that eminem started to work with luis resto (keyboard player, co-producer) and mike strange (mix engineer) instead jeff bass (producer, keyboard, guitar player), dj head (drum programmer), steve king (guitar player, mix engineer). eminem also started to mix his own music, compose his own kind of drums. so we get totally a different sound which sonds weaker, not produced and mixed enough.i don't even want to talk about dre productions already. evil deeds and one last time was good songs really but dre was kind of losing his way and eminem mixed those and they sounded under their potential. however eminem was on drugs so bad. because of all these encore was a failure.
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Eminem's formula was simple to make great albums. To produce songs with Jeff Bass and let dj head do the drum programming and let steve king mix them for most of the album. Then add a few dr. dre productions which are highly going to be hit singles. This formula is approved for his first 4 albums inculiding d12 album.
Eminem never did an album mostly or entirely produced by dr. dre. even if one of his first 3 albums were enitrely produced by dr.dre they wouldnt have been classics as much as they were originally. Just because of that Relapse were going to be a failure. Also year was not 2001, nobody was fucking with west coast gangsta rap beats anymore. Especially when eminem's on it for a full lenght LP. It's not a surprise "beautiful" was the only track shined and took good critics.
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Eminem's formula was simple to make great albums. To produce songs with Jeff Bass and let dj head do the drum programming and let steve king mix them for most of the album. Then add a few dr. dre productions which are highly going to be hit singles. This formula is approved for his first 4 albums inculiding d12 album.
Eminem never did an album mostly or entirely produced by dr. dre. even if one of his first 3 albums were enitrely produced by dr.dre they wouldnt have been classics as much as they were originally. Just because of that Relapse were going to be a failure. Also year was not 2001, nobody was fucking with west coast gangsta rap beats anymore. Especially when eminem's on it for a full lenght LP. It's not a surprise "beautiful" was the only track shined and took good critics.
Curious to know what "west coast gangsta beats" were anywhere on Relapse. Dre came with haunting beats to match the horrocore vibe Em was on. And beautiful is the only song I skip on the album, that shit pales in comparison production-wise to the rest of the album. I think some people on here type because it likes how it feels to their fingers but don't know what they're talking about.
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best songs were leaked; "we as americans, bully, love you more" unfortunately.
dr. dre replaced them with "big winnie, rain man and ass like that"
first album that eminem started to work with luis resto (keyboard player, co-producer) and mike strange (mix engineer) instead jeff bass (producer, keyboard, guitar player), dj head (drum programmer), steve king (guitar player, mix engineer). eminem also started to mix his own music, compose his own kind of drums. so we get totally a different sound which sonds weaker, not produced and mixed enough.i don't even want to talk about dre productions already. evil deeds and one last time was good songs really but dre was kind of losing his way and eminem mixed those and they sounded under their potential. however eminem was on drugs so bad. because of all these encore was a failure.
100% Co-Sign !!
This is odd that we are agreeing so much these days. It’s like you are a different guy than the one I knew before on here or that I had you mixed up with someone else.
I have a theory why we sound the same in this thread… aren’t we close to the same age of 43? Were you around for the early Aftermath period before they signed Eminem? Then an immediate fan of Eminem simply from hearing that he was signed to Dre? I think this put us on the same timeline and same understanding of the trajectory of his career.
But yes, you are exactly right. Eminem had the winning album making formula the way the Chicago Bulls had their formula in the 90’s. Eminem had employed that formula successfully on his first 3 Aftermath solos and refined it as well with other releases like the first D-12 album or even projects like 8-Mile, etc.
A big part of the formula was the Bass Brothers, like his Scottie Pippen. They had a winning music making formula and ever since the letdown of Doggfather—I always expect artists to lose their fire 🔥 after they break through and sell out—yet Eminem continued to turn out quality project after quality project even after experiencing great success. Because Eminem had the winning song and album making formula that fans like us were used to.
And when that first leak came for Encore it sounded right to us. “We As Americans” was next level with him maturing into effective political commentary, and it was that vintage Eminem sound and it had the kind of production and sound that he had mastered. Along with the other cuts like “Canibitch” and “Bully” — it wasn’t as great as the Eminem Show but it was still in line with everything we expected.
Then with the leak things got mixed up and it was the first time he really got thrown off course. We ended up with an album—that had tracks like “Evil Deeds” and “Puke” that sounded exactly like what we expected but other songs like “Big Weenie” the ones you mentioned, around half the album (which could have been filled properly by the leaked cuts) that made for the first dissapointment of Em’s career.
But anyway, yes, bottom line, fans like you and I look back to the early leak and release of Encore in the way you described
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100% Co-Sign !!
This is odd that we are agreeing so much these days. It’s like you are a different guy than the one I knew before on here or that I had you mixed up with someone else.
I have a theory why we sound the same in this thread… aren’t we close to the same age of 43? Were you around for the early Aftermath period before they signed Eminem? Then an immediate fan of Eminem simply from hearing that he was signed to Dre? I think this put us on the same timeline and same understanding of the trajectory of his career.
But yes, you are exactly right. Eminem had the winning album making formula the way the Chicago Bulls had their formula in the 90’s. Eminem had employed that formula successfully on his first 3 Aftermath solos and refined it as well with other releases like the first D-12 album or even projects like 8-Mile, etc.
A big part of the formula was the Bass Brothers, like his Scottie Pippen. They had a winning music making formula and ever since the letdown of Doggfather—I always expect artists to lose their fire 🔥 after they break through and sell out—yet Eminem continued to turn out quality project after quality project even after experiencing great success. Because Eminem had the winning song and album making formula that fans like us were used to.
And when that first leak came for Encore it sounded right to us. “We As Americans” was next level with him maturing into effective political commentary, and it was that vintage Eminem sound and it had the kind of production and sound that he had mastered. Along with the other cuts like “Canibitch” and “Bully” — it wasn’t as great as the Eminem Show but it was still in line with everything we expected.
Then with the leak things got mixed up and it was the first time he really got thrown off course. We ended up with an album—that had tracks like “Evil Deeds” and “Puke” that sounded exactly like what we expected but other songs like “Big Weenie” the ones you mentioned, around half the album (which could have been filled properly by the leaked cuts) that made for the first dissapointment of Em’s career.
But anyway, yes, bottom line, fans like you and I look back to the early leak and release of Encore in the way you described
ok u can stop jerkin him off now
he also thinks that snoops missionary album is a brilliant piece of work .. the same missionary u said was absolute garbage
is that also because you're both 43?
:ray:
everybody knows encore was a big step down from eminem show.. that's no secret. but shitting on the production of relapse is a very strange take not shared by many. the issue most people had was the over the top accents. the production was actually considered epic in real time.
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100% Co-Sign !!
This is odd that we are agreeing so much these days. It’s like you are a different guy than the one I knew before on here or that I had you mixed up with someone else.
I have a theory why we sound the same in this thread… aren’t we close to the same age of 43? Were you around for the early Aftermath period before they signed Eminem? Then an immediate fan of Eminem simply from hearing that he was signed to Dre? I think this put us on the same timeline and same understanding of the trajectory of his career.
But yes, you are exactly right. Eminem had the winning album making formula the way the Chicago Bulls had their formula in the 90’s. Eminem had employed that formula successfully on his first 3 Aftermath solos and refined it as well with other releases like the first D-12 album or even projects like 8-Mile, etc.
A big part of the formula was the Bass Brothers, like his Scottie Pippen. They had a winning music making formula and ever since the letdown of Doggfather—I always expect artists to lose their fire 🔥 after they break through and sell out—yet Eminem continued to turn out quality project after quality project even after experiencing great success. Because Eminem had the winning song and album making formula that fans like us were used to.
And when that first leak came for Encore it sounded right to us. “We As Americans” was next level with him maturing into effective political commentary, and it was that vintage Eminem sound and it had the kind of production and sound that he had mastered. Along with the other cuts like “Canibitch” and “Bully” — it wasn’t as great as the Eminem Show but it was still in line with everything we expected.
Then with the leak things got mixed up and it was the first time he really got thrown off course. We ended up with an album—that had tracks like “Evil Deeds” and “Puke” that sounded exactly like what we expected but other songs like “Big Weenie” the ones you mentioned, around half the album (which could have been filled properly by the leaked cuts) that made for the first dissapointment of Em’s career.
But anyway, yes, bottom line, fans like you and I look back to the early leak and release of Encore in the way you described
I'm 40 but i started to get into hip hop seriously was 2001. So i wasnt around when eminem released slim shady lp.
If Eminem would save some songs he did for 8 mile, obie and pac album for himself on encore, it should have been another classic.
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ok u can stop jerkin him off now
he also thinks that snoops missionary album is a brilliant piece of work .. the same missionary u said was absolute garbage
is that also because you're both 43?
:ray:
everybody knows encore was a big step down from eminem show.. that's no secret. but shitting on the production of relapse is a very strange take not shared by many. the issue most people had was the over the top accents. the production was actually considered epic in real time.
He accurately identified the Encore leak (I think it was called "Straight from the Lab") as a key event in Eminem's career timeline. Eminem even spoke directly about his in an interview and said how pissed he was, and how he had to go back in and cut more songs and it was like he didn't give a fucc and ended up with trash like "Big Weenie".
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Curious to know what "west coast gangsta beats" were anywhere on Relapse. Dre came with haunting beats to match the horrocore vibe Em was on. And beautiful is the only song I skip on the album, that shit pales in comparison production-wise to the rest of the album. I think some people on here type because it likes how it feels to their fingers but don't know what they're talking about.
My mom kinda reminds whats the difference with horns.
Bagpipes from bagdad is a signature dr.dre beat
Insane also
Old times sake, underground are pure west coast beats
Beautiful is the only song eminem is not doing accent, only music is produced with sample and live instrumentation of guitar and bass, not only rough drums on a midi west coast influential loop that keeps repeating.
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ok u can stop jerkin him off now
he also thinks that snoops missionary album is a brilliant piece of work .. the same missionary u said was absolute garbage
is that also because you're both 43?
:ray:
everybody knows encore was a big step down from eminem show.. that's no secret. but shitting on the production of relapse is a very strange take not shared by many. the issue most people had was the over the top accents. the production was actually considered epic in real time.
Dont be jealous :)
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I'm 40 but i started to get into hip hop seriously was 2001. So i wasnt around when eminem released slim shady lp.
If Eminem would save some songs he did for 8 mile, obie and pac album for himself on encore, it should have been another classic.
Encore was on it's way to being solid follow up to the Eminem Show (if the leak never happened). "6 in the Morning" was leaked and was a far superior track to "1 Shot, 2 Shot' which was wack. "6 in the Morning" was on the level of the D-12 tracks we heard on MMLP and Eminem Show. If not for the leak, we could've gotten this very solid and expected Eminem album very close to his usual standard and sound:
OG Encore Album (before the Leak)
Intro
1. Evil Deeds
2. Bully
3. Canibitch
4. Never Enough (feat. 50 Cent & Nate Dogg)
5. Yellow Brick Road
6. Like Toy Soldiers
7. Mosh
8. We As Americuns
9. Puke
10. Spend Some Time feat. Stat Quo
11. Love You More
12. Just Lose It
13. 6 in the Morning (Come on In feat. D-12)
14. Mockingbird
15. Encore (feat. 50 Cent & Dr. Dre)
That's a fuccin sick ass album and solid follow up to everything that had came before. It's not classic, and it's not the level of Eminem Show, but I think all his fans that had followed him since he signed with Dre would've been at least satisfied.
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Encore was on it's way to being solid follow up to the Eminem Show (if the leak never happened). "6 in the Morning" was leaked and was a far superior track to "1 Shot, 2 Shot' which was wack. "6 in the Morning" was on the level of the D-12 tracks we heard on MMLP and Eminem Show. If not for the leak, we could've gotten this very solid and expected Eminem album very close to his usual standard and sound:
1. We As Americans
2. Bully
3. Canibitch
4. Never Enough (feat. 50 Cent & Nate Dogg)
5. Yellow Brick Road
6. Like Toy Soldiers
7. Mosh
8. Evil Deeds
9. Puke
10. Spend Some Time feat. Stat Quo
11. Love You More - og
12. Just Lose It
13. 6 in the Morning (Come on In feat. D-12)
14. Mockingbird
15. Encore (feat. 50 Cent & Dr. Dre)
That's a fuccin sick ass album and solid follow up to everything that had came before. It's not classic, and it's not the level of Eminem Show, but I think all his fans that had followed him since he signed with Dre would've been at least satisfied.
Relapse could have been better with less dre beats and more joints like beautiful, careful what you wish for, my darling, elevator.
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for real guys, u really surprised when a 40, 50 years old artist aint the same as he/she was at 20s 30s?
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Relapse could have been better with less dre beats and more joints like beautiful, careful what you wish for, my darling, elevator.
:dead:
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He accurately identified the Encore leak (I think it was called "Straight from the Lab") as a key event in Eminem's career timeline. Eminem even spoke directly about his in an interview and said how pissed he was, and how he had to go back in and cut more songs and it was like he didn't give a fucc and ended up with trash like "Big Weenie".
the encore leaks isn't some big secret homie lol
it's the whole "relapse woulda been better with less dre beats!" that's boggling everyone's mind
literally no one has ever said that... every single person who i've ever heard comment on relapse highlights the production as the strong point
the heavy accent overdone character flows threw everyone off initially .. but no one ever complained about the production
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the encore leaks isn't some big secret homie lol
it's the whole "relapse woulda been better with less dre beats!" that's boggling everyone's mind
literally no one has ever said that... every single person who i've ever heard comment on relapse highlights the production as the strong point
the heavy accent overdone character flows threw everyone off initially .. but no one ever complained about the production
They might be dr. Dre fans. Not eminem fans.
Even as a dre fan i find those beats outdated. I dont say they are not bangin, i dont say they are bad. They were outdated. Also they dont fit eminem. Its not eminem music at all. You cant expect eminem to jump on an album produced by dj premier for exampöe and expect me to say "production was dope!".
As an eminem fan, it is sooooo wrong to make an eminem album fully produced by dre. Not even in 99 or 2001. That has to fail absolutely. Em's signature sound doesnt belong to dr.dre singles.
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Relapse could have been better with less dre beats and more joints like beautiful, careful what you wish for, my darling, elevator.
Again, agreed -- because of 2 key reasons.
Lyrics - Eminem's career had always followed a clear arc and narrative. So Slim Shady EP/LP he was the hungry starving artist "Rock Bottom" and "If I Had" and introducing himself to the world "My Name Is." Then MMLP he was responding to the haters and the backlash against him, and then Eminem Show he was poking fun at his fame, and also considering leaving it all behind saying he was just a regular guy "Say Goodbye to Hollywood". Once Eminem did Relapse, he totally lost the narrative and career arc his fans had followed him every step of the way with.
Production - He stopped using the Bass Brothers. "Beautiful" and the tracks you mentioned were the last time he would ever work with the Bass Brothers, and his overall sound started to change, and went off course. Really sounds more like Detox Leftover Beats. Still, the beats weren't the problem though, but I do think leaving the Bass Brothers made it harder for his hard core fans that had been with him since the beginning to still follow him in the same way.
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They might be dr. Dre fans. Not eminem fans.
Even as a dre fan i find those beats outdated. I dont say they are not bangin, i dont say they are bad. They were outdated. Also they dont fit eminem. Its not eminem music at all. You cant expect eminem to jump on an album produced by dj premier for exampöe and expect me to say "production was dope!".
As an eminem fan, it is sooooo wrong to make an eminem album fully produced by dre. Not even in 99 or 2001. That has to fail absolutely. Em's signature sound doesnt belong to dr.dre singles.
u said u just got into rap in 2001
we were already full on heads in 1999 when mmlp dropped
let me tell you, in real time we all LOVED everything dre did on SSLP MMLP & Eminem Show
you are the only one who thinks that dre was the problem on Relapse.. literally the only person in the whole entire world lol no exaggeration
u can go back and look at the threads if u don't believe me.. and hardcore eminem fans were very prevalent on this forum during that era.
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u said u just got into rap in 2001
we were already full on heads in 1999 when mmlp dropped
let me tell you, in real time we all LOVED everything dre did on SSLP MMLP & Eminem Show
you are the only one who thinks that dre was the problem on Relapse.. literally the only person in the whole entire world lol no exaggeration
u can go back and look at the threads if u don't believe me.. and hardcore eminem fans were very prevalent on this forum during that era.
That doest make anyone right who started to listen to rap earlier :) sccit, you better get used to that its not about age, not about location, not about your color or when you started to listen to it :)
Yes i loved everything dre did on mmlp, sslp and eminem show (maybe say what you say is kind of unnecessary). I never said dre shouldnt produce for eminem :) you pushing yourself hard to not understand me.
Dre was good to bring radio friendly singles as a big name that grammys and charts will consider with interscope's power. Rest of the album, real content, deep issues and track that were going to make you an eminem fan were belont to a detroit production team made of jeff bass, dj head, steve king and eminem's himself.
Last succesful dr.dre produced album was "documentary". Because it fits perfect to the game and 50 cent was fucking at the top and came up with radio friendly hooks. That was the last time dr.dre executive produced a classic. Then he fell off. Because rap changed he didnt understsnd it. We saw that fell off on following 50 cent albums, busta rhymes album (commercially succesful but outdated to me as well), finally relapse with full of detox, bishop, game, busta leftover like sounding beats. Kanye, pharrel and timbaland was making a revolution those days with new sounds. Dre was still on making midi loops and putting subbass kicks and smash claps on them with mark batson and dawaun parker who cant fuck with scott, mike, mel man, ron feemster or camara kambon.
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Oh now we calling The Big Bang outdated as well? (https://i.ibb.co/sdL69ww8/bqUo3EU.gif)
Man this thread is hilarious
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Oh now we calling The Big Bang outdated as well? (https://i.ibb.co/sdL69ww8/bqUo3EU.gif)
Man this thread is hilarious
dr. dre's production doesnt fit to east coast mc's well. also it was 2006 and south started to takeover. again it wasnt a good time in music industry for post 2004 dre productions. it worked great on genesis in 2001 because there was a west coast take over, dre was on top of his career and only a few dre/scott jointz was the thing industry was looking for. even just blaze production "everybody rise" is a west coast influenced beat. genesis is my favorite busta rhymes album by the way. both west coast and east coast jointz worked properly together. but on 2006 shit was different.
there's a review that i agree on every word.
https://behindtherhyme.com/2016/07/24/busta-rhymes-the-big-bang-10-years-old/
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dr. dre's production doesnt fit to east coast mc's well. also it was 2006 and south started to takeover. again it wasnt a good time in music industry for post 2004 dre productions. it worked great on genesis in 2001 because there was a west coast take over, dre was on top of his career and only a few dre/scott jointz was the thing industry was looking for. even just blaze production "everybody rise" is a west coast influenced beat. genesis is my favorite busta rhymes album by the way. both west coast and east coast jointz worked properly together. but on 2006 shit was different.
there's a review that i agree on every word.
https://behindtherhyme.com/2016/07/24/busta-rhymes-the-big-bang-10-years-old/
Bro you've got some very unique takes, I'll tell you that
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Bro you've got some very unique takes, I'll tell you that
thats how i see. i don't claim it is what is. i'm just bringing my opinion. i respect opositte comments.
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thats how i see. i don't claim it is what is. i'm just bringing my opinion. i respect opositte comments.
Fair enough (https://i.ibb.co/s93XgYJF/IMG-6858.png)
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u said u just got into rap in 2001
we were already full on heads in 1999 when mmlp dropped
let me tell you, in real time we all LOVED everything dre did on SSLP MMLP & Eminem Show
you are the only one who thinks that dre was the problem on Relapse.. literally the only person in the whole entire world lol no exaggeration
u can go back and look at the threads if u don't believe me.. and hardcore eminem fans were very prevalent on this forum during that era.
lmao true re dre
heard hello and deja vu this AM.. production A1
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I respect everyone's POV but here is my 2 cents after listening to the album for the 2nd time this month
1. I don't think Dre has since matched his production on "Relapse" even on "Compton"
2. Ems rhyme schemes on it are amazing...flow is crazy
3. I enjoy horrorcore from time to time so the subject matter does not bother me but I understand its not for everyone including some hardcore Em fans...its a concept album
4. The accent works on some songs but on others it can get annoying so I think he definitely overused it
5. The "Beautiful" track is the only Bass produced track and doesnt fit on the album even though its a great song imo...wouldve been better served on "Curtain Call" or another Greatest Hits release
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“Say what you say” was a classic and they were addressing the beefs they had at the time. It was a very exciting track that still slaps.
And to say Dre makes beats that doesn’t sound good for east coast artists is insane. Have you not heard the firm album? And the Big Bang is a good album that got slept on.
I don’t agree with your takes in this thread Turkish insider and it makes me doubt you were listening to these albums when they dropped but perhaps it’s just your really unique taste
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lmao true re dre
heard hello and deja vu this AM.. production A1
Deja vu is my favorite on the album. Dope chorus and nice outro. Great track.
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big bang was outdated
:fisherlol:
another incredible take that literally no one claimed in real time
ayo cey cey... stick to turkish folk music!
(https://i1.sndcdn.com/artworks-000268076948-5n9gi3-t500x500.jpg)
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“Say what you say” was a classic and they were addressing the beefs they had at the time. It was a very exciting track that still slaps.
And to say Dre makes beats that doesn’t sound good for east coast artists is insane. Have you not heard the firm album? And the Big Bang is a good album that got slept on.
I don’t agree with your takes in this thread Turkish insider and it makes me doubt you were listening to these albums when they dropped but perhaps it’s just your really unique taste
To me say what you say was adressing Dre's beef personally and it had nothing to do to be on an emimem album. Also beat is same loop keep repeating. Historically its an iconic track that em and dre making a diss track back and forth, but it should be a single or on a compilation album.
I have the firm album. I like that album personally but have you ever heard "firm flopped"???? That was the reason that Dre ain't been gettin' no sleep and came up with 2001 with all them old and new West coast rappers.
Sure i've listened to those albums when they dropped. The big bang was a dissapointment for me except of been through the storm.
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big bang was outdated
:fisherlol:
another incredible take that literally no one claimed in real time
ayo cey cey... stick to turkish folk music!
(https://i1.sndcdn.com/artworks-000268076948-5n9gi3-t500x500.jpg)
Then who is going to correct your mistakes and stop you to put yourself into sad situation in social media :) i think i can handle both hip hop, turkish music and other genres.
When i say big bang was outdated i mean the dre beats there. There were 8 tracks produced by dre/mark/dewaun (weakest dre team in history). There were never even 8 dre tracks on eminem, xzibit, snoop albums. I would like to say same thing about jay z's kingdome come album but i would like to call those dre beats wack instead outdated.
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guys. did u know 2001 was outdated when it dropped? everybody knows this. in fact, the only good song from there is "the message". because it wasn't midi g-funk imitation that dre was still using during this era. that's why the chronic is better. but the second half of the chronic is still very very bad, everybody says that. during this era beats by the pound was the hot sound making smash hits with excellent productions and dre was left behind. as a matter of fact, dr. dre was already finished in 1991. this is hip hop history 101 for all of you who didnt know.
(https://i.makeagif.com/media/8-02-2017/7KgvFj.gif)
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To me say what you say was adressing Dre's beef personally and it had nothing to do to be on an emimem album. Also beat is same loop keep repeating. Historically its an iconic track that em and dre making a diss track back and forth, but it should be a single or on a compilation album.
I have the firm album. I like that album personally but have you ever heard "firm flopped"???? That was the reason that Dre ain't been gettin' no sleep and came up with 2001 with all them old and new West coast rappers.
Sure i've listened to those albums when they dropped. The big bang was a dissapointment for me except of been through the storm.
Yeah the firm flopped financially who cares a lot of dope albums have flopped. Your favorite (missionary) being one of them but you still like the album right?
Anyways you’ve heard “Phone Tap” yes? That’s one of the dopest tracks Dre has ever released and it’s with all east coast rappers. He also was making Jay Z beats too that turned into really good songs
Also I personally think Eminem would sound amazing over an album of premo beats
And the thing about not having the diss on an em album. Em was a ride or die type cat unlike snoop. So Eminem would take on Dre’s beef because he’s riding with him. If you listen to the song he’s going in on JD too. That’s just the type of loyalty he has. So if anything it added to the album in the way of building his character
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Yeah the firm flopped financially who cares a lot of dope albums have flopped. Your favorite (missionary) being one of them but you still like the album right?
Anyways you’ve heard “Phone Tap” yes? That’s one of the dopest tracks Dre has ever released and it’s with all east coast rappers. He also was making Jay Z beats too that turned into really good songs
Also I personally think Eminem would sound amazing over an album of premo beats
And the thing about not having the diss on an em album. Em was a ride or die type cat unlike snoop. So Eminem would take on Dre’s beef because he’s riding with him. If you listen to the song he’s going in on JD too. That’s just the type of loyalty he has. So if anything it added to the album in the way of building his character
I fucking love aftermath compilation too but it is not a surprise that it flopped. The firm as well.
You are making a wrong discussion, we are not talking about what we like or not personally.
Eminem would sound great on a primo beat. But not on a whole album produced by premier. It wouldnt be an eminem album anyway. It would be a collabo album.
Yeah Em is a do or die type. As you said it was dre's personal case, that song could be a bonus track or b side for a single. Thats my vision for an album.
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dre/mark/dewaun (weakest dre team in history)
Brooo stoooop lmao
That is one of his strongest team ever, he literally perfected his 2001 style with them. Shit they did on the Big Bang and The Blue Carpet is some of the best music Dre ever did lol
What the fuck is going on haha
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Brooo stoooop lmao
That is one of his strongest team ever, he literally perfected his 2001 style with them. Shit they did on the Big Bang and The Blue Carpet is some of the best music Dre ever did lol
What the fuck is going on haha
no it's not matchings to the perfectionist of scott storch production master. everybody knows scott storch is the real smart genius musical. he never ever making midi g-funk imitation productions. dr. dre is trash after NWA. he copy scott storch sound. this is a fact that everybody remembering.
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dr. dre is trash after NWA
since world class wreckin crew*
Everyone knows Dre NWA beats sound like some fl studio shit, anybody can do that
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since world class wreckin crew*
Everyone knows Dre NWA beats sound like some fl studio shit, anybody can do that
no because dj yella real genius musical. he know how to carry dre and teach him master class professional mix mastering with no cheap midi sound.
but world class wreckin cru was cheap imitation of zapp. everybody know.
(https://media.tenor.com/5cFVXhl5QZAAAAAM/bataborat.gif)
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I fucking love aftermath compilation too but it is not a surprise that it flopped. The firm as well.
You are making a wrong discussion, we are not talking about what we like or not personally.
Eminem would sound great on a primo beat. But not on a whole album produced by premier. It wouldnt be an eminem album anyway. It would be a collabo album.
Yeah Em is a do or die type. As you said it was dre's personal case, that song could be a bonus track or b side for a single. Thats my vision for an album.
Jay has a fair point. What he’s saying is the Bass Brothers drew out a certain quality and chemistry from Eminem that went beyond just giving him a dope beat. I’ll give you an example. The track 11 on MMLP “Marshall Mathers” is a basically boring and plain sounding beat—but look how much it brought out of Eminem? I mean it’s literally the title track of the album where he explains who he is.
Without the Bass Brothers on Relapse you had a collection of dope beats but the album had no heart and no soul. Just a collection of beats and rhymes but Eminem couldn’t find himself. He literally, lost his “voice” on the album.
On Recovery, give him credit because he found himself and found his voice again even without the Bass Brothers. Me personally, I’m not a big fan of Relapse or Recovery but I’m definitely more of a Recovery guy than a Relapse guy.
Relapse has better production but Recovery has more heart.
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Jay has a fair point. What he’s saying is the Bass Brothers drew out a certain quality and chemistry from Eminem that went beyond just giving him a dope beat. I’ll give you an example. The track 11 on MMLP “Marshall Mathers” is a basically boring and plain sounding beat—but look how much it brought out of Eminem? I mean it’s literally the title track of the album where he explains who he is.
Without the Bass Brothers on Relapse you had a collection of dope beats but the album had no heart and no soul. Just a collection of beats and rhymes but Eminem couldn’t find himself. He literally, lost his “voice” on the album.
On Recovery, give him credit because he found himself and found his voice again even without the Bass Brothers. Me personally, I’m not a big fan of Relapse or Recovery but I’m definitely more of a Recovery guy than a Relapse guy.
Relapse has better production but Recovery has more heart.
yes .. bass brothers had excellent chemistry with em and losing them really sucked .. this goes without saying
that doesn't change the fact that calling dre's bct through relapse era production "weak" and "outdated" is nothing short of retarded lol
and i'm glad you finally admitted u secretly have a hard on for that abomination of an album recovery
that album had zero heart .. it was just em chasing sappy pop hits for an entire album .. the only album more contrived than that one is revival.
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Brooo stoooop lmao
That is one of his strongest team ever, he literally perfected his 2001 style with them. Shit they did on the Big Bang and The Blue Carpet is some of the best music Dre ever did lol
What the fuck is going on haha
I laughed hard but if you feel that way, its your taste. I cant judge it.
Dre's best team were mike elizondo, scott storch, camara kambon, mel-man. This team dominated hip hop for 6-7 years and inspired a lot of following songs, albums, rappers, producers. This team made no limit top dogg, slim shady lp, 2001, restless, marshall mathers lp, GRODT, beg for mercy, man vs machine, devil's night, eminem show, documentary, family affair, let me blow your mind, break ya neck, the wash ost, etc...
You want tell what your strongest team did?
Let me remind you a few.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=SN4oVcJEgF8?si=S_rYL6owhXs5mYeL
https://youtube.com/watch?v=RzQRxV2XqFU?si=AnFlElFnC8nBh_rI
https://youtube.com/watch?v=huP8JBkKhZg?si=PWyzXpb_0crSRPMC
https://youtube.com/watch?v=O5F-1Raqths?si=-ID31qgmBv-rjn8d
Damn i cant continue..
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Brooo stoooop lmao
That is one of his strongest team ever, he literally perfected his 2001 style with them. Shit they did on the Big Bang and The Blue Carpet is some of the best music Dre ever did lol
What the fuck is going on haha
literally lmao. that mid 2000s team is literally goated. batson, parker, lawrence etc are the best team dre ever had. storch made way better stuff during detox than on 2001 and him n mike elizondo did better work during the 2000s too. personally i would include khalil, jake one, blaze, focus, nottz and denaun part of the 2000s team too since they were around ALOT.
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also recovery has some of the best em songs ever, along with some of the best just blaze n dj khalil production ever. cutting em off after relapse would be a crime. would be like saying would dre be considered the goat if he never released music after dr dre presents the aftermath album lol.
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also recovery has some of the best em songs ever, along with some of the best just blaze n dj khalil production ever. cutting em off after relapse would be a crime. would be like saying would dre be considered the goat if he never released music after dr dre presents the aftermath album lol.
It’s nothing like that actually. Dre released 2001 after. Eminem hasn’t released a single classic album since Eminem Show
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I respect everyone's POV but here is my 2 cents after listening to the album for the 2nd time this month
1. I don't think Dre has since matched his production on "Relapse" even on "Compton"
2. Ems rhyme schemes on it are amazing...flow is crazy
3. I enjoy horrorcore from time to time so the subject matter does not bother me but I understand its not for everyone including some hardcore Em fans...its a concept album
4. The accent works on some songs but on others it can get annoying so I think he definitely overused it
5. The "Beautiful" track is the only Bass produced track and doesnt fit on the album even though its a great song imo...wouldve been better served on "Curtain Call" or another Greatest Hits release
We agree on most everything, especially in regards to that awkward yet fascinating period in rap that existed in that 97-98 space after Suge went to prison and before the West Coast Resurgence era was set off when "Bitch Please" took off. I'll respond to each of your points individually:
1. "Compton" to me was a classic and flawless album/soundtrack. So I think the production on "Compton" is superior to "Relapse" when you consider all the work Dre did for each piece of it, such as intros and outros to tracks and interludes, there was greater detail in the mix, and great attention paid to perfecting each moment of every track. Like the voice effects on Anderson Pak and transition into Kendrick's verse on "Deep Water" and then moments like that little break on "Darkside/Gone" that "Eazy E CPT O.G. from the Darkside" and transition into Dre's next verse change in beat in keys is masterful and more detailed than his work on Relapse.
2. yes true, lyrically and flow; but people didn't like his voice/accent and there's no heart; and there's not that poignant commentary about his life and the state of hip-hop and his place in the rap game like the previous albums. The content is trash.
3. yes, exactly, some people could vibe with the content, but others not their cup of tea
4. The accent did give him a boost in something; or he wouldn't of used it. It may have helped him with his pronunciation on some words and he was able to to rhyme words that maybe didn't rhyme otherwise, or it allowed him to spiritually distance himself from the darkness of what he was saying
5. agreed
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also recovery has some of the best em songs ever, along with some of the best just blaze n dj khalil production ever. cutting em off after relapse would be a crime. would be like saying would dre be considered the goat if he never released music after dr dre presents the aftermath album lol.
MMLP2 and Bad Meetz Evil EP spectacular
And tracks like "Guts Over Fear" that were recorded years after Relapse—I consider to be one of Eminem's top 5 greatest songs of his whole career. Then on MMLP you got tracks like "Brainless" which is actually like an update of the Slim Shady LP classic "Brain Damage" and is as good or better than that classic song. I also thought that "Stronger Than I Was" might be the best song he ever did about Kim, and tracks "Legacy" is also a great song.
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I laughed hard but if you feel that way, its your taste. I cant judge it.
Dre's best team were mike elizondo, scott storch, camara kambon, mel-man. This team dominated hip hop for 6-7 years and inspired a lot of following songs, albums, rappers, producers. This team made no limit top dogg, slim shady lp, 2001, restless, marshall mathers lp, GRODT, beg for mercy, man vs machine, devil's night, eminem show, documentary, family affair, let me blow your mind, break ya neck, the wash ost, etc...
You want tell what your strongest team did?
Let me remind you a few.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SN4oVcJEgF8?si=S_rYL6owhXs5mYeL
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzQRxV2XqFU?si=AnFlElFnC8nBh_rI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=huP8JBkKhZg?si=PWyzXpb_0crSRPMC
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5F-1Raqths?si=-ID31qgmBv-rjn8d
Damn i cant continue..
Bro did you just put a masterpiece that is Goldmine in there???
While I agree that the rest of the songs you mentioned weren't great, and that 30 something Jay's joint always been wack, you're clearly cherrypicking the worst songs that came out from that era. Why don't you post Get You Some, Don't Get Carried Away, Imagine, Get Low, Outta Control remix, Boss' Life, Deja Vu, Crack A bottle (say what you what about the song, but the beat is crazy), In The Chetto, Cocaina, Minority Report, Lost One, Stay Wide Awake etc etc etc?
It's like if I was arguing that his 2001 team was wack and posted Choke me spank me, Take the heat, Rain Man, Not Today, Ass like that, Just lose it and Push play to prove my point.
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I'd say his 2001 team was more consistent, while his 2006 team was uneven and had higher highs and lower lows. In the span of 7 years, the only wack contributions Elizondo/Scott/Mel-Man had made were Truth Hurts album, 2 Eve tracks on her second album, Mary's Not Today, a few Em records from Encore and TES and the shit they did for Man vs Machine.
Mark/Dawaun made some of the best Dre music ever that's better than the most of what he did with his previous team (the entirety of The Big Bang and their contribution to TBCT), with Imagine being the pinnacle of it all and a strong contender for top 5 Dre beats of all time. But they're also responsible for 30 something, Trouble, 50's Fire, Stat Quo's Here we go, with Fire being the first time I've ever heard a Dre beat and thought "Wow, that was really bad". And their team been active for only 3 years. They've done more than enough classics in the short period of time to forever be one of Dre's top teams. Unlike his current collaborations that still can't produce anything really dope even after more than 10 years.....
But it's hilarious how you trying to say The Documentary was still the hottest shit ever with Dre still being in his prime with no signs of slowing down, and The Big Bang and TBCT both already were outdated when they were released, despite coming out just a year after that and sounding more advanced. It doesn't work like that, some time needs to pass before someone's style becomes outdated, unless something major happens.
Kanye and Wayne music revolution didn't start until late 2007, so there were no fundamental changes in hip hop between 2005 and 2006.
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I'd say his 2001 team was more consistent, while his 2006 team was uneven and had higher highs and lower lows. In the span of 7 years, the only wack contributions Elizondo/Scott/Mel-Man had made were Truth Hurts album, 2 Eve tracks on her second album, Mary's Not Today, a few Em records from Encore and TES and the shit they did for Man vs Machine.
Mark/Dawaun made some of the best Dre music ever that's better than the most of what he did with his previous team (the entirety of The Big Bang and their contribution to TBCT), with Imagine being the pinnacle of it all and a strong contender for top 5 Dre beats of all time. But they're also responsible for 30 something, Trouble, 50's Fire, Stat Quo's Here we go, with Fire being the first time I've ever heard a Dre beat and thought "Wow, that was really bad". And their team been active for only 3 years. They've done more than enough classics in the short period of time to forever be one of Dre's top teams. Unlike his current collaborations that still can't produce anything really dope even after more than 10 years.....
But it's hilarious how you trying to say The Documentary was still the hottest shit ever with Dre still being in his prime with no signs of slowing down, and The Big Bang and TBCT both already were outdated when they were released, despite coming out just a year after that and sounding more advanced. It doesn't work like that, some time needs to pass before someone's style becomes outdated, unless something major happens.
Kanye and Wayne music revolution didn't start until late 2007, so there were no fundamental changes in hip hop between 2005 and 2006.
Death Row Era and West Coast Resurgence Era (from "Bitch Please" to The Documentary) are Dre's most consistent . So we are talking about cats like Daz and Sam Sneed over on the Death Row side and then cats like Mel-Man and Scott Storch over on the Aftermath side.
Because then he had the emcees to go over the top of the record and a whole movement behind him. Death Row was on top of the industry and then Eminem and 50 Cent/G Unit were on top, that shit was a whole movement.
So he mastered another sound by the time Relapse came around, and then mastered yet another sound by the time Compton came around. The problem was though the hip-hop era had passed and all that shit was done in the skinny jeans era so it seems less consistent, but actually it is just as consistent.
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I'd say his 2001 team was more consistent, while his 2006 team was uneven and had higher highs and lower lows. In the span of 7 years, the only wack contributions Elizondo/Scott/Mel-Man had made were Truth Hurts album, 2 Eve tracks on her second album, Mary's Not Today, a few Em records from Encore and TES and the shit they did for Man vs Machine.
Mark/Dawaun made some of the best Dre music ever that's better than the most of what he did with his previous team (the entirety of The Big Bang and their contribution to TBCT), with Imagine being the pinnacle of it all and a strong contender for top 5 Dre beats of all time. But they're also responsible for 30 something, Trouble, 50's Fire, Stat Quo's Here we go, with Fire being the first time I've ever heard a Dre beat and thought "Wow, that was really bad". And their team been active for only 3 years. They've done more than enough classics in the short period of time to forever be one of Dre's top teams. Unlike his current collaborations that still can't produce anything really dope even after more than 10 years.....
But it's hilarious how you trying to say The Documentary was still the hottest shit ever with Dre still being in his prime with no signs of slowing down, and The Big Bang and TBCT both already were outdated when they were released, despite coming out just a year after that and sounding more advanced. It doesn't work like that, some time needs to pass before someone's style becomes outdated, unless something major happens.
Kanye and Wayne music revolution didn't start until late 2007, so there were no fundamental changes in hip hop between 2005 and 2006.
First of all i want to appriciate the way you discuss, i feel hyped to discuss with you, i feel glad to have you in this forum.
Secondly, i will edit this post and will answer you soon. But i wanted to thank you first.
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goodyoung is discussing the right way
:salute:
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Bro did you just put a masterpiece that is Goldmine in there???
While I agree that the rest of the songs you mentioned weren't great, and that 30 something Jay's joint always been wack, you're clearly cherrypicking the worst songs that came out from that era. Why don't you post Get You Some, Don't Get Carried Away, Imagine, Get Low, Outta Control remix, Boss' Life, Deja Vu, Crack A bottle (say what you what about the song, but the beat is crazy), In The Chetto, Cocaina, Minority Report, Lost One, Stay Wide Awake etc etc etc?
It's like if I was arguing that his 2001 team was wack and posted Choke me spank me, Take the heat, Rain Man, Not Today, Ass like that, Just lose it and Push play to prove my point.
sure they did a few good tracks. but overall they have ups and downs. they don't have a standart at all.
get you some and don't get carried away are dope songs but it doesnt match busta and yeah rap was changing already. that dre formula was not interesting anymore. the last time it made sense was the game's album because he was representing west coast gangsta shit.
rain man, ass like that, just lose it are wack thats why i hate encore :) dre already lost his way those days. all these encore songs u mentioned have mark batson in the team :) thanks for correcting me.
did u say push play? it was 2002 and people were complaining that beat is used for only an intro but not a full length song. if anybody hates push play he or she must be a west coast hip hop hater. come on, please go listen to the track like its 2002 again and tell me you are not nodding your head unconsciously. but if dre would use the same beat for eminem in 2009 in relapse i would be still standing at the same place to call it wrong artist, wrong year and outdated. am i clear with this example?
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I'd say his 2001 team was more consistent, while his 2006 team was uneven and had higher highs and lower lows. In the span of 7 years, the only wack contributions Elizondo/Scott/Mel-Man had made were Truth Hurts album, 2 Eve tracks on her second album, Mary's Not Today, a few Em records from Encore and TES and the shit they did for Man vs Machine.
Mark/Dawaun made some of the best Dre music ever that's better than the most of what he did with his previous team (the entirety of The Big Bang and their contribution to TBCT), with Imagine being the pinnacle of it all and a strong contender for top 5 Dre beats of all time. But they're also responsible for 30 something, Trouble, 50's Fire, Stat Quo's Here we go, with Fire being the first time I've ever heard a Dre beat and thought "Wow, that was really bad". And their team been active for only 3 years. They've done more than enough classics in the short period of time to forever be one of Dre's top teams. Unlike his current collaborations that still can't produce anything really dope even after more than 10 years.....
But it's hilarious how you trying to say The Documentary was still the hottest shit ever with Dre still being in his prime with no signs of slowing down, and The Big Bang and TBCT both already were outdated when they were released, despite coming out just a year after that and sounding more advanced. It doesn't work like that, some time needs to pass before someone's style becomes outdated, unless something major happens.
Kanye and Wayne music revolution didn't start until late 2007, so there were no fundamental changes in hip hop between 2005 and 2006.
west coast hip hop was about to fall already, rap was changing, the documentary made west coast fans on the west coast and all around the world feel hyped. that was like a "one last time" album at the right time for both dr. dre and west coast. also 50 cent was fucking hot and he gave a few tracks of him with hooks can go mainstream. kanye and timbaland gave one of their best beats for that album. nate dogg spit one of his best hooks for the album. featurings were also dope from eminem to busta rhymes. but as i said rap game was changing.
2001 team did lots of good stuff for eminem show. do you know mel-man did the drum programming for say goodbye to hollywood? ron feemster played keyboards for "when the music stops". mike elizondo played the bass for soldier and say goodbye to hollywood. business and my dads gone crazy were fillers but they were fucking good fillers like they supposed to be. eve tracks were dope as i remember, satisfaction, what, let me blow your mind were great tracks. as i said this team dominated hip hop and charts for 6 years. you might like mark batson/dawaun parker team but they dominated nothing. its just up to your personal taste, we cant say they were succesful on dominating and inspiring. we are talking about fillers they did. i wasn't a fan of dre tracks on man vs machine by the way. he gave his weakest beats to xzibit for that album unfortunately. but they were not outdated. they were just not good enough. you remember the man vs machine leftover "black rabbit", that should have made it to the album instead other tracks.
you think 1 year is not a long time for a change? even things change in 24 hours. remember dr. dre did last nwa album on 91 and one year later he came up with g-funk.
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Then on MMLP you got tracks like "Brainless" which is actually like an update of the Slim Shady LP classic "Brain Damage" and is as good or better than that classic song.
What????? How could you even compare those two songs. Ems flow was so fluid and natural on SSLP while telling an amazing story filled with multis effortlessly. Brain damage is a masterclass in song writing that track should be studied
Brainless he’s doing the yelling rap and nowhere near the fluid flow he had on brain damage. Dope track overall but nowhere near even the worst song on SSLP.
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west coast hip hop was about to fall already, rap was changing, the documentary made west coast fans on the west coast and all around the world feel hyped. that was like a "one last time" album at the right time for both dr. dre and west coast. also 50 cent was fucking hot and he gave a few tracks of him with hooks can go mainstream. kanye and timbaland gave one of their best beats for that album. nate dogg spit one of his best hooks for the album. featurings were also dope from eminem to busta rhymes. but as i said rap game was changing.
2001 team did lots of good stuff for eminem show. do you know mel-man did the drum programming for say goodbye to hollywood? ron feemster played keyboards for "when the music stops". mike elizondo played the bass for soldier and say goodbye to hollywood. business and my dads gone crazy were fillers but they were fucking good fillers like they supposed to be. eve tracks were dope as i remember, satisfaction, what, let me blow your mind were great tracks. as i said this team dominated hip hop and charts for 6 years. you might like mark batson/dawaun parker team but they dominated nothing. its just up to your personal taste, we cant say they were succesful on dominating and inspiring. we are talking about fillers they did. i wasn't a fan of dre tracks on man vs machine by the way. he gave his weakest beats to xzibit for that album unfortunately. but they were not outdated. they were just not good enough. you remember the man vs machine leftover "black rabbit", that should have made it to the album instead other tracks.
you think 1 year is not a long time for a change? even things change in 24 hours. remember dr. dre did last nwa album on 91 and one year later he came up with g-funk.
Dre didn’t just suddenly come up with g funk out of nowhere it was a slow progression. You can hear hints of it on DOC album like on The Formula and NWA 2nd album also had some early signs of g funk as well. Also keep in mind Erick Sermon was sampling old p funk records which would lead to g funk as well also can’t forget about Above The Law.
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Dre didn’t just suddenly come up with g funk out of nowhere it was a slow progression. You can hear hints of it on DOC album like on The Formula and NWA 2nd album also had some early signs of g funk as well. Also keep in mind Erick Sermon was sampling old p funk records which would lead to g funk as well also can’t forget about Above The Law.
right. i agree. but it was still called reality rap era. some songs had jazz samples, some had funk samples, some had rock sample. it was a mixture. suddenly we met somthing called "g-funk" and it started to rule the world.
in 2005 when "documentary" album was making a good farewell to industry in the name for west coast, kanye was rising with something fucking new and inspiring. lil wayne got a place with carter 2 and artists like young jeezy was a sign of "trap is coming". rakim even left aftermath because he saw dr. dre beats will not take him anywhere and he doesnt want to rap "gangsta rap" as dre asked him to do. content was changing either.
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What????? How could you even compare those two songs. Ems flow was so fluid and natural on SSLP while telling an amazing story filled with multis effortlessly. Brain damage is a masterclass in song writing that track should be studied
Brainless he’s doing the yelling rap and nowhere near the fluid flow he had on brain damage. Dope track overall but nowhere near even the worst song on SSLP.
only thing similar to each other between brain damage and brainless is "brain" word. ;D
but he is not yelling at brainless like he did in other songs from mmlp2. he raps in "the way i am" tone and "kim" vibe more. his rapping style in brainless reminds me mmlp album. this is a song for who are eminem fans before recovery with it's production and rap.
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brainless bein better than brain damage would be the worst take ive ever heard if i didn't once hear someone say that dr dre's production was the weakness of relapse lol
and that's comin from someone who thought mmlp2 was a dope album and brainless was actually one of my favorites on there
but brain damage is a timeless classic .. it's not even close to being close
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What????? How could you even compare those two songs. Ems flow was so fluid and natural on SSLP while telling an amazing story filled with multis effortlessly. Brain damage is a masterclass in song writing that track should be studied
Brainless he’s doing the yelling rap and nowhere near the fluid flow he had on brain damage. Dope track overall but nowhere near even the worst song on SSLP.
Yeah, true.. when you consider the storytelling, that was some of the best storytelling the music business has ever seen. "Brain Damage" is a classic, and "Brainless" is a banger but not on the classic level of "Brian Damage".
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brainless bein better than brain damage would be the worst take ive ever heard if i didn't once hear someone say that dr dre's production was the weakness of relapse lol
and that's comin from someone who thought mmlp2 was a dope album and brainless was actually one of my favorites on there
but brain damage is a timeless classic .. it's not even close to being close
agreed
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only thing similar to each other between brain damage and brainless is "brain" word. ;D
but he is not yelling at brainless like he did in other songs from mmlp2. he raps in "the way i am" tone and "kim" vibe more. his rapping style in brainless reminds me mmlp album. this is a song for who are eminem fans before recovery with it's production and rap.
good point.. and homie, they are more alike then you think. "Brainless" also contains effective story telling, and not only that the story isn't that much different than the story on "Brain Damage". It alludes to bullying and also to his mother and having a dysfunctional family, and to have been a bit off as a result of trauma in his youth.
He probably could've titled it "Brain Damage 2" and that would've been dope but it wouldn't have fit the theme of MMLP2 since the track was on SSLP and not MMLP.
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infinite is being super disingenuous, as usual
he nitpicks the positive reviews on recovery and nitpicks the negative reviews on relapse to try to paint it as recovery being better received
he thinks the viewers of the threads are retarded and can't just go back and read ALL the comments, which shows relapse getting about 70% positive feedback while recovery has about 70% negative feedback
fake shit
i don't get down wit that
It's no secret. That's exactly what I was searching for. If someone wants to do their own search, then be my guest. I didn't claim my theory was correct, I am doing my own research. If you don't like my research then you take 4 hours out of your day and do your own research. But you can't do that because you actually have family and a social life.
It's pretty simple what I'm doing and I make no bones about it. I'm doing real Scientific Research (not fake spinning ball globe or Coward-19 Research) but real Scientific Method. Following the 5 Steps you learned in your 6th Grade Science Class:
RELAPSE ALBUM
1. QUESTION/IDEA: Sccit posed the idea that HEADZ liked/loved Relapse when it dropped.
2. MY HYPOTHESIS: My hypothesis is that many HEADZ at the forum hated Relapse when it dropped and dissed it on here.
3. PERFORM THE EXPERIMENT: Bump the old thread and search for posts of HEADZ dissing the fucc out of Relapse.
4. DATA: I found many posts of HEADZ dissing the fucc out of Relapse.
5. CONCLUSION: Many HEADZ at the forum did not like Relapse and dissed the fucc out of it when it was released.
^^That's my mutherfuccin research that I did, if you don't like my research or think you would like to perform a different search then be my fuccin guest. But good luck finding 4 hours of your day to burn through providing quality research to the members of the forum as I have done. You guys should be thanking me.
RECOVERY ALBUM
1. QUESTION/IDEA: Sccit posed the idea on here that pop fans liked Recovery but not the HEADZ at the forum.
2. HYPOTHESIS: My hypothesis is that I can find many headz at the forum that liked Recovery when it dropped.
3. EXPERIMENT: I bumped the o.g thread and performed a search to find HEADZ who liked the Recovery album.
4. DATA: I found many HEADZ here who liked the Recovery album when it dropped.
5. CONCLUSION: There were actually many HEADZ here at the forum who liked the Recovery album when it dropped, so it wasn't just the pop fans pushing the narrative.
^^If you don't like the reasearch I've done and think it was inconclusive then you can do your own fuccin research. I provided the fuccin evidence for anybody to view and draw their own fuccin conclusion if they don't like mine. Perform your own research, be my guest. But really, you all should be thanking me.
relapse was received wayyyyy better by fans
it's not even close
You sure about that? Let's do the research, we have the two threads bumped. The Relapse thread and the Recovery thread. Let's check and see if it is true that Relapse was received WAAAAAAAAAAAAY better by fans...
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sure they did a few good tracks. but overall they have ups and downs. they don't have a standart at all.
get you some and don't get carried away are dope songs but it doesnt match busta and yeah rap was changing already. that dre formula was not interesting anymore. the last time it made sense was the game's album because he was representing west coast gangsta shit.
rain man, ass like that, just lose it are wack thats why i hate encore :) dre already lost his way those days. all these encore songs u mentioned have mark batson in the team :) thanks for correcting me.
did u say push play? it was 2002 and people were complaining that beat is used for only an intro but not a full length song. if anybody hates push play he or she must be a west coast hip hop hater. come on, please go listen to the track like its 2002 again and tell me you are not nodding your head unconsciously. but if dre would use the same beat for eminem in 2009 in relapse i would be still standing at the same place to call it wrong artist, wrong year and outdated. am i clear with this example?
"Few great tracks" is like 80% of all of their music they made with Dre. Only around 1/5 of their music was wack/mediocre.
Sorry it doesn't make any sense... How exactly are these don't match Busta? He sounds perfect on them, the production matches his voice and flows. And he sounds more mature on TBB than he usually does, so yeah it isn't a typical goofy Busta style, but that was intentional.
Again, The Documentary came out in 2005, the Big Bang came out in 2006 - there were no major shifts in hip hop during that time for Dre production to lose it's value and uniqueness, so I genuinely can't see how Dre beats were no longer "making sense" just a year after his last output.
His main guy during Encore days still was Mike tho.
I bop my head uncontrollably to any Dre beat ;) Including a fucking Big Weenie and Choke me lol. Doesn't mean those are dope songs, it's just something about their catchiness. Push Play is a cool beat, but nothing remarkable about that one imo and it wasn't up to usual Dre standards (X, Fight Music, Break Ya neck etc etc)
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It’s nothing like that actually. Dre released 2001 after. Eminem hasn’t released a single classic album since Eminem Show
2001 is good but compared to detox its overrated and bland. recovery is better than eminem show, em show is half filler but has some of his best songs ever on there. recovery is the better album on a whole with only a few terrible songs like so bad, untitled, cinderella man.
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MMLP2 and Bad Meetz Evil EP spectacular
And tracks like "Guts Over Fear" that were recorded years after Relapse—I consider to be one of Eminem's top 5 greatest songs of his whole career. Then on MMLP you got tracks like "Brainless" which is actually like an update of the Slim Shady LP classic "Brain Damage" and is as good or better than that classic song. I also thought that "Stronger Than I Was" might be the best song he ever did about Kim, and tracks "Legacy" is also a great song.
castle is his only good song post recovery, probably cuz dj khalil produced it. em just doesnt sound good or make good music with producers outside of the mid 2000s detox crew. sadly is the case for all prime era aftermath artists, none of them have ever gotten any good beats or made more than a few good songs after leaving/moving on from that team. em, 50, game, bishop, busta, kendrick, raekwon, joell etc. they all suffered the same fate a crazy decline in quality.
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2001 is good but compared to detox its overrated and bland. recovery is better than eminem show, em show is half filler but has some of his best songs ever on there. recovery is the better album on a whole with only a few terrible songs like so bad, untitled, cinderella man.
lol you're insane
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2001 is good but compared to detox its overrated and bland. recovery is better than eminem show, em show is half filler but has some of his best songs ever on there. recovery is the better album on a whole with only a few terrible songs like so bad, untitled, cinderella man.
you got a link for Detox?
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"Few great tracks" is like 80% of all of their music they made with Dre. Only around 1/5 of their music was wack/mediocre.
Sorry it doesn't make any sense... How exactly are these don't match Busta? He sounds perfect on them, the production matches his voice and flows. And he sounds more mature on TBB than he usually does, so yeah it isn't a typical goofy Busta style, but that was intentional.
Again, The Documentary came out in 2005, the Big Bang came out in 2006 - there were no major shifts in hip hop during that time for Dre production to lose it's value and uniqueness, so I genuinely can't see how Dre beats were no longer "making sense" just a year after his last output.
His main guy during Encore days still was Mike tho.
I bop my head uncontrollably to any Dre beat ;) Including a fucking Big Weenie and Choke me lol. Doesn't mean those are dope songs, it's just something about their catchiness. Push Play is a cool beat, but nothing remarkable about that one imo and it wasn't up to usual Dre standards (X, Fight Music, Break Ya neck etc etc)
1- what are the worldwide hits made by this so called strongest team? i want to hear.
2- gangsta rap/mafioso rap was about to die, the last mainstream gangsta rap album was documentary. also butsa is a new york rapper with his own style. 2005 dr.dre-scott storch-50 cent type of music matched the game, but 2006 dr. dre-mark batson type of music didnt math busta. it didnt match eminem either. it happened same with anderson paak,he let dr. dre to get involved too much with oxnard and it failed. because it didnt match paak. then paak made "ventura" by himself and it became succesful.since documentary dr. dre lost his way and couldnt find it yet.
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First of all i want to appriciate the way you discuss, i feel hyped to discuss with you, i feel glad to have you in this forum.
goodyoung is discussing the right way
:salute:
(https://iili.io/3t3hKZB.png)
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1- what are the worldwide hits made by this so called strongest team? i want to hear.
2- gangsta rap/mafioso rap was about to die, the last mainstream gangsta rap album was documentary. also butsa is a new york rapper with his own style. 2005 dr.dre-scott storch-50 cent type of music matched the game, but 2006 dr. dre-mark batson type of music didnt math busta. it didnt match eminem either. it happened same with anderson paak,he let dr. dre to get involved too much with oxnard and it failed. because it didnt match paak. then paak made "ventura" by himself and it became succesful.since documentary dr. dre lost his way and couldnt find it yet.
1 - I never said anything about worldwide hits, just that the music they made together was great for the most part. I know they weren't dominating the charts like his 2001 team, but this discussion was never about the commercial success.
2 - "was about to die" isn't the same as "was dead and forgotten". It didn't die until late 2007, and 2006 had TBCT and DA, both pure west coast gangsta rap albums and both were met with positive reviews and were successful. It wasn't until Kanye came up with Graduation and killed it.
I'm still waiting for you to explain how exactly Dre type production didn't match Busta in 2006. Bus wasn't rapping with his usual wacky style on the big bang, he was much more mature on that record than before (and after, if we being honest), so this type of Dre prod matched his new vibe just fine. And Busta himself considers it his best album, so...
Btw I thought Black Rabbit was a Restless leftover. I remember it was mentioned as one of the tracks Dre and X did for Restless in some interview...
Agree about Oxnard, but it's not the same situation. Oxnard had a problem similar to most of post-Compton Dre productions - too many things happenning at once, overproduced to hell, not sounding like a Dre beat etc etc. TBB didn't have none of these problems, it came out when that type of production was still hot.
Look at the reception to both: Dre-produced songs on Oxnard are usually regarded as the weakest parts of the album, while on TBB, Relapse, TBCT Dre beats are described as highlights.
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2001 is good but compared to detox its overrated and bland. recovery is better than eminem show, em show is half filler but has some of his best songs ever on there. recovery is the better album on a whole with only a few terrible songs like so bad, untitled, cinderella man.
You still ain't tired of cosplaying as someone who has heard Detox?
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lol you're insane
Keep in mind this guy once said Under Pressure leak was better than Keep their heads ringin
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Keep in mind this guy once said Under Pressure leak was better than Keep their heads ringin
it was dr prescription and yes it is way better. i like dre as a concept rapper more than a gangster rapper. for context the watcher 1, message n few others are what i consider concept songs by dre, much better than anything on chronic 1 and 2001. concept dre was what we were gonna get on detox. i need a doctor is hated on alot but its still a better rap verse by dre than chronic imo. i know 99% will disagree but they havent heard dre rapping on a higher level like he was on detox so i can see why it wouldnt make sense to most people. if u ask any of the og detox producers this same question they will say the same. dre wasnt on some lupe black thought shit but he was very lyrical on detox.
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You still ain't tired of cosplaying as someone who has heard Detox?
any and all info ive given or said about detox can be easily proven if u speak to anyone from the og detox crew. i dont need to cosplay as some who heard it when i prolly have more songs than chad kiser does. he only has a early 09 copy of detox. not stuff from the final 2011 version before detox was officially scrapped forever. not gonna leak songs or snippets just to prove i have some mp3s lol.
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So I went back and listened to Relapse Revovery and MMLP2 and bro it’s not even close. Relapse with the Refill tracks is better than both of those albums by far. Dre’s production was a near his peak and Em is still rapping his butt off. Flow is still there he still had rhythm and soul
Recovery. Some good tracks here but the sound has drastically shifted. I think around this time Eminem was killed and cloned and we got a completely new artist. Honestly he should have another name as an artist from this point on because it’s like two completely separate artists and careers
MMLP2. I like the replay value for this album better than Recovery. I like the old school rap rock thing Rick Rubin was doing for the production and beastie boy Eminem flow is better than the other yelling flow with no rhythm but this album really shouldn’t have been called mmlp2. I think looking at it as a sequel just creates unnecessary expectations and then you are automatically disappointed whereas if it had a different title we’d just be happy it was better than recovery and say Em is back!!
Unfortunately the worst Em followed this with Revival which to me only had 1 good track.
The albums following this were better but still missing that special intangible quality that made em em
Think his sobriety streak has something to do with this.
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any and all info ive given or said about detox can be easily proven if u speak to anyone from the og detox crew. i dont need to cosplay as some who heard it when i prolly have more songs than chad kiser does. he only has a early 09 copy of detox. not stuff from the final 2011 version before detox was officially scrapped forever. not gonna leak songs or snippets just to prove i have some mp3s lol.
Except you never posted any real info, all you do is simply praise wack ass tracks and leaks like Curtis' Fire and under pressure and call them shits experimental and better songs than Chronic. There's nothing to ask people from his og Detox crew to verify here, you're simply giving your opinions, no info. Ironically your attempts to hype up Detox have an opposite effect, if Detox was something up to your taste everyone would feel grateful to Dre for not putting this out...
And also I think you don't really understand what "experimental" means, because none of those songs were that.
not gonna leak songs or snippets just to prove i have some mp3s lol.
Lol oh sure sure course you won't
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it was dr prescription and yes it is way better. i like dre as a concept rapper more than a gangster rapper. for context the watcher 1, message n few others are what i consider concept songs by dre, much better than anything on chronic 1 and 2001. concept dre was what we were gonna get on detox. i need a doctor is hated on alot but its still a better rap verse by dre than chronic imo. i know 99% will disagree but they havent heard dre rapping on a higher level like he was on detox so i can see why it wouldnt make sense to most people. if u ask any of the og detox producers this same question they will say the same. dre wasnt on some lupe black thought shit but he was very lyrical on detox.
And crazy ass takes like this is exactly why no one takes what you say seriously
If you think some of the wackest shit ever like Mr Prescription is better than classics like Keep their heads ringing I honestly don't think anyone would feel sorry that Detox was scrapped if it was up to your liking. Shit would've been worse than Dre beats on Oxnard lol
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Except you never posted any real info, all you do is simply praise wack ass tracks and leaks like Curtis' Fire and under pressure and call them shits experimental and better songs than Chronic. There's nothing to ask people from his og Detox crew to verify here, you're simply giving your opinions, no info. Ironically your attempts to hype up Detox have an opposite effect, if Detox was something up to your taste everyone would feel grateful to Dre for not putting this out...
And also I think you don't really understand what "experimental" means, because none of those songs were that.Lol oh sure sure course you won't
ive given alot of info and corrected alot of fake news over the years but not really my problem if people refuse to believe it. the actual first single ft jayz info came from me but whatever u got it. ill go back to listening to that dre jay slim the mobster sly khalil weed classic. too bad you'll never hear the dre game snoop sly just blaze joint from that iconic 09 pic either. dre n game made a classic on dope, u can listen to the ti version tho lol. dre kobe khalil kingdom come from 08 a instant classic too. i can keep going with countless real songs u can ask these guys if they exist or not but what do the actual producers and writers of these songs know about lmao.
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ive given alot of info and corrected alot of fake news over the years but not really my problem if people refuse to believe it. the actual first single ft jayz info came from me but whatever u got it. ill go back to listening to that dre jay slim the mobster sly khalil weed classic. too bad you'll never hear the dre game snoop sly just blaze joint from that iconic 09 pic either. dre n game made a classic on dope, u can listen to the ti version tho lol. dre kobe khalil kingdom come from 08 a instant classic too. i can keep going with countless real songs u can ask these guys if they exist or not but what do the actual producers and writers of these songs know about lmao.
that's cool and all, but none of the leaks we heard comes close to 2001 and saying mr prescription is better than keep their heads ringing is blasphemy